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Thread: Skyline Drive: First Time a Victim of Anti-Motorcycle Bias

  1. #16
    Proud Veteran SteveAikens's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockbottom View Post
    OK, I faxed this:

    I am writing to express my concern about an incident that occurred on Skyline Drive the morning of November 2. .... For about a mile, I'd been a hundred to hundred and fifty yards behind a park ranger.
    Unfortunately, this fell on deaf ears. "A" park ranger certainly isn't specific enough to even have a clue *who* that park ranger was.

    If it were me - and it actually was some time back going through Yellowstone, not exactly the same but very close - I would [and did] ask the ranger his name, write it down, then ask to speak to his supervisor. As is the case with law enforcement, they are REQUIRED to contact their supervisor for you to voice your complaint.

    Someone already said when things like this happen, the WILL happen again if you allow it without filing a complaint.
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  2. #17
    Old man in the mountains osbornk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveAikens View Post
    Unfortunately, this fell on deaf ears. "A" park ranger certainly isn't specific enough to even have a clue *who* that park ranger was.

    Someone already said when things like this happen, the WILL happen again if you allow it without filing a complaint.
    I once wrote a complaint letter to the Virginia State Police when I observed a trooper treating another motorist unfairly. I didn't get enough information on the trooper to identify him specifically but I provided them with the interstate mile marker along with the day and time of the incident. They sent a Sargent from the State Police 40 miles to my home to personally interview me about the incident.
    'You can say what you want about the South, but I almost never hear of anyone wanting to retire to the North.

  3. #18
    Proud Veteran SteveAikens's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by osbornk View Post
    I once wrote a complaint letter to the Virginia State Police when I observed a trooper treating another motorist unfairly. I didn't get enough information on the trooper to identify him specifically but I provided them with the interstate mile marker along with the day and time of the incident. They sent a Sargent from the State Police 40 miles to my home to personally interview me about the incident.
    "State Police" and Federal Park Ranger are two entirely different agencies, of two very different in size and how they handle "unspecified" complaints. With near 35 years Federal and Military experience, I can tell you no one in National Park Service is going to go the extra mile on a complaint like this.

    However, I certainly applaud VSP for following up. The sad part is, that's the exception - not the rule.
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  4. #19
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveAikens View Post
    "State Police" and Federal Park Ranger are two entirely different agencies, of two very different in size and how they handle "unspecified" complaints. With near 35 years Federal and Military experience, I can tell you no one in National Park Service is going to go the extra mile on a complaint like this.

    However, I certainly applaud VSP for following up. The sad part is, that's the exception - not the rule.
    Painting with a rather broad brush.............
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  5. #20
    Registered User David13's Avatar
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    I'd let it go.
    Of course, with writing a letter and all the subsequent investigation, and writings, and interviews, and probably plenty of overtime, you may feel you 'made a difference', but I don't think you ever will.
    I think all you may do is engage their system of "rigamarole" which keeps them busy, rather than just getting paid to sit around, or keeps them from doing other things, like harassing other cyclists, true, but comes to no different end.
    The guy still does the same for the next 14 years til he gets his 20 and out, or 30 and out, with pension, and benefits, etc., etc., etc.
    And merely chuckles about your complaint.
    I was stopped last month also. And much the same. A lecture and all that, and questioning, which I saw more as a curiosity and friendliness. He was smiling all the time he talked to me. And if he had seen me at the gas station and talked I would gladly have talked to him for an hour.
    And when he told me about the accidents, and deaths from deer strikes, I told him about some nearby ones he didn't know about, and I agreed, and said, oh, I know how dangerous it is.
    I would have stayed and talked to him longer, but he then left. I suppose he felt he "had to get back to work".
    In Colorado in May I had a road construction supervisor lady chew me out real good about sort of by-passing the construction zone. I like to talk to people. Sometimes I like to just listen and agree.
    And it left me chuckling.
    dc

  6. #21
    MOA #24991 Pauls1150's Avatar
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    It's another case of a 5-foot cop with a 6-foot badge. He used his "color of authority" to harass you (which is illegal) and to discriminate against you (which is also illegal). He was also trying to get you to say something that would be self-incriminating, thus giving him cause to cuff you while he tossed your bags.

    Note that these guys will pick on lone travelers - not couples or groups. Been there done that, as have several of my friends.

    RockB handled it well; I've also found (like David) that chatting right back seems to throw them off course. Play innocent + ignorant, ask dumb questions right back. It doesn't avoid the [silly] hassle in the first place, but it defuses it sufficiently. Still an unnecessary P.I.T.A.

  7. #22
    Motorcyclist patiodadio's Avatar
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    Good for you for writing that letter, who knows, it just might help some poor motorcyclist like me when that same "park ranger" sees me go by on the BRP or Skyline Drive. Thanks, and good for you.



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  8. #23
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    Skyline-Drive-First-Time-a-Victim

    Good for you for writing! Wave your flag proudly. I, for one, am sick and tired of the "I want to be a police man" mentality, often accompanied by the attitude that the Rangers think that somehow "they" own the National Parks. All the US citizens own the parks. I blame the Park Service Law Enforcement for allowing their officers to act in what is clearly not within the law. They know what is going on out there. In 40+ years of riding on the northern end of the Blue Ridge Parkway, I have seen a lot first hand. I was recently pulled for not giving a turn signal pulling out of a Overlook and treated like a criminal. Well, after all, I guess that since I was guilty of such an infraction, I was a criminal. Pretty petty, but I think "BooBoo" wanted to call his mother and tell her that he had "another one". Once, I was told to leave where I was sitting on the side of the Parkway, at a beautiful spot, legally parked way more than 3' from the road. Clearly not legal to make someone move from a public area. I have learned a lot about traffic laws and our Constitution since. I have the greatest respect for real law enforcement, but also the greatest disdain for the ignorant ones and the young beginners who have absolutely no business being turned loose on the public. Too bad that you cannot tell the difference between the two types. How do you handle the fact that by law, they can lie to you but, you are not supposed to lie to them?
    Did none of his training or none of his superiors tell him that it is none of his business where you were going? Keep waving that flag until your arms just about fall off. To the people that say "let it go", they are part of the problem and the reason that we have arrived to where you were illegally pulled and where the Ranger thought there was nothing wrong in the way that he was doing his job. Had he worked in the private sector, he would have been fired for making his company look like a bunch of fools.
    Charlie

  9. #24
    OldBMWMaster JDOCKERY132445's Avatar
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    cops are people

    And just like people, you will find some that are above board and treat everyone well and others who are first class pricks. I have been stopped so many times that I lost count years ago; but my attorney can tell you that he has been paid for 26 cases.

    I try to treat difficult members of the law enforcement community like difficult people everywhere. Don't provoke them. Don't challenge them. Engage them in a friendly way. If you are cited, call your attorney. But if they are clearly there to dick you around, get a supervisor on the scene immediately. I am retired now; but formerly taught at the Criminal Justice Academy in Columbia, SC. There have been cases where an officers encounter with me ended up with the officer standing in front of his/her supervisor. I never used my status to escape from a ticket; but would use it to correct an abuse.

    Remember, the officer is often alone and potential danger is his/her constant companion. Treat the good ones well and report the bad ones AFTER you have left the presence of the officer. Arguing with someone who has a badge and a gun is just stupid.
    Jerry Dockery
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  10. #25
    OldBMWMaster JDOCKERY132445's Avatar
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    Of course

    Quote Originally Posted by rockbottom View Post
    Was there a course on policing up passed out frat boys from Five Points?
    The tactic depended on what kind of resistance was encountered. The preference was to hold them for the campus police. Once they were in their custody, the Dean of Student Affairs, Dennis Pruitt, would deal with them on an individual basis. All were required to attend workshops on responsible behavior and required to do community service. Most would prefer to go to jail and let Daddy take care of it. Once they had this strike on their campus record, they were made aware that ANY other violation would end their academic career.
    Jerry Dockery
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    1996 R1100RT main bike & 1985 K100RS...too fast to believe.

  11. #26
    Motorcyclist patiodadio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDOCKERY132445 View Post
    Treat the good ones well and report the bad ones AFTER you have left the presence of the officer. Arguing with someone who has a badge and a gun is just stupid.
    + 1 on that and well said !




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  12. #27
    Benchwrenching PGlaves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 13278 View Post
    Had he worked in the private sector, he would have been fired for making his company look like a bunch of fools.
    Charlie
    I have become endlessly tired of this crock of crap cliche. Hasn't anybody ever had to deal with security guards at a mall, a stadium, or an industrial plant? They are far worse than most any public sworn officer I have ever run into.
    Last edited by PGlaves; 11-11-2013 at 01:32 AM.
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  13. #28
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDOCKERY132445 View Post
    I have been stopped so many times that I lost count years ago; but my attorney can tell you that he has been paid for 26 cases.
    Excuse me, I'm only 54, so I might be a bit of a novice, but how is it humanly possible to have 26 court appearances? I've been in a court room twice in my life, once for a friends naturalization ceremony and the other time was for my wedding.
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  14. #29
    Proud Veteran SteveAikens's Avatar
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    Exactly. You know what you all said - and who I'm talking to.... If it's you, we agree. If you don't think it's you - then don't read this far.
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  15. #30
    Survivor akbeemer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDOCKERY132445 View Post
    I have been stopped so many times that I lost count years ago; but my attorney can tell you that he has been paid for 26 cases.
    Wow!!! If for no other reason, you should be careful not to violate any traffic laws simply because you are too easy to catch.
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