Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 41

Thread: Experiences with an HES

  1. #16
    2UP RIDER snookers's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Southwest of Beamsville
    Posts
    160
    Deisel yoda.....how did I know for sure you ask?

    Actually....for me it was a process of elimination....the age of the bike and being the second owner with knowledge of its service history......I have a new fuel pump in the tank......and could hear it running when the key was turned to the ON position.....so fuel delivery was most likely not an issue......
    secondly.....the bike had been cutting out on me periodically.....with no apparent reason.....thirdly and most importantly......I have been reading posts on this site for quite some time now and figured it was just a matter of time before it was my turn..
    BTW.....I wouldn't consider anything else but a new part for replacement
    2000 R1100RT
    Niagara BMW Riders #298

    BMWMCO #45

  2. #17
    Registered User dieselyoda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Winnipeg, MB, Canada
    Posts
    568

    You just knew, I love it.

    I could have guessed a ton of other stuff and some not fun to consider. My first thought would be the ignition coil based on heat. I even went so far as to cook my ECM in the oven to see if it could be an issue. I wasn't concerned about a frozen ECM, who'd get on a bike at -40C? In my experience, frozen ECM's could make you crazy and in the shop, the damn crap ran fine.

    Good for you. You kept it simple and didn't second guess yourself. That's awesome to hear.

    As to new parts, I could tell stories......once, we had to lift the cab off a zoom-boom to change the alternator, about 15 hours R&R. Boosted the batteries, went dead quick. Of course, no charge from this $500.00 new alternator. Customer is now climbing up my @#%&*$ and the alternator rep, says, "Yeah, for sure, the alternator has warranty but the labor is yours." This was a field service call and redoing the job probably didn't cover the cost of fuel, much less that I couldn't go to another job. It's a familiar story in my world.

    A nice story and if you ever hit the Prairies.................
    1997 R1100RT (Restored Basket Case) , 1981 KZ 440 LTD (Restored Basket Case)
    1986 K75S(the beutch), 1993 K1100RS (blown engine), 1997 Chev Short Box (4x4 with an LT1)
    "You can easily judge the character of a man by how he treats those who can do nothing for him."

  3. #18
    Registered User RINTY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta
    Posts
    4,315
    I recall a post a while back by a member who replaced the HES wiring with some special aircraft stuff.

    Given the difficulty of diagnosing this, it seems to me that freshening /upgrading the HES wiring could be a preventative maintenance item, at an appropriate mileage.
    Last edited by RINTY; 08-30-2013 at 02:29 PM.
    Rinty

    "When you don't know where you're going, any road will get you there."

  4. #19
    Pepperfool GSAddict's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Sechelt, British Columbia
    Posts
    1,309
    Teflon aircraft wire and hi temp heatshrink is the fix.
    Hall sensors should be replaced if you really want to 0 time.
    Trouble is, the Hall sensors are obsolete now. Honeywell (Airpax) 2AV54 are no longer made.
    Hard, if not impossible to find

    '
    Ufda happens..........

    It's all about the details.

  5. #20
    Day Dreaming ... happy wanderer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Vancouver, B.C. Canada
    Posts
    1,973
    I've been running one of GSAddict's professionally re-wired HES plates (and he _is_ a pro! ;-)) in my RT for many thousands of miles now with zero issues. The wiring on mine was cooked hard but not cracked open yet at only 23,000 miles or so. Nevertheless I decided to upgrade it _before_ it stranded me like my first one did in the pouring rain in Hope BC, 90 miles from home one fine day! Tow truck bill hurt a fair bit. Live and learn.

    Dieselyoda if you want to read an excellent description of debugging this problem read Paul Glaves article on troubleshooting in the August edition of the Owner News. Starts on page 30 with a fuel line issue and then he describes a classic HES failure. How he got to the bottom of it quickly is some top notch advice.

    The August issue is still online here in digital format for members too but will be gone once the new one is posted.

    http://digital.turn-page.com/title/4865
    MJM - BeeCeeBeemers Motorcycle Club Vancouver B.C.
    '81 R80G/S, '82 R100RS, '00 R1100RT

  6. #21
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ambler, PA
    Posts
    139

    How to tell if the HES is bad

    If the bike cranks but won't start, and you have no spark and you have no spray from an injector, then the HES is bad.
    This can be checked in just a few minutes, by pulling one plug and then one injector.
    In other words, the only common cause that can kill both spark and injection is the HES.
    And furthermore, if you have either spark or injection then the HES is fine.

    Another symptom of bad HES, sometimes, is that the tach needle jumps around like crazy while cranking.
    --
    Doug Raymond
    R1150RT '02
    Ambler, PA

  7. #22
    2UP RIDER snookers's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Southwest of Beamsville
    Posts
    160
    Well we...My bride and I.....just got home last night from a 2100 mile road trip to Virginia Beach after the Finger Lakes Rally in New York.........great ride and no issues......glad the repair was done before we left
    2000 R1100RT
    Niagara BMW Riders #298

    BMWMCO #45

  8. #23
    Registered User roger 04 rt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    1,290
    Quote Originally Posted by DougRaymond View Post
    If the bike cranks but won't start, and you have no spark and you have no spray from an injector, then the HES is bad.
    This can be checked in just a few minutes, by pulling one plug and then one injector.
    In other words, the only common cause that can kill both spark and injection is the HES.
    And furthermore, if you have either spark or injection then the HES is fine.

    Another symptom of bad HES, sometimes, is that the tach needle jumps around like crazy while cranking.
    What happens if one of the Hall sensors is bad but the other is good?

  9. #24
    Pepperfool GSAddict's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Sechelt, British Columbia
    Posts
    1,309
    Quote Originally Posted by Roger 04 RT View Post
    What happens if one of the Hall sensors is bad but the other is good?
    Top sensor bad = no spark signal
    Bottom sensor bad = no fuel injection signal
    '
    Ufda happens..........

    It's all about the details.

  10. #25
    Registered User PAS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    N.E. Ohio
    Posts
    417
    Quote Originally Posted by GSAddict View Post
    Teflon aircraft wire and hi temp heatshrink is the fix.
    Hall sensors should be replaced if you really want to 0 time.
    Trouble is, the Hall sensors are obsolete now. Honeywell (Airpax) 2AV54 are no longer made.
    Hard, if not impossible to find

    When you replace the wire harness, are you still using part of the original wire near the connectors and sensors? If so, dont they have the same bad insulation issues?

  11. #26
    Pepperfool GSAddict's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Sechelt, British Columbia
    Posts
    1,309
    Quote Originally Posted by PAS View Post
    When you replace the wire harness, are you still using part of the original wire near the connectors and sensors? If so, dont they have the same bad insulation issues?
    No, the actual wires coming from the hall sensor have the high temperature rating. The problem is the cable that was added by Bosch to make the assembly.
    '
    Ufda happens..........

    It's all about the details.

  12. #27
    Registered User PAS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    N.E. Ohio
    Posts
    417
    Thanks for clearing that up. I have an 03 RT with just under 20K. I have no idea if there was a cut off point with the harness problem.

  13. #28
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ambler, PA
    Posts
    139
    Quote Originally Posted by GSAddict View Post
    Top sensor bad = no spark signal
    Bottom sensor bad = no fuel injection signal
    Can you tell me where you get that info?
    I have believed, from observations on my own bike, that failure of either HES sensor kills both spark and injection.
    From that I had guessed (only a guess) that the only reason for two sensors was to get more pulses and finer control at low RPM.
    I've never been able to find any official reference to clear this up.

    If necessary I'll disconnect one sensor and see what happens. Have you done this?
    --
    Doug Raymond
    R1150RT '02
    Ambler, PA

  14. #29
    Registered User roger 04 rt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    1,290
    Quote Originally Posted by DougRaymond View Post
    Can you tell me where you get that info?
    I have believed, from observations on my own bike, that failure of either HES sensor kills both spark and injection.
    From that I had guessed (only a guess) that the only reason for two sensors was to get more pulses and finer control at low RPM.
    I've never been able to find any official reference to clear this up.

    If necessary I'll disconnect one sensor and see what happens. Have you done this?
    Ditto, can't find anything in writing. If I have to I will rig some switches.

  15. #30
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    213
    Quote Originally Posted by Roger 04 RT View Post
    Ditto, can't find anything in writing. If I have to I will rig some switches.
    Interesting. Maybe injectors fire at BDC - advance?, Spark fires at TDC - advance ?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •