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Thread: Need fellow members help in emailing BMW executives about my defective bike.

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by 8ninety8 View Post
    If I were BMW, simply out of curiosity for a possible engineering glitch, for the safety and enjoyment of my customers, and finally for corporate image, pay whatever it takes, get the bike back to factory headquarters, tear it down, see what the prob was, then turn it into pop cans. everybody wins, at a corporate cost practically immeasurable, with a shining image intact. Taking care of afew lemons could hardly break the bank? Or am I missing something? Does a new add campaign cost more than satisfying a lemoned customer? and which is more effective advertising? Just sayin.
    At first I was inclined to agree with your point but there is also that possibility that BMW knows the root problem & would rather avoid any semblance of acting like it is agreeable to admitting such? With BMW cars they pay you a $grand for buying back their brand. With the BMWCCA they also have a deal that gives you even more $$$ to but their cars. In the brief time I belonged to the RA they ragged on & on about NA but not that it was an organized bitch just a rant in print there. Might help get some younger members in this club?
    "If I had my life to live over, I'd dare to make more mistakes next time...I'd relax,I'd limber up... I would take fewer things seriously...take more chances... take more trips...climb more mountains...swim more rivers...eat more ice cream." Jorge Luis Borges at age 85.

  2. #77
    Dixie, the land of cotton
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    Thanks Billy, you have the gift of putting down clear thoughts

    Several people asked why I waited 7 years to "demand" a new bike. The answer is that I did not wait. I have been asking for 5 years. It took three years to reach Anthony Cavanaugh. I spoke with the 1-800 customer service employees many times. They were nice but would not pass me up to the next level. I only received a call from Anthony after posting on the Motorrad facebook page asking for help.

    The very first time that I had the bike repaired it was one month before the 3 year factory warranty expired. Most lemon laws state that you must have 3 or more repairs for the same problem during the warranty period. So it would have been difficult to win under the lemon law rules of TN.

    If nothing else good comes out of this at least the members will know how to reach Anthony Cavanaugh(pre-litigation and vehicle buy-back manager). Anthony.cavanaugh@bmwna.com His direct line is 201-263-8215

    Two weeks ago is the first time that BMW declared that "I have a unrepairable and defective bike and the only solution is a new engine". It took seven years for them to admit this and that is why I have started this email and social media campaign at this time.

    You are right, $1,241.17 is an insulting amount of a buy-back offer and that is what got me all fired up and pissed off. If Anthony would have offered normal trade-in value I would have accepted it and bought a new bike and that would have been the end of the story

    I agree that the MOA needs a more powerful voice to be able to influence BMW NA to take a second look at problems when they occur.

    As an example: I talked to the MOA staff 5 years ago and the only solution they had was to put me in touch with the MOA liaison person. I think his name was Jim. Jim was very nice and was kind enough to make a few phone calls for me but Jim admitted that he does not have any power to get anything done.

    So the MOA forum moderators had no clue how to contact BMW. There helpful information was to give me the customer service 1-800 number. Trust me, the customer service reps are very nice but are nothing but talking heads.

    Being a moderator has to require a lot of time and I appreciate them being willing to donate it. The forum would not work without their help.

    It nothing else good comes out of my saga I hope that the forum will demand that the MOA get some "balls" and find out how to make BMW pay attention.

    All right, I am off my soap box and will not be posting any new threads on this subject.

    Thanks for all the positive replies and suggestions. I hope you have a good summer.

  3. #78
    It is what it is. Bud's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kantuckid View Post
    TN limit is $25,000-sue them & move on to the Strom. How can you lose? I wish they were not so tall or I'd be riding one right now!

    If this isn't proof that this club needs to stop being kissy faced with BMWNA & have a consumer advocate person on board, then just ask the OP...

    What is the purpose of the MOA?

    From the articles of incorporation as well as the web site here:

    "Our Mission:

    To foster communication and a sense of family among BMW motorcycle enthusiasts."


    In other words, we are a social organization composed of people who are enthusiastic about BMW motorcycles.

    Seems to be to be a pretty far stretch to turn it into a consumer advocacy board for BMW owners.

    But if that is what members want, they will have to get BOD members elected who share that viewpoint as a start. Then the membership would have to buy into the proposition that our purpose for existing has changed.

    There is nothing that will change the OP's position as he is acting on principal. Several have suggested he take the trade and move on but w/o success.

    I'm 66 and my life is too short to continue to over an object.

    YMMV
    I used to post here, but now I don't.

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by sibud View Post
    ........... Then the membership would have to buy into the proposition that our purpose for existing has changed.

    ...........
    This is one of the better clubs on the planet, no doubt about it. I don't think anyone was proposing to change the purpose of the club. The purpose should remain as is. However, there is nothing wrong with adding some type of consumer advocate so to speak. It would perhaps be beneficial if hundreds of people could be heard at corporate given many of the allegations. If the membership feels otherwise they have every right to say so.

  5. #80
    Ponch ponch1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by billy walker View Post
    This is one of the better clubs on the planet, no doubt about it. I don't think anyone was proposing to change the purpose of the club. The purpose should remain as is. However, there is nothing wrong with adding some type of consumer advocate so to speak. It would perhaps be beneficial if hundreds of people could be heard at corporate given many of the allegations. If the membership feels otherwise they have every right to say so.
    It's called an ombudsman.
    My Motorrad
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  6. #81
    Ozzie Flyer
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    Quote Originally Posted by ponch1 View Post
    It's called an ombudsman.
    Ponch is right, leave it to the pros. That is what they are there for.
    Regards
    Paul
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    BE KIND TO HUMANS... THEY BITE

  7. #82
    It is what it is. Bud's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by billy walker View Post


    Quote Originally Posted by sibud View Post


    ....... Then the membership would have to buy into the proposition that our purpose for existing has changed.

    .............
    This is one of the better clubs on the planet, no doubt about it. I don't think anyone was proposing to change the purpose of the club. The purpose should remain as is. However, there is nothing wrong with adding some type of consumer advocate so to speak. It would perhaps be beneficial if hundreds of people could be heard at corporate given many of the allegations. If the membership feels otherwise they have every right to say so.
    There are two threads on this subject.

    This post by Greg Feeler in the other thread answers this issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by GREGFEELER View Post
    I have been aware of your posts and this topic for some time, so perhaps my comments might help clarify a few points, and to be clear, my comments do not reflect in any way my views of the validity or lack thereof of your complaints.

    The BMW MOA is not the right organization to represent the interests of, or become an advocate for, large numbers of aggrieved owners for several reasons. First, a large number of our members would not want us to take on such a role because it would be in conflict with the often expressed desire by our membership that we work "more closely" with BMW in order to provide more "inside" information, access to promotions and discounts, and more presence by BMW at our events. Secondly, and much more to the point here, such a task is just beyond the scope and purpose of the club. Any group that wants to make their case with a larger international company has to do their homework and have a vast body of hard empirical evidence documenting severe and excessive harm (financial or safety) because of that company's products or services. Documented cases have to be collected and validated and then a statistical basis established to (hopefully) prove some contention. Then negotiations would be opened with the company, and if not resolved by dialog or mediation, then the claimants would have to be prepared for a potentially long and expensive legal battle. Anything less would debase the credibility of their resolve right from the beginning, and greatly reduce their chances for a (to them) satisfactory resolution. Like it or not, in our current litigious society companies believe they must defend themselves against product defect claims to avoid punishing jury awards.

    Clearly - at least to me and every Board of Directors I've served on for the last ten years - such a mission is way outside our mandate as a motorcycle club who's purpose is to build a community of BMW riders. Additionally, to spend club money and resources would be highly divisive since many would not support it. It's for exactly this reasons that we have a formal policy that the MOA is apolitical. We do not get involved in any "motorcycle rights" fight - not because we don't think defending our right to ride is not important. It is - and in my personal opinion highly important. But, there are other organizations specifically dedicated to that fight and those who believe in that mission can and should join them and support their work.

    All of this is not to say that the MOA over the years has not had private discussions with officials at BMW Motorrad USA and BMW AG in Germany about customer satisfaction issues. We have, and on some occasions believe some good was accomplished. But, our goal was not some wholesale admission by BMW of a claimed defect with their products.

    There are a lot of venues for someone to build interest in their cause, and especially so in this age when a web site costs a few dollars a month. However, it would seem very important to identify those options quickly and pursue them rather than, as in this case, rail against the MOA for not doing something for which is is not equipped.
    Then this response from the OP

    Quote Originally Posted by espressoforyou View Post
    I agree with every thing you said.
    Case closed?

    I'm going riding today. Hope everyone else gets a chance to ride as well.
    I used to post here, but now I don't.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by ponch1 View Post
    It's called an ombudsman.
    Yes, you are a better wordsmith than I. Thank you Ponch!

  9. #84
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    BMW Motorrad & Lack of Action

    Been following this debate about Randy's problems with BMW NA with alarmed interest.

    Over here in Oz we do have similar problems, I suspect our Trade Practices Act is tougher than US national laws & state consumer laws. Here we have a "fit for purpose test" and on my reading Randy's bike was never fit for purpose.

    We are a small market for BMW in Australia but there have been a number of BMW owners who never got satisfaction.

    BMW NAs attitude must have something to do with certain other Teutonic manufacturers, ie it's in the culture of the fatherland. In Oz, VW have fought a long, mostly private battle, not to act in a fair and reasonable manner on warranty claims on its Polo, Golf, and lesser, Jetta lines, particularly with EMS and DSG gearboxes. In Melbourne, a woman , travelling on a freeway at 100kph, barely survived a rear end shunt from a B-double truck when her engine management system shut off her motor instantly. as the truckie said, I saw no brake lights.

    Now the matter is well & truly in the spotlight of the " court of current affairs " TV shows, and VW is squirming in the glare of the public spotlight, but apparently still protesting its not a systemic issue worthy of a product recall, despite the volume of complaints

    Maybe that's the answer-go public on consumer affairs TV programs - works here, along with, you guessed it, a face book campaign. Just ask the major retailers here in Oz.

    One final comment on whether MOA should act as an ombudsman for BMW product complaints. If the arrangement between MOA and BMW NA is anything like that between BMW Aust and our "BMW" clubs( cars and bikes ), BMW hold the reins. They control everything, just for the privilege of affiliation, right down to club logos ( no roundel anymore ) and what goes into a newsletter, in return for a few measly accessories for raffles. They are control freaks ( it's known to lawyers as controlling the brand)

    Good luck Randy - more strength to your arm

  10. #85
    Administrator 20774's Avatar
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    Folks, we're going to close this thread since the Original Poster has moved on and opened another on-going thread over here:

    http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/showthre...-the-MOA-forum

    We trying to keep the spreading of similar threads to a minimum here on the forum.

    Thanks...
    Kurt -- Forum Administrator ---> Resources and Links Thread <---
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    mine-ineye-deatheah-pielayah-jooa-kalayus. oolah-minane-hay-meeriah-kal-oyus-algay-a-thaykin', buddy!

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