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Thread: Thoughts on life in Germany

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by billy walker View Post
    America is still a land of opportunity and today we call into remembrance of those that have died for this country. In addition, Mexicans and Cubans die en route in an attempt to get to our great land. And, of course you have who knows how many trying to get here from around the world. We have a statue in a harbor representing our great country. The riding here is amazing as well although perhaps not where you currently live. Many on this forum can lead the way to spectacular good 'ol USA riding. Are you sure you really want to leave America?

    I fully understand your post & opinion. And largely agree. But one thought.... "Mexicans and Cubans die en route in an attempt to get to our great land." One has to ask why?..is it to work hard and experience / achieve the American dream? Or is it because there are so darn many "free" programs just waiting for them to sign up? And what kind of "crap-hole" life are they leaving behind?

    Don't mean to sound so bitter / grumpy...I just look at the whole picture...and not all of it is pretty.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by 71243 View Post
    But one thought.... "Mexicans and Cubans die en route in an attempt to get to our great land." One has to ask why?..is it to work hard and experience / achieve the American dream? Or is it because there are so darn many "free" programs just waiting for them to sign up? And what kind of "crap-hole" life are they leaving behind?

    Don't mean to sound so bitter / grumpy...I just look at the whole picture...and not all of it is pretty.
    Indeed.

    I work with students at the University who were brought to the US as young children, grew up here, went through public schools here, and through intelligence and application have gotten to college. These kids are undocumented, and many have lived here since they were elementary-school age. I've had exposure to their families, who work hard for little money in jobs I wouldn't want, and live in pretty poor facilities. Just like the non-working domestic poor, they attend public schools and use ERs if necessary. One may consider public schools and the ER as "free programs," but it's worth noting that not all who entered illegally are sitting around collecting welfare.

    While I wouldn't say theirs is a great life here, their parents' sneaking in suggests it's better than what they left behind.
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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by 71243 View Post
    I fully understand your post & opinion. And largely agree. But one thought.... "Mexicans and Cubans die en route in an attempt to get to our great land." One has to ask why?..is it to work hard and experience / achieve the American dream? Or is it because there are so darn many "free" programs just waiting for them to sign up? And what kind of "crap-hole" life are they leaving behind?

    Don't mean to sound so bitter / grumpy...I just look at the whole picture...and not all of it is pretty.
    Most of them do work hard, probably harder than many Americans and their working at jobs your typical American is not willing to take. Of course, there are some here for the free programs just like there are some Americans doing the same thing. Being married to a Latina who at one time was also an illegal and kicked out she started out doing factory work (sewing) for crap wages and ended up taking night classes in accounting. Ultimately was able to break free of the factory and bring home some very respectable accounting wages. Has now been a US citizen for almost 35 years. Being married to a Latina also exposes a gringo to exceptionally large families, and although there are a couple of humans you might call garbage the vast majority of the family works their tail off with many being self-employed and working their way into multiple business locations. Most of them performed at crap work but did it long enough and saved enough to get ahead.

    Being a gringo I'm well aware of what "us" gringo's think of Mexicans and Latino's. I have also been criticized by a 2nd generation Italian for marrying out side my "race". Huh? I think the comments made by too many in this country are outrageous and most of the time they probably don't have an accurate grasp of what is going on in the Latin community. I'm probably more liberal than most as I don't get annoyed at people coming over here illegally as long as they are here to work in an honest manner. Not a popular opinion to have but so be it. What gets me angrier than anything else is when folks hire them at sub-standard wages and begin to take advantage of them.

    Yes, I do call it the American dream.

    By the way, the non-pretty picture you refer to includes many born-in-America folks. Bernie Madoff just may be an excellent example. And, Wall Street seems to take a pounding in that arena as well. There's a lot of blame that can be spread all over the spectrum of folks. No one group of people has a lock on being bad. It happens to exist all over the world.

  4. #19
    Registered User jeff.ferguson's Avatar
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    Yikes - looks as if my thread has been hijacked! Any chance anyone out there has more thoughts on living in Germany? I've been doing a lot of research and I'm leaning more toward making the move every day.

  5. #20
    Registered User WalterK75's Avatar
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    I encourage you to go. Just being in a different country is an education. In Germany you will be able to visit other countries easily. When there I love being in places and buildings that are several hundred years older than anything in North America. It puts a different perspective on things.
    Walter

    G. K. Chesterton wrote - "The traveller sees what he sees, the tourist sees what he came to see."

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    Quote Originally Posted by jeff.ferguson View Post
    Yikes - looks as if my thread has been hijacked! .
    It always amazes me how quickly anything that is posted on the internet these days will move over into the socio-political arena...

  7. #22
    Registered User lkchris's Avatar
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    Must be from riding without a helmet!
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  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeff.ferguson View Post
    Yikes - looks as if my thread has been hijacked! Any chance anyone out there has more thoughts on living in Germany? I've been doing a lot of research and I'm leaning more toward making the move every day.

    Well, I do apologize for my part in that. And since I have no knowledge [of] Germany, I'll wish you luck & good fortune...actually I'm a-tad jealous

  9. #24
    Registered User donbmw's Avatar
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    Every one should live in another country for sometime if they have the opportunity. My dad was in the Airforce and we were in Japan for 4 years. I started school there and remember most of it. When he went to Germany we didn't go due to some problem with where we were to go to school. I would have in joyed that time being older then. Every one I have known going in the Service I have told them to get station out side the US. I might be the only time and they are not paying for it.
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by 71243 View Post
    Well, I do apologize for my part in that. And since I have no knowledge [of] Germany, I'll wish you luck & good fortune...actually I'm a-tad jealous
    And, I made it worse... sorry.

  11. #26
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    I'll add my $0.02 worth and encourage you to go. I spent some time in the Peace Corps and then we lived in Scotland and Switzerland for a couple years each, working for an American company. You will definitely get a different perspective on things from that side of the pond. Try to learn the language and get into the local culture. My one caveat would be to be sure your kids are up for it. A couple of my fellow expats had teen aged kids who really didn't want to be there and made things difficult for the family (our daughter was born in Scotland and was a toddler when we lived in Switzerland). It's a big lifestyle change, tho, so you may feel pretty isolated and culture-shocked for a while but once you get adjusted a bit it can be a great experience for the whole family. We certainly don't regret it at all. Go for it!
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  12. #27
    Registered User lkchris's Avatar
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    The biggest culture shock will come in learning the USA is economically a third-world country compared to Germany. Try $9 for a Big Mac. Look how many BMW guys think (in economic ignorance) that BMW overcharges. The economy there now is hurting some, and I don't know what that means.

    A recent Dan Rather Reports episode on AXSTV (Mark Cuban) called "The German Jobs Machine" noted that by 4th grade it's decided whether a student will go to college or not. Otherwise, it's trades training. An interviewee plant manager for a USA branch described USA education as "you go to school for 12 years to be unskilled."
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    Quote Originally Posted by lkchris View Post
    The biggest culture shock will come in learning the USA is economically a third-world country compared to Germany. Try $9 for a Big Mac. Look how many BMW guys think (in economic ignorance) that BMW overcharges. The economy there now is hurting some, and I don't know what that means.

    A recent Dan Rather Reports episode on AXSTV (Mark Cuban) called "The German Jobs Machine" noted that by 4th grade it's decided whether a student will go to college or not. Otherwise, it's trades training. An interviewee plant manager for a USA branch described USA education as "you go to school for 12 years to be unskilled."
    Now you're the one turning this political ...do you really want the Gov deciding what your child"s education will be ?

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by lkchris View Post
    . Try $9 for a Big Mac. Look how many BMW guys think that BMW overcharges. The economy there now is hurting some, and I don't know what that means.

    ."
    There is no doubt, that cost of living will be different in different countries. The McD example is not a very good one. (You will be able to buy beer in most of them!) You will find out that Germany has their own version of "fast food" which is priced much more competitively and often more nutritious. But if you go abroad and insist to live like in the U.S., you will not get it.

    In Europe, Germans used to have the same poor reputation of being ignorand to the other countries' cultures. In the 60s, they used to go to Spain and Italy on vacation and insisted on having pork and sauerkraut. When they wouldn't get it, they complained. Some more tolerant and open-minded Germans coined the phrase: H?te dich vor Sturm und Wind und Deutschen die im Ausland sind!

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by 71243 View Post
    Now you're the one turning this political ...do you really want the Gov deciding what your child"s education will be ?
    Thankfully, I went to school when we still had "tracking" which started in 7th grade. Today, the "tracks' are gone in many schools so the potential merit scholarship winner is taking the same history class as Bleacher Betty, the football game romance favorite, and Derrick,the linebacker, that can't factor a second order polynomial but still thinks he'll walk-on at Michigan.

    The German system is tough, but our "flexibility" isn't obviously better.

    BTW - I wasn't in the top track and my HS Guidance Counselor suggested military service instead of college..........
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