Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 38

Thread: Traffic Lights - Odd Question

  1. #16
    Cam Killer marchyman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    3,457
    Quote Originally Posted by greenwald View Post
    Before you take the advice to treat any traffic control signal that does not detect your motorcycle as 'defective,' and violate the signal, understand that such 'permission' to do so varies from state to state. It is NOT a universal rule to be followed.
    Yep. And if the law does say you can proceed on a malfunctioning signal there is no guarantee that the judge will agree with you that the signal is indeed malfunctioning because it couldn't detect your bike. That would not stop me from arguing the case However, I would NOT argue the case with the officer writing the ticket. I'd sign it, take my copy, then look up the laws of the appropriate jurisdiction.

    Most of my riding is in California where the law is similar to the section of the PA law I quoted above.

  2. #17
    Riding where it's hot! AZ-J's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Scottsdale, AZ
    Posts
    2,627
    Years ago I could not trip a sensor here with a m/c. Now I can. It may be my cylinder heads are lower than the GS or the RT, but I can trip them here.
    My bike shown here
    Jordan M, MOA #24434
    My Blog

  3. #18
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    N.H.
    Posts
    104
    I had the same problem leaving the strip mall I work in. I saw the DPW working on the light and talked to them. They were very helpful, two of them rode, they turned up the sensitivity and now I have no problem. They also told me to make sure I was over the center of the sensor by lining my bike up with the light.
    One thing you don't want to try is the light triggers you hang under the bike, that did nothing for me.

  4. #19
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Boerne, TX
    Posts
    10

    Bob Higdon's Article

    After reading this thread I thought of an article that Bob Higdon wrote for the Iron Butt Association magazine sometime ago. I tried an internet search for the article, and failing that, I decided to write to Bob about locating it. He sent me the article in Word format that I've hopefully included here.

    As with all of his musings, I think you'll find this both funny and enlightening and told in a way only he can tell a story. If you enjoy this article, I've included links to 2 other ride stories he has written while searching for this one.

    http://www.ironbutt.com/about/getArc....cfm?DocID=139

    http://www.motorcycle.com/news/news1175.html

    BTW, if you're not a subscriber to the Iron Butt Association magazine you're missing the best published motorcycling magazine available.

    Bill Edwards
    Boerne, TX
    Attached Files Attached Files

  5. #20
    Old man in the mountains osbornk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Marion VA-In the middle of some of the best riding in the country.
    Posts
    3,287
    Virginia passed a law a couple of years ago that pretty much took care of the problem for us. If you wait at a red light for 2 light cycles or 2 minutes (whichever comers first), you can proceed as if it was a stop sign. I would suggest that anyone living in a state that does not have such a law to contact their local state representative and suggest that they introduce such a bill.
    'You can say what you want about the South, but I almost never hear of anyone wanting to retire to the North.

  6. #21
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    South Kentucky
    Posts
    486
    When the traffic is clear and no cops in sight ,I run them
    Anthony S.
    2012 R1200GS

  7. #22
    Registered User lmo1131's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Pismo Beach, CA
    Posts
    3,048
    A little California specific update: I had an opportunity to have a conversation with one of our Motor Officers here in Pismo Beach, California; he was sitting in a parking lot and I approached him on my bike (an old /5 isn't too threatening). He stated that in California, per the California Vehicle Code (CVC), there is no prescribed time or number of light-cycles to wait for a light that does not recognize your presence. Paraphrasing, "One light cycle and then, when it is safe to proceed" was his official recommendation. Makes sense to me.

    A change in legislation (requiring that lights be capable of recognizing the presence of bicycles and motorcycles) was attempted in California in 2002. It passed both houses of the legislature but was vetoed by, then, Governor Grey Davis because, "it would result in unknown reimbursable state-mandated costs on local government by requiring them to install these new detectors." This only addressed the requirement of traffic lights to be able to recognize bicycles and motorcycles ... not what the operator was expected/allowed to do if the light did not recognize his presence. The legislation within the CVC Section 21450.5 Traffic Actuated Signals Detection of Motorcycles and Bicycles (effective 1 Jan. 2008) states:

    Cities, counties, and cities and counties shall not be required to comply with the provisions contained in subdivision (b) until the Department of Transportation, in consultation with these entities, has established uniform standards, specifications, and guidelines for the detection of bicycles and motorcycles by traffic-actuated signals and related signal timing.
    "It is what you discover, after you know it all, that counts." _ John Wooden

    Lew Morris
    1973 R75/5 - original owner

  8. #23
    Registered User sit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    295
    I have had very good luck with contacting the agency that controls the signal. I literally have had them out adjusting the signal the next day. For my hwy section you can send an email. I use words in my email like dangerous, hazardous etc and that seems to trigger a better response. I have done the same for pot holes. Report it and wait. Throw in a few good words and it gets filled pretty quick.

    As for running a light when it does not cycle. You may want to carry a copy of that law on your bike.

    As for stopping on the loop at the intersection. In my area they are often circular loops and and I find if I stop near the edge of them so my cat is over them, it works better.
    2005 K1200LT-Ocean Blue
    2013 Ural Patrol - White
    2007 R1200GS-Granite Gray-Sold
    2004 R1150R-Titan Silver-Sold

  9. #24
    Bluenoser
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Lethbridge Alberta
    Posts
    456
    I've seen add ons that make your bike appear bigger to these sensors and will trip them. Yes these sensors can be a pain in the you know what
    1971 R50/5 SWB with R75/6 drivetrain
    2013 DL650

  10. #25
    Kbiker BCKRider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    B.C. Canada
    Posts
    761
    Quote Originally Posted by jusbill View Post
    After reading this thread I thought of an article that Bob Higdon wrote for the Iron Butt Association magazine sometime ago. I tried an internet search for the article, and failing that, I decided to write to Bob about locating it. He sent me the article in Word format that I've hopefully included here.

    As with all of his musings, I think you'll find this both funny and enlightening and told in a way only he can tell a story. If you enjoy this article, I've included links to 2 other ride stories he has written while searching for this one.

    http://www.ironbutt.com/about/getArc....cfm?DocID=139

    http://www.motorcycle.com/news/news1175.html

    BTW, if you're not a subscriber to the Iron Butt Association magazine you're missing the best published motorcycling magazine available.

    Bill Edwards
    Boerne, TX
    THANK YOU, Bill. For any of you haven't checked out these links, all I can say is the Bob Higdon is an -ex-lawyer who can write some very memorable prose!
    Doug
    1992 K100RS

  11. #26
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    132
    Quote Originally Posted by marchyman View Post
    PA law (I just looked it up) says (I think you are in PA):

    (c) Inoperable or malfunctioning signal.--If a traffic-
    control signal is out of operation or is not functioning
    properly, vehicular traffic facing a:
    (1) Green or yellow signal may proceed with caution as
    indicated in subsection (a)(1) and (2).
    (2) Red or completely unlighted signal shall stop in the
    same manner as at a stop sign, and the right to proceed shall
    be subject to the rules applicable after making a stop at a
    stop sign as provided in section 3323 (relating to stop signs
    and yield signs).
    (Dec. 21, 1998, P.L.1126, No.151, eff. 60 days)
    An interesting result of this question I posted. I searched the above reference and was able to print out the whole section, about four pages referring to traffic signals and I highlighted (2) above. Well, today I spent several hours with a twp police officer and a retired Lt of the Pa State Police. I was working with them at a seasonal fair that was at the university my wife works at. I helped collect money from the vendors and ticket sales and they provided armed security. I asked both men their opinions of my situation as I originally stated at the beginning of this thread. Both of them stated that I would have to follow the law about the red light and that I should try not to use intersections that present that problem and if I do run into this again, I should turn right and go home that way.
    Well, I told them about the above state statute and neither of them thought it was possible. When I brought the four page in to them, they were surprised about the wording and had never thought about approaching the problem like that. They both stated, that going by the above statute, I have the right to consider the light as being out of calibration and should proceed with due caution.

    Damn, I trumped the police.

  12. #27
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Wilmington, NC
    Posts
    2,123
    Another thing you can do is call the local traffic office responsible for that light and ask them to re-calibrate it. Where I live in NC, our city traffic guys actually did a TV presentation on how they wanted to be called when any one encountered a problematic mag detection signal and said they normally went out to re-calibrate them within 2 days and showed the tools they used to do it- they're also doing timed light projects to speed traffic flow and talked about the details of those. I've only seen 2 bad mag detectors in all the years I've lived in NC- one was way out in the boonies on a light that was only an orange during daylight hours (ran that one after 3 songs on the radio even though I was in no hurry) and for some reason a stop at night when no one was there (??, never did figure out that logic) and the last one was in Wilmington a few years back. It was re-calibrated with no further troubles.

  13. #28
    Registered User arthurdent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Central Nebraska
    Posts
    345
    Quote Originally Posted by lmo1131 View Post
    From a purely mechanical (?) point of view, if you loiter in the center, and on the center, of the pick up field I've found that it tends to trigger the lights better. "Center" is about 10 feet from the end of the field for the most part. Of course, if you can't position yourself there you're screwed, but late at night it shouldn't be too hard. Personally, I'm with the rest of the crew ... I'd blow through it after the count of ten if no other traffic is present.

    I haven't seen sensors like this anywhere I have lived or traveled through. Generally what I see are ovals without the center line. I end up trying to sit over the cuton one side of the lane - same effect, different location.

    Someone mentioned motor officers checking lights sensors. Remember that most motor officers ride HD bikes that have significantly more steel in them than BMW or sport bikes so they may not have a problem tripping the magnets.

  14. #29
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Eastern KY
    Posts
    3,247
    Quote Originally Posted by sloride View Post
    When the traffic is clear and no cops in sight ,I run them
    Nearest city has intersection cameras-are they cool with the 2 light cycle thing,etc.? How do you know where the edge of the sensor field is positioned(or the center depending on which is best for a MC?) if the area has been repaved?
    "If I had my life to live over, I'd dare to make more mistakes next time...I'd relax,I'd limber up... I would take fewer things seriously...take more chances... take more trips...climb more mountains...swim more rivers...eat more ice cream." Jorge Luis Borges at age 85.

  15. #30
    Registered User sit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    295
    The funny thing about this is that if you don't/can't trigger the sensor, technically based on how your state laws are written, you are stuck. If you do anything from that lane other than turn left on a green you are breaking the law. Most if not all left turn lanes are separated from the through lanes with a fat solid white line on the right and yellow line(s) on the left. So if you are at the stop line and give up and pull out of the lane and proceed straight or something else, you have violated the lane use by crossing the white line. Its a turn only lane. If you make a right at the intersection and do a u turn, depending again on your location and local laws, you may be breaking the law again.

    So call your traffic office to report the intersection and carry the wording of your state laws with your because as has been demonstrated, there are laws cops don't know. Have you ever actually looked at how thick law books are?
    2005 K1200LT-Ocean Blue
    2013 Ural Patrol - White
    2007 R1200GS-Granite Gray-Sold
    2004 R1150R-Titan Silver-Sold

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •