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  1. #1
    Swamp Fox GeneT's Avatar
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    E15

    Y'all might find this of some interest:

    http://www.tradeonlytoday.com/home/5...r-sales-of-e15
    Gene T

  2. #2
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    Maybe the solution is to build vehicles that run efficiently on 100% ethanol from hemp
    Anthony S.
    2012 R1200GS

  3. #3
    IBA #44567 Ken F's Avatar
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    .........Or build the pipeline from Canada, and drill for the oil we have under our country and offshore.
    Some Refineries and dismantling the EPA would dramatically help the situation too!
    Ken
    IBA #44567 Pres. Springfield BMW Roadriders
    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
    -Albert Eienstein

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    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken F View Post
    .........Or build the pipeline from Canada, and drill for the oil we have under our country and offshore.
    Some Refineries and dismantling the EPA would dramatically help the situation too!
    Ken
    Hmmm.......if that oil was for local consumption why don't they build the refinery in Canada and sell us the refined product? They would have the profit from both the crude and the higher value refined product?
    Cave contents: 99 R11RS, 2013 Toyota Tacoma, 03 Simplicity Legacy, 97 Stihl FS75, Dewalt DW625 & DW744

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    Quote Originally Posted by 36654 View Post
    Hmmm.......if that oil was for local consumption why don't they build the refinery in Canada and sell us the refined product? They would have the profit from both the crude and the higher value refined product?
    I thought it has a something to do with shelf life if final product. Crude can sit in a tank for a long time. Refined cant be stock piled. I could be wrong though,
    ----------
    Kris - 2007 f650GS

  6. #6
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WisconsinKris View Post
    I thought it has a something to do with shelf life if final product. Crude can sit in a tank for a long time. Refined cant be stock piled. I could be wrong though,
    With the Canadian oil sand and US shale oil production in the upper mid-west, refining the product near the well site would provide a central distribution point for any domestic needs. The pipeline provides the lowest cost path to the higher profit margin export market.
    Cave contents: 99 R11RS, 2013 Toyota Tacoma, 03 Simplicity Legacy, 97 Stihl FS75, Dewalt DW625 & DW744

  7. #7
    Registered User chewbacca's Avatar
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    Science Versus Politics and then there is Reality

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken F View Post
    .........Or build the pipeline from Canada, and drill for the oil we have under our country and offshore.
    Some Refineries and dismantling the EPA would dramatically help the situation too!
    Ken
    Without getting into the science which "IF" you are interested in you can look up yourself because there is more than enough data on the web to verify, there is WAY more than enough oil in North America from a whole bunch of sources. We the people (isn't there a movement afoot to remove such phrases from the Constitution?) have been manipulated by our politicians, media and the oil industry to believe we will run out of oil in then next week to ten days. There is NO, NADA, ZILCH logical or scientific reason to use ethanol in vehicles other than politics. Since several car manufacturers have voided their new car warranties if E15 is used, you are finally seeing the media jump on board the anti-ethanol bandwagon.
    Old But Not Dead
    Semper Fi

  8. #8
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    Ken F, your Wikipedia information indicates the Athabasca oil sands as being in NE Canada instead of NE Alberta which is in the western part of Canada and your text indicates 830,000 million barrels a day which is flattering but I think 830,000 would be more accurate.

    Facts are that USA consumes about 18.5 million barrels of oil a day and has the opportunity to reduce its dependence on foreign oil from unfriendly nations by buying from Canada and at a significant discount to Venezuelan and OPEC prices. Check with your congressman, in addition to paying world prices to the OPEC nations, the US spends some $60 billion a year keeping middle east oil shipping lanes open. The Keystone alternative is aided by the refining capability that is already in place in the USA. Currently, oil sands bitumen is being transported by rail through US cities and towns to southern refineries at a risk of 16 to1 when compared to a pipeline.

    Everyone wants a greener planet, at the moment Canada contributes less than 2% to the worlds greenhouse gas. The US is reputed to have reduced greenhouse gas by 30%, how one asks? By shipping employment and manufacturing to Mexico, Brazil and China, unfortunately, that is how.

    Ethanol is a "farm aid" program that is becoming so lucrative that other needed crops are being replaced by cash crops destined to become ethanol. Ethanol has already proven itself to damage engines and fuel systems, lessen engine life, it lowers octane ratings and offers less milage per gallon. Where is the gain when measured against the costs of physical damage, the loss of other food crops not to mention the cost of government incentives and subsidies to develop the product and the grains being grown for it.

    Recently there was a demonstration in front of the White House while President Obama was playing golf with Tiger Woods, did the demonstrators arrive on bicycles, on skate boards, on roller skates? I'm guessing that many arrived in gas guzzling Suburbans and SUV's.

    Just because a dissident group (protest groups are often recipients of government funding) shows up to demonstrate for clean air doesn't mean that the air is unfit or about to become unfit, often there is another agenda, i.e. past vice-president Al Gore, the man has become a billionaire with his unsubstantiated "inconvenient truth". Watch for Mr. Gore to seek the presidential nomination, it's coming.

    For those of you old enough to remember the Vietnam war, a most tragic event that likely deserved anti-war demonstration but did you also know that in the USA, the Russian Embassy was responsible for paying people $25.00/day to demonstrate against the war.

    As well meaning as lowering emissions and developing alternate fuels might be, rarely are the motivations truly altruistic, there is usually a capital gain in there somewhere. And if your thinking battery power you are thinking lithium. Where are the main deposits of lithium, Bolivia and China, and if you have concerns about oil sands tailing ponds, do some research into lithium brine pools.

    Bottom line for this blog - there is no place for ethanol, regardless of percentage, in the internal combustion engine and especially in my BMW.

  9. #9
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoRThwind View Post
    Ken F, your Wikipedia information indicates the Athabasca oil sands as being in NE Canada instead of NE Alberta which is in the western part of Canada and your text indicates 830,000 million barrels a day which is flattering but I think 830,000 would be more accurate.

    Facts are that USA consumes about 18.5 million barrels of oil a day and has the opportunity to reduce its dependence on foreign oil from unfriendly nations by buying from Canada and at a significant discount to Venezuelan and OPEC prices. Check with your congressman, in addition to paying world prices to the OPEC nations, the US spends some $60 billion a year keeping middle east oil shipping lanes open. The Keystone alternative is aided by the refining capability that is already in place in the USA. Currently, oil sands bitumen is being transported by rail through US cities and towns to southern refineries at a risk of 16 to1 when compared to a pipeline.

    Everyone wants a greener planet, at the moment Canada contributes less than 2% to the worlds greenhouse gas. The US is reputed to have reduced greenhouse gas by 30%, how one asks? By shipping employment and manufacturing to Mexico, Brazil and China, unfortunately, that is how.

    Ethanol is a "farm aid" program that is becoming so lucrative that other needed crops are being replaced by cash crops destined to become ethanol. Ethanol has already proven itself to damage engines and fuel systems, lessen engine life, it lowers octane ratings and offers less milage per gallon. Where is the gain when measured against the costs of physical damage, the loss of other food crops not to mention the cost of government incentives and subsidies to develop the product and the grains being grown for it.

    Recently there was a demonstration in front of the White House while President Obama was playing golf with Tiger Woods, did the demonstrators arrive on bicycles, on skate boards, on roller skates? I'm guessing that many arrived in gas guzzling Suburbans and SUV's.

    Just because a dissident group (protest groups are often recipients of government funding) shows up to demonstrate for clean air doesn't mean that the air is unfit or about to become unfit, often there is another agenda, i.e. past vice-president Al Gore, the man has become a billionaire with his unsubstantiated "inconvenient truth". Watch for Mr. Gore to seek the presidential nomination, it's coming.

    For those of you old enough to remember the Vietnam war, a most tragic event that likely deserved anti-war demonstration but did you also know that in the USA, the Russian Embassy was responsible for paying people $25.00/day to demonstrate against the war.

    As well meaning as lowering emissions and developing alternate fuels might be, rarely are the motivations truly altruistic, there is usually a capital gain in there somewhere. And if your thinking battery power you are thinking lithium. Where are the main deposits of lithium, Bolivia and China, and if you have concerns about oil sands tailing ponds, do some research into lithium brine pools.

    Bottom line for this blog - there is no place for ethanol, regardless of percentage, in the internal combustion engine and especially in my BMW.
    Why pray tell would the canadians want to sell their oil at prices below the world market? It's their oil and their stock holders are entitled to the profits.
    Cave contents: 99 R11RS, 2013 Toyota Tacoma, 03 Simplicity Legacy, 97 Stihl FS75, Dewalt DW625 & DW744

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