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Thread: 04 R1150-RS Brake Rotors

  1. #16
    B Reams brook.reams's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikerfish1100 View Post
    for clarification purposes brook, when you say that the "EBC units" need replacing... are you talking about your EBC pads, or your EBC rotors?
    if rotors.. something is wrong (either with your style of usage or the rotors themselves), as they should last well more than 2 years. if pads.. there are numrous aftermarket pads that people are happy with, along with the OEM units.
    Sorry I didn't get back to the board until now.

    The rotors (original BMW) were gone in 60,000 miles, front and rear. Too soon IMHO. I am not a heavy braker,

    The EBC replacement rotors have been on for about 2 years and about 18,000 miles. Rear rotor is now at 4.4 mm so beyond wear limit of 4.5. Pads were gone on the rear in about 14,000 miles. Unreasonable.

    So, I'm not feeling happy with BMW or EBC these days, hence the question about any other experience with aftermarket rotors/pads.

    Thanks.
    ---------------------------------
    Brook Reams - Arvada, CO
    Various Two-wheeled Vices, All BMW
    2004 R1150-RS || 2002 F650-GS || 1975 R75/6 || 1973 R75/5

  2. #17
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    you may not be a "heavy" braker... but are you a frequent braker?
    Ride Safe, Ride Lots

  3. #18
    Left Coast Rider
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikerfish1100 View Post
    it's The Pace, my Canuckistanian friend. "The Pace" is the way to ride.
    I couldn't agree more. I've been riding that way for about 20 years and have yet to replace a set of brake pads because they were worn out.

  4. #19
    NC Piedmont Rider ncstephen's Avatar
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    Your question about pads, rotors and wear. This is on a K1200rs so yours will vary but it gives a view of pattern of wear that could be similar to what you have experienced

    My riding style is using higher engine revs, downshiifting for slowing and braking then as needed towards the end of a stop.
    I generally only use hand lever so front brake and rear are use in this linked fashion.

    Rears wear out between 15,000 and 18,000 constantly over 100,000 miles, Since the first change I have used Carbone Lorraine (Not the HH version). Evidently there is always a little drag on them. The rear rotor always feels warm while the fronts are cool, (checked in coasting to a stop after being on the interstate)

    Front pads changed at 50,000 miles and were about 2/3 worn out.

    Rear rotor was worn underspec significantly (I imagine) but not measured (I could place a worn penny on each side and it was about flush with the lip so about 3 mm total wear). This was at 98,000 so that is approx 1mm of wear /30,000 miles

    Fronts are still fine when recently checked by shop.

    Hope this helps
    NCS
    03 K 1200RS (Black is Best)
    03 Honda RC51
    74 Honda CB750 K4

  5. #20
    B Reams brook.reams's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NCStephen View Post
    Your question about pads, rotors and wear. This is on a K1200rs so yours will vary but it gives a view of pattern of wear that could be similar to what you have experienced

    My riding style is using higher engine revs, downshiifting for slowing and braking then as needed towards the end of a stop.
    I generally only use hand lever so front brake and rear are use in this linked fashion.

    Rears wear out between 15,000 and 18,000 constantly over 100,000 miles, Since the first change I have used Carbone Lorraine (Not the HH version). Evidently there is always a little drag on them. The rear rotor always feels warm while the fronts are cool, (checked in coasting to a stop after being on the interstate)

    Front pads changed at 50,000 miles and were about 2/3 worn out.

    Rear rotor was worn underspec significantly (I imagine) but not measured (I could place a worn penny on each side and it was about flush with the lip so about 3 mm total wear). This was at 98,000 so that is approx 1mm of wear /30,000 miles

    Fronts are still fine when recently checked by shop.

    Hope this helps
    NCS
    Interesting. On my 2004 R1150-RS rear pads, the inside pad was gone and the outside pad had material left in about 20,000 miles. I had the same impression that the pads drag on the rear all the time (the rotor is warm to the touch, front rotors are cold), and it looks as if the inner pad does most of the dragging.

    You think you had 1 mm wear in 30,000 miles. A new rotor will be 5mm thick and the wear limit is 4.5 mm, so in your case, your rotor's are past the wear limit in 15,000 miles. Oh My !!!!
    ---------------------------------
    Brook Reams - Arvada, CO
    Various Two-wheeled Vices, All BMW
    2004 R1150-RS || 2002 F650-GS || 1975 R75/6 || 1973 R75/5

  6. #21
    NC Piedmont Rider ncstephen's Avatar
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    I think it is my outside pad that is consistently the worn one but I really would have to look now. The caliper has to be removed during rear wheel removal and I know the shop folks well. I tell them to look, if one is more than 2/3 worn, just change it when a tire is put on as I know it won't last until the next tire change. It is an easy job but since I don't have an indoor place to do this, it just works to let them do it while they have the caliper in their hands.

    As for the wear. I am just scratching some numbers on paper here for the idea. I got the bike at 7800 miles a little over 4 yrs ago. I noticed the rear rotor wearing and discussed it when doing tires. Once the ridge on the outside of the rotor was about the thickness of a worn penny I swapped for another one. A penny new is 1.55 mm thick. Figure a worn one is a little below 1.5 mm then. It seemed worn about the same on the inside If I can put a penny flush in the worn area then with each side it has worn about 3 mm. When I changed the rear rotor the bike was at 98,000 miles so that makes it about 33,000 miles / mm of wear. Yes I agree the rotor was a bit thin. Still the bulk of the stopping is done by the front. The rear had a minor pulse to it that had first been noticed around 15,000 miles and had remained the same. It was only detected when the bike was barely rolling traffic going about about walking speed (like down hill in very slow traffic). I most likely will change the rotor again this time when a worn dime can almost fit in that space.

    Is there foolishness here with this?

    NCS
    03 K 1200RS (Black is Best)
    03 Honda RC51
    74 Honda CB750 K4

  7. #22
    not so retired henzilla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikerfish1100 View Post
    Brakes are for stopping, or dramatic slowdowns. Running the twities on a big-bore twin? that's all about the motor and being smooth. Like Andy, i have been accussed of having non-functioning brake lights. I let new riding mates know beforehand that if they ever see my brake lights, it's for a very good reason.
    I have been told my brake light was not working more than I can count...some of my older buddies don't like following me in the twisties...different styles for sure

    I have been riding a newly rescued /6 the past few days...it doesn't stop well anyways compared to any of our post '95 bikes, so I don't use the brakes unless coming to a full stop. The motor does the work for me.
    Steve Henson
    SABMWRA MOA Club#62's Flat Fixer/ current forum moderator
    It's not the breaths you take, but the moments that take your breath away-D.Dillon/G. Strait

  8. #23
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    I am not getting too much into this particular discussion, but...using just the motor to slow down may be good advice when you just ride vintage bikes where the motor is anemic and the front brake is a cosmetic item anyway. When you ride a more modern bike that has any performance, you want to use your brakes. I installed stainless steel brake lines on most of my bikes, including my R100S, and I rely on my front brake to slow me down to the right speed at the entrance of a turn. I guess it is a matter of one's preferred riding style. But consider that above a certain speed you may encounter rear wheel hop and , worse, blocking of the rear wheel, when you try to use your "engine brake".
    There is a reason, manufacturers put slipper clutches even in street bikes.

  9. #24
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    Mike, you might want to take a read on a thread i started called "The Pace" over in Motorrad. Don't know that it will dissuade you of your notions, but it might at least give you an alternative perspective.
    Ride Safe, Ride Lots

  10. #25
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    i've not quite figured out why you guys are busily measuring your pad thickness to determine pad wear and how much life is remaining. Why not just use the wear markers that are part of a brake pad's construction?
    Ride Safe, Ride Lots

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikerfish1100 View Post
    Mike, you might want to take a read on a thread i started called "The Pace" over in Motorrad. Don't know that it will dissuade you of your notions, but it might at least give you an alternative perspective.
    Individual riding styles vary. And so do the opinions of what constitutes a proficient riding style. If you listen to Fred Rau you may get a different advice than you get from Keith Code or Clemens Salvatori as opposed to Kevin Cameron.
    If we needed front brakes only to come to a stop, and rely on the motor to bring us down from speed, we would not need dual rotors, radial mounted four piston calipers and stainless steel lines.
    I can take it a up a notch: I have a bike where I prefer cast iron rotors over stainless steel ones.

  12. #27
    Registered User rxcrider's Avatar
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    Brook & NCS - take a look at the rear master cylinder actuator rod and make sure there is freeplay in the pedal. If the pedal stop was adjusted to push the pedal down without shortening the actuator rod, the rear brake may never release fully. Likewise, if you ride with your boot covering the pedal, you may always be depressing it slightly.

  13. #28
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    mike- i brought up the The Pace as a way of pointing out that the excessive rotor wear that Brook is experiencing might be a result of too frequent brake use, rather than what he termed "heavy" braking. you implied that a modern bike needs to be dragged down from speed for safe corner entry speeds, thus the existence of dual discs, ss lines, radial calipers, slipper clutches, etc. The Pace suggests that such frantic antics are generally not needed on the street, and that there is no need to drag down from speed if your straight line speeds are held to similar levels as your corner speeds.
    In a similar vein, accident avoidance techniques such as "lay 'er down" (HA!), or full on panic braking are also generally unnecessary, if one employs superior SEE techniques.
    hey, ride the way you like, it makes no never mind to anyone else.
    Ride Safe, Ride Lots

  14. #29
    Day Dreaming ... happy wanderer's Avatar
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    The only guys that mind pre corner braking are the ones behind you!
    "Don't like yer brakes much do ya" is something I hear a lot and I normally get asked to just go ahead and lead because often I seem to get up everyone's pipes in corners which drives me and them nuts.

    I just find riding at the same speed into corners and as I exit them down the straights works for me. I like that smooth entry, spot the exit and lean as much as required technique of getting through turns. I guess that is what "The Pace" is all about and it does not require a whole lot of braking except when one gets ahead of oneself. Hey, it happens!

    This thread has taken an interesting turn though. I didn't think about it till it was mentioned but last time I changed my rear pads on the '00 RT I'm pretty sure the outside pad was more worn than the inside one as others have noted. The actuator rod is adjusted properly so that ain't it. I also make sure any corrosion on the mount pins is cleaned up before they go back together. Hmmmm..I'm going to have to take another look at that now.
    MJM - BeeCeeBeemers Motorcycle Club Vancouver B.C.
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  15. #30
    Registered User rxcrider's Avatar
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    Considering Brook's location, front brake wear should be in excess of what the flatlanders like myself have. (unless he only heads East) Engine braking isn't enough to correct entry speed coming down the mountain. The rear wear and heat are bothersome.

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