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Thread: Oil Analysis Update?

  1. #46
    Administrator 20774's Avatar
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    I agree there's a bunch of information out there...the only "issue" I have is that they represent different tests at different times with different companies, and not necessarily independent tests. As was the case with the past oil testing, it was a pure snapshot in time for direct comparison. That was my intention here...take the popular oils that we like to use or that are recommended and do a head-to-head test without any vested interested in the outcome.
    Kurt -- Forum Administrator ---> Resources and Links Thread <---
    '78 R100/7 & '69 R69S & '52 R25/2
    mine-ineye-deatheah-pielayah-jooa-kalayus. oolah-minane-hay-meeriah-kal-oyus-algay-a-thaykin', buddy!

  2. #47
    Bluenoser
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    Quote Originally Posted by dpmonk View Post
    http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...duct_Guide.pdf

    the levels in the motorcycle oil are quite a bit higher than the 15w50 car oil.
    actually quite a bit higher than in the amzoil advertisement / oil analysis.

    Oh and about blowby, I sure hope not with new pistons, rings, valves, guides and way more money invested than the bike is worth.
    I run the Mobil 20-50 in my Harley but up here in Canada it is getting very hard to find as none of the big retailers like Walmart carry the stuff, so I'm going to have to switch to a different brand. Not sure where I'll go. They also stopped carrying the 15-50 as well.

    I think also that the Mobil 20-50 is going to drop its Zinc content as all the new Harleys have catalytic converters and from what I read Zinc & Phos are hard on cats.

    Yep your right about the blowby, shouldn't be happening, but something isn't adding up.
    1971 R50/5 SWB with R75/6 drivetrain
    2013 DL650

  3. #48
    Superkraut typ181r90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dpmonk View Post
    just returned from a 2k trip on my /6. Checked oil at approx 700 miles and it showed almost no consumption. Ran the bike pretty hard at Barber raceway (kept up with Ducati) and a couple of trips on the dragon tail and a long day at 70mph the oil light flashed on at stoplight. Checked and level was just above minimum. added 3/4 qt of Castrol 4t. Looks like the oil went through the right carb.

    Question is this; Valvoline claims it has anti foaming ingredients. If crank ventilation is source of oil loss is there any data on what oil prevents foaming the best? I was using Spectro gold.

    Some dragracing fiends (friends) seem to believe that synthetic oil doesn't absorbe engine heat as well as conventional. Any data on that?

    Sorry if I hijacked zddp thread with other questions but since the topic is oil....
    My R90/6 varies on oil consumption based on what I put in it and how hard I ride it. Like you, I have a new top end, just replaced the major seals at the end of August, my bike doesn't drip a drop of oil, and doesn't smoke the least bit out of the exhaust at any time.

    Before I replaced the major seals, I used to run BMW conv. 20w50 and oil consumption was normal from what I understand through other people's experiences. I should add that it only seemed to consume oil when I ran the bike in the 80-100mph range for an extended period of time (like a 20-30 mile trip down the parkway). Switched to Liqui Moly 20w50 Racing 4T and my oil consumption significantly dropped, it seemed like no matter how long or hard I rode it the level would never fall below halfway on the dipstick.

    After I replaced the seals (again in late August) I put in Castrol 4T 20w50 because that's what I had on the shelf at the time since I used to use it in my VW Thing which I had just recently sold. This stuff seems to disappear quicker than I'd like it to at extended high speeds which are mostly my commuting conditions. Again, no smoke, no signs of leakage anywhere on the case, but when you take off the right side intake duct you can see that the oil is from blowby and going through the right carb.

    I'll be switching my oil again in the next couple weeks and this time I'm going to experiment with BMW conv. 10w50 for the first time. I ride through the winter and the lighter cold weight is attractive to me since the bike sees plenty of startups in 20 some degree weather throughout the winter. When it gets warmer I plan on putting the Liqui Moly 20w50 back in because I really liked that oil (and the price of it via Beemer Boneyard).

    Of course the results of this oil analysis may change all those plans

    You mentioned you ran the bike hard at Barber, that could definitely contribute to blowby through the right carb as that's pretty much the only time/way I consume oil
    // 1975 BMW R90/6 (cafe'd) // 1957 BMW R60 (in pieces) // 1967 Aermacchi/H-D Sprint 250 SS (custom special) // 1973 VW Type 181 Custom SOLD )

    http://symphonyofshrapnel.blogspot.com

  4. #49
    P Monk
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    oil lost through breather

    well the Barber trip was just 2-3 laps and probably didn't get over 70, but lots of rpm's.
    Never have heard of Liqui Moly before. Just riding arround home it just didn't seem to be using any oil. I am looking forward to Kurt's results. A truly independant comparison by one of us is interesting.

    Kurt, thanks for the work. I noticed you are planning on testing Spectro and Brad Penn semi synthetics. Castrol and Valvoline also makes semi syn, I would assume if you see an improvement in the Spectro semi syn over the conventional oil maybe the extra cost is money well spent, even though it seems we are paying too much for only 25% synthetics in the blend.

    I do have a little concern with running a 10 or 15w50 down here in the heat. The 10w50 is a 10w with a lot of viscosity modifier, which if it does break down means you are actually running a 10w base oil. Wouldn't want to do that in the summertime in Texas.
    P. Monk
    My prized possessions. 74 R90/6 Mine! (also know by bride as the Black Hole). 09 R1200 GS. My wife, 1953 model who has survived aplastic anemia and a bone marrow transplant. My most prized possession is my relationship with Jesus!

  5. #50
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    Kurt, looks like it's going to cost at least $350 to test the 14-15 oils you last listed. If some of us want to share your expense where would one mail a check?
    14 R1200GSA, 93 R100R. No car is as fun to drive as any motorcycle is to ride.

  6. #51
    Administrator 20774's Avatar
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    Milo -

    Not to mention the cost of the oil, although I did score a free quart of AMSOIL from my neighbor who is a dealer!

    Thanks for the offer...not really sure how to deal with that. Let me just see how this goes and we can consider something down the line. If you're inclined, PM me with an email address and I'll keep the information for contact later.

    Thanks...
    Kurt -- Forum Administrator ---> Resources and Links Thread <---
    '78 R100/7 & '69 R69S & '52 R25/2
    mine-ineye-deatheah-pielayah-jooa-kalayus. oolah-minane-hay-meeriah-kal-oyus-algay-a-thaykin', buddy!

  7. #52
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    PM sent.
    14 R1200GSA, 93 R100R. No car is as fun to drive as any motorcycle is to ride.

  8. #53
    Registered User jad01's Avatar
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    Just my 2 cents here... this information is probably valuable to a large portion of our MOA membership, particularly if you are willing to expand it slightly to include viscosities/grades for the other BMW models (Oilheads, K-bikes, etc.). I wonder if the MOA would be willing to pay the cost as a service to the membership if it addressed a wider audience than just the airhead community? That cost is probably small for the association given the level of interest in oils by the members on the forums. Could make for a neat Owner's News article as well (to sweeten the pot ).
    Jim
    '78 R80/7 and '84 R100RS (Blues Brothers), '86 K75C (Icy Hot)
    '90 and '93 Mazda Miatas (Jelly Bean and Red Hot), '02 325ci (Blue Streak)
    '96 Giant Upland (big Kendas & freshly greased bearings!)

  9. #54
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    Jim -

    The thought has crossed my mind. These oil analyses have always been conducted with the Airhead-type engine in mind. The first analysis was 1998 and the second in 2002. Certainly a lot of the newer BMW bikes are just fine using what is called for in their manuals which is readily available. That probably also applies to the Oilheads...maybe even the earlier K-Bikes (water cooled). For bikes with catalytic converters, no problem with current oils. I don't know the specifics, but how many BMW motorcycles being produced right now share engine and transmission oil? I would think the S1000RR does. Those types of configurations have a completely different requirement for lubrication.

    But open your Airhead manual and you're kind of hosed. There probably are only a limited number of oils that can still function to meet the demands for wear and corrosion on these older engines. So, I think because of this, this update has to be somewhat focused.
    Kurt -- Forum Administrator ---> Resources and Links Thread <---
    '78 R100/7 & '69 R69S & '52 R25/2
    mine-ineye-deatheah-pielayah-jooa-kalayus. oolah-minane-hay-meeriah-kal-oyus-algay-a-thaykin', buddy!

  10. #55
    Registered User jad01's Avatar
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    Hi Kurt-
    Yes, your explanation makes sense. It seems like I have seen oil threads on the oilhead and k-bike forums related to wear additives (my memory is notoriously questionable though ), but they may likely have lesser issues regarding oil additives/grades as you suggest.
    Jim
    '78 R80/7 and '84 R100RS (Blues Brothers), '86 K75C (Icy Hot)
    '90 and '93 Mazda Miatas (Jelly Bean and Red Hot), '02 325ci (Blue Streak)
    '96 Giant Upland (big Kendas & freshly greased bearings!)

  11. #56
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    Collection Has Begun

    I've started getting the oils for the test...got a real nice donation from Cycle Gear here in San Antonio on Interstate 10 (thanks, Joe!) who let me have the six quarts that I was looking for provided I let him in on the results. I already mentioned that my next door neighbor let me have a quart of AMSOIL with the same "payment". The BMW dealer gave me a bit of a discount, too. I've found a few other oils while out looking that seemed interesting, so I've added to the initial list. The last few oils I might have to order on-line, but I'll do some more looking.

    I need to start a spreadsheet of info about each oil including price, where purchased, quantity (quart vs liter), and info about ratings. I think I'm even going to photograph each bottle so I can be sure I know what was tested.
    Kurt -- Forum Administrator ---> Resources and Links Thread <---
    '78 R100/7 & '69 R69S & '52 R25/2
    mine-ineye-deatheah-pielayah-jooa-kalayus. oolah-minane-hay-meeriah-kal-oyus-algay-a-thaykin', buddy!

  12. #57
    chasindaylight
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    oil

    This is my first post. I would like you to consider testing Harley Davidson 20w50 engine oil. I have used it extensively on three airheads for many years. I have put about 300,000 miles on this oil with no problems. Thanks,Terry.

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasingdaylight View Post
    This is my first post. I would like you to consider testing Harley Davidson 20w50 engine oil.
    Terry -

    Welcome! I did pick up a bottle of HD oil yesterday...it's 20w50 and I believe it is the petro variety. I was a little disappointed with the knowledge that the counter people had when I asked about their oils. The bottle doesn't say squat about API and the standard ratings...just that it meets Harley standards and is OK for any Harley engine. All their oils have the "HD 360" logo on it.

    So, I do plan on testing at least that version of Harley oil.
    Kurt -- Forum Administrator ---> Resources and Links Thread <---
    '78 R100/7 & '69 R69S & '52 R25/2
    mine-ineye-deatheah-pielayah-jooa-kalayus. oolah-minane-hay-meeriah-kal-oyus-algay-a-thaykin', buddy!

  14. #59
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    From what I gather on HD forums most aren't impressed with either HD360 or their synthetic oil. They're both regarded as just average oil made by Citgo then sold at a premium price. I see Mobil 1 V-Twin and Amsoil mentioned as much as any.
    14 R1200GSA, 93 R100R. No car is as fun to drive as any motorcycle is to ride.

  15. #60
    Superkraut typ181r90's Avatar
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    My offer to donate a quart or so of liqui moly racing 4t 20w50 still stands if you want it. Since cycle gear made a donation maybe you could persuade beemer boneyard to donate some other liqui moly grades
    // 1975 BMW R90/6 (cafe'd) // 1957 BMW R60 (in pieces) // 1967 Aermacchi/H-D Sprint 250 SS (custom special) // 1973 VW Type 181 Custom SOLD )

    http://symphonyofshrapnel.blogspot.com

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