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Thread: Oilhead Oil Thread

  1. #1
    Registered User roger 04 rt's Avatar
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    Oilhead Oil Thread

    I know that this is the subject that everyone seems to love to hate, and I've read many oil threads here already. But the other day I followed this link BMW Service Notes through to this document Summary of Permissible Oils.

    Written in 2007, it seems to indicate pretty clearly the viscosities and ratings for various conditions. Of note it says that all opposed twins may use API SF or better with no limit to SH (as it does for wet clutch bikes).

    From my prior reading here I believed that I needed to find an SG or SH rating, which I did recently. Why shouldn't I take this document at face value?
    RB

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    Benchwrenching PGlaves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger 04 RT View Post
    I know that this is the subject that everyone seems to love to hate, and I've read many oil threads here already. But the other day I followed this link BMW Service Notes through to this document Summary of Permissible Oils.

    Written in 2007, it seems to indicate pretty clearly the viscosities and ratings for various conditions. Of note it says that all opposed twins may use API SF or better with no limit to SH (as it does for wet clutch bikes).

    From my prior reading here I believed that I needed to find an SG or SH rating, which I did recently. Why shouldn't I take this document at face value?
    RB
    It all depends on what they define as "better".
    Paul Glaves - "Big Bend", Texas U.S.A
    "The greatest challenge to any thinker is stating the problem in a way that will allow a solution." - Bertrand Russell
    http://www.bigbend.net/users/glaves

  3. #3
    Registered User roger 04 rt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PGlaves View Post
    It all depends on what they define as "better".
    Thanks Paul. I struggled with what "better" meant but then noticed that for wet-clutch K bikes they specifically limited us to mineral-based and not to exceed SH. I don't have a problem using the Mobil 1 4T 10W40 but in the winter it is very cold here and I'd prefer a 0W40 synthetic.

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    Registered User lkchris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger 04 RT View Post
    Thanks Paul. I struggled with what "better" meant but then noticed that for wet-clutch K bikes they specifically limited us to mineral-based and not to exceed SH. I don't have a problem using the Mobil 1 4T 10W40 but in the winter it is very cold here and I'd prefer a 0W40 synthetic.
    Well, gee, read some Mobil 1 specs and bet you'll find ZERO could pour differences between a 0W and a 5W and a 10W. These are synthetics.
    Kent Christensen
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  5. #5
    Mongrel Owner
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    Castrol Grand Prix

    Is Castrol Grand Prix motorcycle oil not available in the US?
    It's an SG rated, dino-derived oil that's a lot less money than synthetics and pretty common here at Canadian Tire and Walmart. I've used it for years in various bikes with no issues.
    Cheers,
    Tony

  6. #6
    Registered User roger 04 rt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lkchris View Post
    Well, gee, read some Mobil 1 specs and bet you'll find ZERO could pour differences between a 0W and a 5W and a 10W. These are synthetics.
    The Cold pour points are similar. The difference that I'm looking at is the Viscosity which does vary with the first number.

    At 40C as the engine is warming up, Mobil 1's specs are:

    0W30: 63
    20W50 V Twin: 172
    10W40 4T: 82

    As I understand it the system does its best lubricating at a Viscosity of 10. So I sure don't want the V Twin oil in winter.

    I hadn't seen the service bulletin and wondered if others had.

  7. #7
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    a 10W oil is rated down to temps of -20.

    you riding at those numbers?
    Ride Safe, Ride Lots

  8. #8
    Registered User roger 04 rt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikerfish1100 View Post
    a 10W oil is rated down to temps of -20.

    you riding at those numbers?
    Starting the bike at -10C to 0C as time and snow up here permit.

    10W is rated there but I think you're talking pour point not viscosity. The viscosity is still much higher than 0W. My understanding is much of an engine's wear occurs during cold start. If the ZDDP is more important than cold viscosity, fine but the SB seems to list newer oils as, to quote them, Permissible.

    The BMW Bulletin I linked to shows 5W30 as preferred for -20C to +20C. There is a 5W40 Mobil Diesel Oil but it's VI cold is still pretty high.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger 04 RT View Post
    Starting the bike at -10C to 0C as time and snow up here permit.

    .
    to ride, or just to start it to see if it still works? if the former, sure. if the latter, why?
    Ride Safe, Ride Lots

  10. #10
    Registered User roger 04 rt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikerfish1100 View Post
    to ride, or just to start it to see if it still works? if the former, sure. if the latter, why?
    Why, because I'm going to "Ride Safe, Ride Lots".

  11. #11
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    because if you are starting it "to charge the battery", or "to keep the oil lubricating all the different internal parts", or some other equally silly reason, JUST STOP IT!
    http://youtu.be/_gyL1QFcls0

    (your statement of "Starting the bike at -10C to 0C as time and snow up here permit" was unclear as to what you do with it after you get it started, if anything.
    Ride Safe, Ride Lots

  12. #12
    Registered User roger 04 rt's Avatar
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    Who would start it for those reasons? The purpose of starting a bike is to ride it.

    But that's not the question of this thread. What I wanted to know was why BMW okayed the oils SF and beyond, an expansion of the conventional sf, SG, sh limits.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger 04 RT View Post
    Who would start it for those reasons? The purpose of starting a bike is to ride it.
    But that's not the question of this thread. What I wanted to know was why BMW okayed the oils SF and beyond, an expansion of the conventional sf, SG, sh limits.
    good on ya.

    not a clue as to your "why BMW...?" question.
    Ride Safe, Ride Lots

  14. #14
    moenko
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    I bought my bike from an engineer who has done some independent testing with engine oils, together with a few colleagues. He said they placed a tiny bit of oil into a metal saucer and lowered a heavy metal ball to make contact with that saucer. Then they spun the ball for hours at very high speeds and low speeds intermittently.

    His words: "Pretty much all other oils tested started to smoke, except Amsoil!" One of the oils were the BMW branded stuff.

    Since I'm not an expert in the field but had that oil in all other bikes I've ever owned, that's my choice for the Beemer, too. I change it once every year with (crossout 5W20) 10W40 and use Amsoil 75W90 for tranny and final drive as well. Obviously it meets or exceeds any oil standards required for the bike.
    Last edited by moenko; 08-08-2012 at 10:57 AM.

  15. #15
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    Moenko- did I read that right? 5W20 in your oilhead?
    Ride Safe, Ride Lots

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