Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 43

Thread: Another "Left Turn Death" here in Maine....

  1. #16
    Registered User greenwald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Sheboygan, WI
    Posts
    3,467

    Cool

    "The deadliest killing force ever assembled ...... The American Driver!"

    Looked at NHTSA stats for a 50 year period starting at the year of my birth (1953).

    Over 2,077,000 fatalities on US roads.

    About 360,000 more since then.

    Pogo hit the nail on the head with his infamous comment.
    Last edited by Greenwald; 06-23-2012 at 08:10 PM.
    Kevin Greenwald - Touring Tips Editor
    Nationally Certified Law Enforcement Motor Officer (Ret.) / IBA Member #34281
    MSF RiderCoach # 121656 (BRC,SBRC,IS,IME,SMARTrainer)
    Motorcycle/Driving Instructor - ROAD AMERICA Race Track

  2. #17
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Reno, NV
    Posts
    1,962
    I am not all that sure the problem is seeing us in traffic; rather it is if what is seen actually registers in the passive unskiled brain of many drivers. By "passive', I mean there is not an overriding belief, coupled with action, that they are active participants in driving with others.
    The "passive" driver has no sense of personal responsibility on the road, relying instead on ideas like; we are all licensed; we have the latest crash tests behind us; our vehicle got that 13th air bag this year; my vehicle is big; I can "win" in court so there is no such thing as "dead wrong"; the governemnt cares about me and gave me that third brakelight, or took away my headlight switch; etc etc so everything is OK, as substitutes for active personal responsibility and safety.
    The licensing surely has deteriorated too; I was shocked to discover you don't even need to be able to parallel park to get one.I guess the SUV manufacturers won that battle!
    Wherever possible I slow down, or speed up, to use any pack of cars around to run interference for me at these intersections. I even choose alternate routes if a given route has lots of driveways or intersections. I also use my retrofit headlight switch to get attention, versus the now ubiquitous and thus ignored lights on all the time; even cages have daytime running lights these days. I also will weave bike when approaching alone a car at intersection. I also visualise my potential path to the right of such a vehicle (my left) in case they do go. Always seeing alternate paths is something I was taught!
    As to when avoidance fails, I have hardwired into my brain a skill, which once upon a time was taught, to stand up on pegs if crash is imminent. This helps kick bike away, and also tends to move point of impact away from head or torso, to legs, thus sparing vitals. It also can mean difference between slamming directly into a vehicle, versus rolling over hood. A friction or offset roll injury is way better than blunt force trauma!
    Those of you who haven't had a severe wreck trust me; the slow motion you experience does give you a tad extra "time"; the mental hardwiring you do gives your brain that answer when it is hunting, rather than freezing into sheer panic. To paraphrase, you will ride how you train. So work that wonderful piece of safety equipment; your mind!

  3. #18
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Northern Front Range, CO
    Posts
    6,437
    Quote Originally Posted by jforgo View Post
    As to when avoidance fails, I have hardwired into my brain a skill, which once upon a time was taught, to stand up on pegs if crash is imminent. This helps kick bike away, and also tends to move point of impact away from head or torso, to legs, thus sparing vitals. It also can mean difference between slamming directly into a vehicle, versus rolling over hood. A friction or offset roll injury is way better than blunt force trauma!
    Those of you who haven't had a severe wreck trust me; the slow motion you experience does give you a tad extra "time"; the mental hardwiring you do gives your brain that answer when it is hunting, rather than freezing into sheer panic. To paraphrase, you will ride how you train. So work that wonderful piece of safety equipment; your mind!
    one problem with this thinking is in the estimation of "imminent".
    what for some might be "imminent", to others could be "still have time to execute avoidance manuvers." and trying to execute a hard swerve or braking activity could be severely impeded by standing on the pegs.
    Ride Safe, Ride Lots

  4. #19
    Dum vivimus vivamus ted's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    2,587
    I have taken to doing a little in-lane weave with a high beam flash when approaching a car turning left, it is sort of automatic now. Seems to get most folks' attention. A Kissan or driving lights would help as well (lights added to future farkle list...)
    Ted
    "A good stick is a good reason"
    1994 K75RT
    Moto Pages

  5. #20
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Reno, NV
    Posts
    1,962
    Quote Originally Posted by bikerfish1100 View Post
    one problem with this thinking is in the estimation of "imminent".
    what for some might be "imminent", to others could be "still have time to execute avoidance manuvers." and trying to execute a hard swerve or braking activity could be severely impeded by standing on the pegs.
    Yes, that is a very tough call; when is it time to "fold"? Effective avoidance must take priority, of course. This is why I think it is important to run scenarios over and over again in your mind, so you know what to do. And you will then tend to have more "time" to do something about a situation.
    Someone on here once said the best time to shed speed is before you have to.

  6. #21
    MOA,RA,ABC,AMA,TT,MOAL brownie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Pensacola, FL
    Posts
    565

    Exclamation Crash Discussion

    Excellent discussion on causes/defensive equipment & techniques, etc......the only $0.02 I would add is that too many motorcyclists (that includes "bikers") have too much faith in the mindless people (all ages/colors/sizes/gender) that we are forced to share the roads with.....I assume that most of us are fairly normal, well behaved people......who WANT to trust fellow humans.......BUT......IMHO there has to be a change in mindset when we get near these wonderful people on the roads...I wish the motorcycle training schools would emphasize this concept........

    ......once we have it in our heads that these people (cagers) are going to do whatever is easiest/quickest for them to do...we are on the right track to surviving.......I might like some of the drivers on the road...but I still don't trust 'em! Sorry for rant.....I'ma ATG kinda rider with modulators...bring it on.....
    Heed NEAD: No Egos, Attitudes, Distractions!!!!!
    Shep Brown MOA 27510
    "Igor" 82 RS "Inga" 04RT
    Pensacola, Flairider

  7. #22
    neanderssance man sedanman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Beacon, NY
    Posts
    534
    Guys, I have been the cager that almost killed a motorcyclist. Here's a link to the story. http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/showthre...a+motorcyclist. After this event, I have a much better understanding of how it can happen. There is also an excellent video on youtube describing SMIDSY, Sorry Man, I Didn't See You ! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqQBubilSXU
    Paul
    "Friends don't let friends ride junk!"
    2011 R1200RT

  8. #23
    Out There Somewhere bmwrider88's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Harrisburg, PA
    Posts
    940
    Quote Originally Posted by rsbeemer View Post
    I've been riding for over 40 years and had a few close calls when I was young; they were mostly my fault. But, in the last couple of years I have had more than a few close calls and most were due to people on cell phones and young inexperienced teenage drivers .

    Take both of those off the road and it would be much safer.

    DW
    Boy THAT'S a loaded statement for sure.
    Seems to me, that there's at least one populist movement AWAY from more government controls, not towards them. Wouldn't wanna mess with anyone's "freedom" now.... would we?

    OTOH-
    It seems that these same cell phone using, inexperienced drivers kill themselves and each other as often, if not MORE often that they kill us. But why enact specific laws or controls just for that?

    Darwinism isn't dead yet, after all, right?

    With all the technology available to us in the 21st century, when will every motor vehicle become equipped with an unbreakable electronic block on all mobile devices?
    Oh wait. There's that government control issue again.
    Call me cynical.


    (BTW this is neither a personal attack or a political statement- and I've no intention of having it seem like either of the two. I'm "jus sayin" )

    Cheers!

  9. #24
    Registered User AKsuited's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    New York State
    Posts
    602
    Quote Originally Posted by sedanman View Post
    There is also an excellent video on youtube describing SMIDSY, Sorry Man, I Didn't See You ! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqQBubilSXU
    It's astonishing that he can put on a video about SMIDSY and then wears black from head to toe! He is dismissing the findings of the Hurt Report, the MAIDS Report and the Wells Report which all conclude that low conspicuity of riders contributes to higher accident rates.

    Screw the weaving: wear a white helmet and something hi-viz.

    Harry
    2003 R1150RT - Silver

  10. #25
    Registered User AKsuited's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    New York State
    Posts
    602
    Another "SMIDSY" video:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdoKKElaPHY

    Harry
    2003 R1150RT - Silver

  11. #26
    neanderssance man sedanman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Beacon, NY
    Posts
    534
    One last thought before bed (Have be on th jobsite a 4 am this week) , I'd like to see a study on hi vis clothed riders on moduolator equipped bikes who ride like they're in a disney movie and everyone is friends with everyone else,
    VS.
    The dressed in black contingent on blacked out bikes with loud pipes who ride like the cagers are out to get them

    It would be interesting to see which attributes made the bikes more protected from carnage.
    Paul
    "Friends don't let friends ride junk!"
    2011 R1200RT

  12. #27
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Maryland.
    Posts
    150

    Google robot cars will save us

    I am seriously longing for the google robotic car. If all cars become robotic, at least the other driver would be more predictable than a deer.

  13. #28
    Smoooooth at 430 gch71's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Katy, Texas
    Posts
    173

    Instant speed bump

    Straight porker type pipes, loud, don't do a damn thing except piss everyone else off and give the driver and passenger a future filled with hearing aids.
    *I had them on my Harley when I got hit, it was in 98' Cocoa Bch FL. The 83 year old lady thought she hit a speed bump (I guess she did....me). She made the infamous left turn right in front of me as i was minding my own business driving southbound doing 45 mph. All I could do was what Wayne Gardner, Freddie Spencer and my wonderful older brother told me once..."if for sure your going down, go limp like a drunk". It was 95 degrees on a sunny day on a Harley yet I was still wearing my full facial Shoei, gloves, long pants and my faithfully out of style (until this accident) leather jacket. The only thing I could control was where was I going to hit her, no time to slide she would've run over me anyways. Hit the side panel by the rear wheel of her car and flew 35 feet in the middle of A1A right in front of Ron Jon surf shop....lots of tourists taking pictures only three people came to my help until the ambulance showed up. Their advice paid off, and the helmet was a definite life saver if I didn't have it on I would not be here the whole side lower front face was scratched and busted, same with the gloves, jacket and boots. Walked*out of the hospital three hours later with a bruised ego, bruised (from bending the frame) legs and arms nothing else!...The bike was wellllll let's just say everything was replaced except the engine. Sold it a year later for what I bought it for and decided then and there that I'll only drive an airhead. It took me a few months to get back in the saddle, I'm back and loving it, just now I reallllllllllly look at that left oncoming traffic on top of all the other idiots around me. Texting, talking on a cell or eating does piss me off and sends me into orbit, I just wish those people would only realize just how distracted they are but they don't, our society of know it alls and have it now will never learn unless it happens to them.
    By the way her insurance paid for everything and I did forgive her, I didn't sue didn't want any of that, I just wanted my bike back. I wanted peace in my heart and karma does go around...... Well my dear brother you were right about being a motorcycle nut,"there are those that have and those that will eventually, but you will drop a bike sooner or later".
    Glenn
    ...driving to work on my airhead
    '74 R60/6, '75 R60/6(boxes)

  14. #29
    Registered User AKsuited's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    New York State
    Posts
    602
    Quote Originally Posted by sedanman View Post
    I'd like to see a study on hi vis clothed riders on moduolator equipped bikes who ride like they're in a disney movie and everyone is friends with everyone else,
    VS.
    The dressed in black contingent on blacked out bikes with loud pipes who ride like the cagers are out to get them
    There is no such study, but here's the closest thing:

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC387473/

    Conclusions Low conspicuity may increase the risk of motorcycle crash related injury. Increasing the use of reflective or fluorescent clothing, white or light coloured helmets, and daytime headlights are simple, cheap interventions that could considerably reduce motorcycle crash related injury and death.

    I strongly suspect that all these people who think black is the way to go on a bike have never read any motorcycle accident studies...

    Harry
    Last edited by AKsuited; 06-25-2012 at 02:34 PM.
    2003 R1150RT - Silver

  15. #30
    Unfunded content provider tommcgee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Braintree, MA
    Posts
    3,087
    Another fatal in Massachusetts yesterday.


    Motorcyclist killed, passenger hurt in Foxborough crash
    06/24/2012 10:47 PM

    By Evan Allen, Globe Correspondent

    A man was killed and a woman left in critical condition after a van and motorcycle collided in Foxborough late Sunday afternoon, according to Foxborough Police.

    The driver of the van, 24-year-old Adam Cobb of Foxborough, has been charged with motor vehicle homicide, negligent operation of a motor vehicle, and failure to yield to oncoming traffic.

    The accident occurred just after 4 p.m. at the intersection of Central Street and Leonard Street, when a 2001 Chevrolet van collided with a 2006 Harvey Davidson motorcycle. The man driving the motorcycle was taken to Sturdy Memorial Hospital, where he was pronounced dead, and his female passenger was airlifted to Mass General Hospital in critical condition.

    Both victims were in their 60s, according to police, who were not releasing their names pending family notification.

    Cobb was being held on $10,000 bail pending his arraignment in Wrentham District Court on Monday, according to police.
    Salty Fog Rally 2007, 2009, 2011, 2012, AND LOOKING FORWARD TO 2014!

    -Tom (KA1TOX)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •