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Thread: Another one of those rebuild stories R50/5

  1. #151
    Registered User lmo1131's Avatar
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    Barrett, if you have never been into the /5 ignition switch you will find it a marvel of 18th century engineering.

    I removed mine when I disassembled my headlight nacelle to paint it and I don't think I want to risk doing it again. The tabs that hold the board in place get work-hardened every time you bend them and breaking one off would mean buying a "new" nacelle. Anyway, I'd bet it isn't the switch at this point... unless you've had it apart. Hopefully it's just a non-connection.

    Duane Aushermann has a pretty good write up on it, with pics. Of these are two.

    "back side" (viewable from interior of nacelle)
    three mounting tabs visible


    "inside" of switch (as seen when removed)
    tab mounting slots @ 1,5,7,11 o'clock [positions



    Here's some more > http://penforhire.wordpress.com/2007...l-me-abrasive/

    "It is what you discover, after you know it all, that counts." _ John Wooden

    Lew Morris
    1973 R75/5 - original owner

  2. #152
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    Lew,
    Thanks for the direction.
    I was actually lead to the 5United Yahoo group page and did a search for starter relay. There, someone had posted this schematic. There were no others on that page but maybe some others do exist elsewhere??

    BoxerBruce,
    Thanks for the idea. That seems very plausible. I'm going to look into to that once I get this bike running. I've got a week until it's a bring/no bring down to Massachusetts for our 4th of July holiday. If I can get it running I'll bring it down for the week in the back of my truck. If it's not running by then, well, it will be a boring week.

    As for the power issue:
    After studying the schematic I realized it was the dumbass connected to the wrench that's what was wrong. I noticed a red wire coming off the positive battery terminal that I had previously thought was a ground wire. Once I put it back where it belongs THERE WAS LIGHT!!
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  3. #153
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    But here's where it gets pear shaped. I pushed the bike outside and could get the starter to turn it over.....and over....and over.....aaaaand over, but it wouldn't start. I dropped the float bowls to see if there was fuel flowing and the bowls flowith over.

    Next, I pulled out the right plug to see if there was spark. Well that did something cause when I went to push the starter I had lost everything except the head light. No oil pressure light anymore, no neutral indicator light anymore, and no more starter. Just a head light.

    I've got the battery out now hooked up to the charger because I sure used a lot of juice with the first 5 minutes of attempting to get it started. But there's obviously enough juice to power the head light, why not the oil pressure light and the neutral indicator light???
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  4. #154
    Registered User lmo1131's Avatar
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    There were no others on that page but maybe some others do exist elsewhere??
    Barrett, when you log on, instead of going to Airheads look down to the bottom of The Garage page and click on Links & References, then click on Resources & Links. Inside Resources & Links, collected by our esteemed Administrator, is a treasure trove of information; about 2/3 of the way down the page you will find... .. nirvana (and quite a few wiring diagrams too).
    "It is what you discover, after you know it all, that counts." _ John Wooden

    Lew Morris
    1973 R75/5 - original owner

  5. #155
    Registered User lmo1131's Avatar
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    But there's obviously enough juice to power the head light, why not the oil pressure light and the neutral indicator light???
    Just a shot in the dark.. . . Look at your wiring diagram and notice the Green wire feeds (from the ignition switch #15 terminal) ... the Starter Protection Relay (via dual connector at the Horn), the Oil Pressure light, and the Neutral switch. And then think back to the high-tech terminal board, the one with all the set screws, that hook all these circuses together. It's very easy to "not" get a wire all the way into one side of this terminal block; if the screw doesn't get a good bite on the wire(s) you're, well, screwed.

    Edit - If you haven't spent a lot of time inside that head light bucket, I'd suggest you get to know it really well (it may save a ton of grief in the middle of nowhere some night). I spent hours routing and rerouting wires so they seemed to make some sense (to me). If you kind of blew through the wiring of this bike, I'd suggest pulling the headlight out and taking another look, with an eye on making sure the terminal connections are all secure.

    You didn't say... did the spark go away too, are do you know if you even had spark? If no spark, you may want to recheck your coil connection, and possibly pull the front cover and recheck your point gap (if the point don't open you'll not have a spark).

    One thing at a time.
    "It is what you discover, after you know it all, that counts." _ John Wooden

    Lew Morris
    1973 R75/5 - original owner

  6. #156
    Monza Blue 1974 R90/6
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    Well, electrical problems are my least favorite, so I don't envy you.

    I can't offer any better tips than what has been provided above, but I can offer encouragement. The bike looks great and will be a great rider one you have ironed out the kinks.

    Regards,

    Barron

  7. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lmo1131 View Post
    You didn't say... did the spark go away too, are do you know if you even had spark?
    Thanks for the advise. Really helpful as I am clueless for a direction.
    Once I pulled the plug there was no spark....but there was no turning over either. Once I pulled that plug the turning over stopped. Coincidence?
    I did install a new main wiring harness but that's pretty much it for time spent inside the headlight bucket. Whatever went wrong with ignition was fine for the first 5 minutes.
    I'll check a few of the things you suggest.

    FYI I haven't wired anything in the ass end yet as I'll be getting a brake light/turn indicators/state plate bracket fabricated after I get it running.
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  8. #158
    Registered User kentuvman's Avatar
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    Hey Barrett,

    I commend you for all you've done to this bike and how far you've gone!

    My '82 R65LS project was incredibly tedious because she needed EVERYTHING!

    I reached a point where I decided to ask for help when I got to the point you are at now. I hated asking for help because I really wanted to do this myself but I realized I was over my head and my patience ran out.

    Looking back, I'm glad I sought help because there were a number of things done incorrectly that could have been a disaster if I'd kept on going - by disaster, I mean a problem that more money could fix but turning to experienced Airhead mechanic eliminated havoc. Mine does not have a kick starter and the starter wouldn't turn - one of the problems was a bad relay. Carbs were another and there were others.

    I love following your thread and know you're really close to getting this classic back in service again.

    Respectfully,

    Ken

  9. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by kentuvman View Post

    I reached a point where I decided to ask for help when I got to the point you are at now. I hated asking for help because I really wanted to do this myself but I realized I was over my head and my patience ran out.
    Ken,

    Thanks for the perspective.
    You're right.
    As much as I'd love to do this myself I'm going to hold out till the next one to learn and provide what this one needs to get back on the road at this point. I realize it may need something stupid simple but the year anniversary of purchasing my Mistress is two days away and this is the longest I've not ridden a BMW (November till now) in 10 years. I've developed a twitch every time I pass a bike on the road.
    As much as my pride hurts to admit, it's time to call in reinforcements.
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  10. #160
    Registered User lmo1131's Avatar
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    Barrett, you should be able to check for spark using the kick starter; both plugs out and make sure they're grounded.

    If you purchased a new wiring harness, the wires used in them are slightly smaller than the original 70's vintage issue. As a result, sometimes they are not gripped well in the terminal block... at least that's what I found when I replaced the harness on my /5.

    The rat's nest in the headlight is like learning to adjust valves on a Volkswagen ... you're laying on your back, under the car, with your arms extended over your head, it's tight quarters, blah, blah, blah... but once you've done it a few times it gets easier. I'd spend some time in there checking to see if all the wire ends are still secure in the terminal block. Having the starter quit when you pulled a plug sounds coincidental to me...

    Do you have a simple continuity tester?

    "It is what you discover, after you know it all, that counts." _ John Wooden

    Lew Morris
    1973 R75/5 - original owner

  11. #161
    Registered User kentuvman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barrettnjones View Post
    Ken,

    Thanks for the perspective.
    You're right.
    As much as I'd love to do this myself I'm going to hold out till the next one to learn and provide what this one needs to get back on the road at this point. I realize it may need something stupid simple but the year anniversary of purchasing my Mistress is two days away and this is the longest I've not ridden a BMW (November till now) in 10 years. I've developed a twitch every time I pass a bike on the road.
    As much as my pride hurts to admit, it's time to call in reinforcements.
    Barrett:
    I've learned these bikes are deceivingly deceptive - what I mean is, I figured when I acquired my R65, there would be nothing to a bike like this compared to the current fuel injected and computerized bikes BUT I was wrong.
    Paying an airhead professional to get her going served me well - I'd done most of the work so really what was left amounted to a lot of fine tuning. Paul Glaves said it well:

    ÔÇ£Remember Ken, the first 90 percent of the work takes 90 percent of the time, and the last 10 percent of the work takes the other 90 percentof the time.ÔÇØ

    You've got a very fine bike, Barrett. I'm sure you'll be riding her soon! You have a lot to be proud of!

  12. #162
    Registered User RINTY's Avatar
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    ...these bikes are deceivingly deceptive...kentuvman
    +1. I once shorted the points I had installed on an R50 that I was sellling for a friend. Luckily, my neighbour was an AME.

    Barrett:

    Your tech will have that non start diagnosed in no time, and then you can start riding that beautiful thing. Let us know what it was.
    Rinty

    "When you don't know where you're going, any road will get you there."

  13. #163
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    My tech is the closest authorized BMW dealer, Frank's in Essex. Lester is the owner while Frank was his father. Locals here tend to be very opinionated about Lester and his 'dealership.' I put that in quotes because having been to BMW dealerships in San Fransisco, Atlanta, Charlotte, Max's, and Bob's I'm inclined to disqualify Frank's as an actual dealership by comparison. But based on the facts that he sells new bikes, has certified mechanics on staff, and charges an arm and a leg I'm might call him a dealership.

    I have a love hate relationship with the place. It's the only thing Vermont has within a 100 mile radius and I've purchased two brand new bikes from Lester in the past. I've been, and still am, completely satisfied with both purchases. But with any trade-in dealings, insurance claims they've been a part of, or being told what I do or do not want or need, Ive been less than satisfied.

    Lester has a business to run and money to make. I've always felt if you don't watch out, he'll make more money off of you than you perceived he would or could.

    That said, he now has my bike and after a preliminary examination before that closed for the holiday, he said that it appears I got the timing chain off by a tooth. That might explain why it wouldn't start before it went all dead but it isn't a good explanation of why the bike went dead when I was checking the plug for spark. I'm wary of the diagnosis because I'm sure I installed the new chain correctly. I had a buddy there helping and he's an engineer and all around pulsating brain.

    After the holiday he'll be taking a closer look at it and I'll be sure to let you, helpful denizens of the MOA airhead threads, know of any furthur prognosis.

    I hope everyone is either enjoying this 4th of July with more family than you ever thought possible and/or riding the hell out of your motorbike.
    I sure miss mine.

  14. #164
    Rally Rat
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    Another one

    There's a guy in Vermont, Bud Provin, who belongs to the Vermont club, and has an independent shop. he was formerly the lead mechanic at Bob"s BMW, and really knows his stuff! You might want to check him out.
    Boxerbruce

  15. #165
    Monza Blue 1974 R90/6
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    +1 on Mr. Provin. Not sure how close you are to Pittsford, but if you aren't confident with your current shop, I'd say it would be worth an extra hundred miles to visit Bud.

    Check it out -

    http://thenickwackettgarage.com/bmw/


    Barron

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