Car tires on rear

[GTRider]

Toe-in should be the same. When they set the bike up at Hannigan's they use 8' fluorescent tubes as they are perfectly straight. One tube bungied to the rear wheel, one to the hack wheel. The rear wheel line is parallel with the bike. The front wheel does not come into play as it is inside the rear wheel line with the stock wheel position or my spaced out wheel. The spaced out wheel just moves the line over, still parallel to the bike. The angle of the sidecar wheel (toe-in) remains the same.

I appreciate the concern. We did a 60 mile loop this morning and the ride feels the same, no issues with pulling to either side on a straight road. A bit more stable and less tippy on right handers. I do have shocks and springs ordered for all three wheels,the stockers are way to weak. I know I will have to adjust lean out after they are installed.

It's great that your rig is handling AOK on the new setup. I still feel that moving the rear wheel to the left will effectively increase toe-in on the rig. However, too much toe-in won't necessarily have a noticeably bad effect on handling, just decrease fuel mileage and tire life. Shooting toe-in on a stock rig usually assumes that the wheels are aligned with, and on, the bike's centerline--and it's the two centerlines, one through the bike's wheels and the other through the rig's wheel, that define how much toe-in is present. Have a look at http://www.sidecar-industry.com/techpages.htm as a picture is worth a thousand words. So, if you put the light tubes back on your bike after shifting the rear wheel to the left then you might find the same toe-in measurement to be present, but the effective toe-in--defined by the three contact patches--will be different. IMHO, of course.

But anyway, you've tested the rig and it's handling to your satisfaction so enjoy it! I'd keep an eye for wear on that third wheel and see if it starts trying to tell you something, tho.


Best,

GTRider

[Bobmws]

It's great that your rig is handling AOK on the new setup. I still feel that moving the rear wheel to the left will effectively increase toe-in on the rig. However, too much toe-in won't necessarily have a noticeably bad effect on handling, just decrease fuel mileage and tire life. Shooting toe-in on a stock rig usually assumes that the wheels are aligned with, and on, the bike's centerline--and it's the two centerlines, one through the bike's wheels and the other through the rig's wheel, that define how much toe-in is present. Have a look at http://www.sidecar-industry.com/techpages.htm as a picture is worth a thousand words. So, if you put the light tubes back on your bike after shifting the rear wheel to the left then you might find the same toe-in measurement to be present, but the effective toe-in--defined by the three contact patches--will be different. IMHO, of course.

But anyway, you've tested the rig and it's handling to your satisfaction so enjoy it! I'd keep an eye for wear on that third wheel and see if it starts trying to tell you something, tho.


Best,

GTRider

OK, gotcha, bike's centerline, thanks for clearing that up for me.
Total shift to the left was only 4mm, 2 shims added to the stock single shim. I will watch the hack tire for signs of uneven wear.
I have new shocks & springs (Hyperpro & YSS) coming for all 3 wheels. The stockers on the bike are woefully inadequate for hack use, and I've been told the shock supplied with the hack will be noticeably less responsive when I have good shocks on the bike. I know at the very least I will be adjusting leanout when they are installed.
Shocks are due the beginning of April, I've made arrangements to get the hack body painted to match that week. That will make the shock install easier.
I'll report back after the install and realignment. Thanks again for the advice.

[04gt4me]

I had verygood success with a C Stanley Motorsports Wheel adapter and the supplied wheel. I get a nice smooth ride and it looks great. Contact Claud at http://freedomsidecars.com, or phone him @ 570-837-5120. He is a very nice guy and has been doing this for a long time and should be able to answer any questions you may have. Pat

[Bobmws]

I had verygood success with a C Stanley Motorsports Wheel adapter and the supplied wheel. I get a nice smooth ride and it looks great. Contact Claud at http://freedomsidecars.com, or phone him @ 570-837-5120. He is a very nice guy and has been doing this for a long time and should be able to answer any questions you may have. Pat

I've spoken with Claude about the adapter. You're right, he is very knowledgeable and accessible. As I already have a car tire mounted on the stock wheel, I'll see how this one works out before I invest in the adapter/auto wheel route.

For now I have to pay for the new shocks.

[GTRider]

You will like the change from the upgraded shocks. I already had Wilbers on my GT when I added the car and the shocks are great but I still think I need to bump up to the next heavier spring. Then add a sway bar, then add a..... I guess it never ends!


Did you have the steering conversion installed when the car was mounted?

Best,

GTRider

[Bobmws]

Yes I have the trail reducer, which lowered the front of the bike a bit. There is a spacer added to the front shock for more preload and the rear is adjusted all the way up. With the stock shocks & springs I have 3 3/8" total drop in the front and 3 3/4" drop in the rear. This is from full extension, bike jacked up, to me sitting on it,

As for a sway bar, Hannigan doesn't offer it on the street models, only the dual sport and the HP rigs. I've spoken with Claude Stanley about this and it can be done, but requires raising the hack body, or cutting into it.
For now I'll settle for good shocks & springs.......

[michaelcurrin]

Here's the sway bar I built for my K1100RS / EML

No cutting or rasing the hack body, at least on mine, not sure about yours

http://hpsidecars.com/Projects/MikeC...rinSwayBar.htm

[Bobmws]

Here's the sway bar I built for my K1100RS / EML

No cutting or rasing the hack body, at least on mine, not sure about yours

http://hpsidecars.com/Projects/MikeC...rinSwayBar.htm

Thanks Mike! That gives me more fodder for future plans. That will definitely be a project for post suspension upgrades and some more experience on my part!

I think Claude's issue with raising the body was to get the bar above the frame, but I don't initially see any issue with mounting similar to yours.

It's not like I'll be offroading on Jeep trails!

I've bookmarked your page, have to visit the HP site too. I may link your page to my discussion on ADVrider, that should be interesting.......

[michaelcurrin]

Bob,

Looking at it from a bang for the buck perspective the sway bar was the best thing I did to my rig.

The center hub steering was a big improvement, but involved lots of money, work, and time.

Mike

[Bobmws]

I'm pretty sure the bar will happen for me. I don't even want to think about a full HP rig with center steering.
I'll be thrilled when the new shocks & springs get here!

For those who wondered about the speedo with the new tire, it reads a consistant 10% high vs the GPS. A bit more than the standard BMW optimism!
RPM's seem to be about 200-300 higher.

I'll see how this goes through the life of this tire, then decide on the car wheel adapter or keep this setup.

[psikora]

As I try to put together a rig, one thing I want to do and need advice on is related to getting a car wheel for the rear of the bike. What are some things to think about when trying to decide on which size rim for your rear?

What are the pluses and minuses for a 15", 16", or 17" wheel. Is it mostly related to what tires are available for the diameter that will actually fit on the bike?

I'm thinking that it makes sense to get as low profile a tire as possible to eliminate and swaying from too tall a tire. Is that much of a real-world concern given that I'm not looking to race around - just want a more modern rig?

Do I need to check that the rim has the same bolt hole pattern and distance, and spacers will take care of the offset? Or get anything and look into an adaptor?

I'm getting a R1200ST and a Hannigan Bandito. I'm looking to find a wheel for the rear that roughly matches the stock front wheel. I was hoping to do the same for the sidecar but apparently there's not too many options for the 12" 4 by 4" trailer wheel size that comes with the Bandito. Hannigan says there's no room change those dimensions. Too bad. I woulda had a shot at getting a 15" rim that would match the bike rear and get a low profile tire to get close to the original diameter.

Thanks,
phil

[grafikfeat]

I use the stock rim for the "C".
It's a 15"... Which is fine with me.

I'd rather have more rubber than rim.

[Bobmws]

As I try to put together a rig, one thing I want to do and need advice on is related to getting a car wheel for the rear of the bike. What are some things to think about when trying to decide on which size rim for your rear?

What are the pluses and minuses for a 15", 16", or 17" wheel. Is it mostly related to what tires are available for the diameter that will actually fit on the bike?

I'm thinking that it makes sense to get as low profile a tire as possible to eliminate and swaying from too tall a tire. Is that much of a real-world concern given that I'm not looking to race around - just want a more modern rig?

Do I need to check that the rim has the same bolt hole pattern and distance, and spacers will take care of the offset? Or get anything and look into an adaptor?

I'm getting a R1200ST and a Hannigan Bandito. I'm looking to find a wheel for the rear that roughly matches the stock front wheel. I was hoping to do the same for the sidecar but apparently there's not too many options for the 12" 4 by 4" trailer wheel size that comes with the Bandito. Hannigan says there's no room change those dimensions. Too bad. I woulda had a shot at getting a 15" rim that would match the bike rear and get a low profile tire to get close to the original diameter.

Thanks,
phil

Phil,
I don't know what size rim your Oil head has, but my K has a 5.5" x 17" rear rim. The tire I mounted is the only size that would fit the rim (bitch to mount) and clear the radius on the swingarm. It is about 1" shorter than the stock bike tire. The flat profile feels much more stable, but I'm not sure if I will stay with this in the future or go to a standard auto rim with an adapter from Claude Stanley here His standard adapter uses a 15x4 rim and a VW size tire. Lots of experience and comments on it at the Hacks Forum on ADVrider.
I don't know if I have enough experience to comment on the sway of a low profile tire vs a standard, but unless you are doing a radical front end change you will be running a bike tire on the front wheel.
I would recommend getting your bike shocks & springs setup correctly for the weight of the rig, then go from there. I did a car tire on the stock rim because I needed a tire at the time. As I said earlier, I don't know if I will stay this course at the next change or not. There's nothing cut and dry about this, it all seems to be knowledge gained by experience.

[psikora]

On my rig I also went with an adapter from Claude Stanley

Do you remember how thick the adaptor is?

[michaelcurrin]

Do you remember how thick the adaptor is?

Not offhand, it was a few years ago.

Claude would know