Does BMW need a water cooled boxer?

[SeabeckS]

That R1200R is a sweet looking ride! I tend to like motorcycles with an exposed engine and framework more than bikes with boatloads of plastic...that 12R with the wire wheels and paint job is a very classy ride...!

Okay, now that I've done the compliments...could you please send me some of that San Diego sunshine? LOL

Since I am not financially able to own two bikes at once, I'm a bit envious of a guy who owns an RT and an R! My 1100S is sort of a compromise, but I had a 1150R for a few years and really liked the relatively light weight and quick handling. A year or so after selling that machine to acquire my S, I had the opportunity to ride a 12R as a loaner while my S was in the shop. That 12R was by far a superior machine to the 1150R. If I'd ridden a 12R prior to finding my S...who knows...? LOL

Cheers!

[kbasa]

BMW did not make an 1150S, the 1100S was superceded by the R1200S, which is a horse of a vastly different color than the 1100S.

FYI, wet weight of an R1100S is 230kg, 506 pounds.

If I recall correctly, BMW of South Africa, under the direction of Pieter de Waal, actually built and offered an R1150S. I seem to recall it getting a displacement change, a Laser exhaust and some other bits.

[SeabeckS]

Dave,

That's one I never heard of...but then I don't live in S. Africa! LOL

Do you know if they ever sold any of those in North America? Not that I'd actually look for one. My 11S is plenty fast enough for this old dude...just curious.

Cheers!

[bikerfish1100]

If I recall correctly, BMW of South Africa, under the direction of Pieter de Waal, actually built and offered an R1150S. I seem to recall it getting a displacement change, a Laser exhaust and some other bits.

San Jose BMW did that very thing. My buddy bought a new 2004 from SJ, and before ever taking delivery (he lives in CT) he had them build it into an 1150.
nice addtion, but not much more than what going to a Laser chip and exhaust did for my stock motor 11S. and clearly, not what the R12 is either.

[MarkM]

I Googled "bmw r1150s" and found this one.



Not really an 1150S, but a cool custom job. More photos and info here (in German):
http://www.1000ps.at/modellnews-2265372-BMW_R_1100_S

[henzilla]

BMW did not make an 1150S, the 1100S was superceded by the R1200S, which is a horse of a vastly different color than the 1100S.

FYI, wet weight of an R1100S is 230kg, 506 pounds.

R12S- 470 lbs with full tank

[deilenberger]

Since nobody but BMW knows the real failure rate overall, I sincerely doubt anybody knows how many failures were prevented by getting debris out of the final drives with the first oil change.

True that BMW is the only real source of "data" for this.. but what I've observed is the daily/weekly reports of final-drive failures decreased to quite infrequent reports once the flush process was added to the 600 mile service. Annecdotal evidence for sure, but it seems fairly clear to me.

BTW - how did a water cooled boxer thread become a final-drive thread? : scratch

[deilenberger]

also:
think folks nowadays are riding farther & faster than ever before?
was the final drive on the Oilheads as bullet proof as on the Airheads & Ks?

By oilheads - you mean the R11XX series of bikes? They have an older design rear drive - closely shared with some K bike models.

As far as bullet-proof, I never found the airhead or K bike rear drives particularly bullet-proof. The airhead rear drive liked to eat the wheel/drive mating spline, and when it went it was capable of leaving you by the side of the road with an immobile bike. Early K bikes ate the input shaft splines on the rear drive (and the driveshaft splines that mated to them) on the monolever bikes due to a IMHO poorly designed driveshaft geometry (where there is angular/sliding force on the splines as the rear wheel went up and down.) In both cases it was a frequent enough failure that a small industry grew up around rebuilding the splines..

If anything the hexhead design has ended most of the driveshaft spline problems (by having dual universals working at the pivot axes of the paralever), and since the initial fluid flush was put in place - most of the rear drive problems. I really don't give mine a thought aside from oil changes at the suggested intervals.

Addition - I have heard of two failures of universal joints on the hexhead driveshafts (one happened to a friend as we were out riding actually..) That's considerably lower then the failure count for the oilhead GS that I know of - and in the case of my friend, he is a large person (not fat - just REALLY large) and he frequently rode 2 up long distances. That may have put the angle of the rear universals at a large working position where they might wear faster. Or not - it might have just been a bad universal joint (it happens..)

[johnnywishbone]

That R1200R is a sweet looking ride! I t........ide...!

Okay, now that I've done the compliments...could you please send me some of that San Diego sunshine? LOL

Since I am not financially able to own two bikes at once, I'm a bit envious of a guy who owns an RT and an R! ......... knows...? LOL

Cheers!

Seabeck: something to think about: i am old. for years, i worked whenever and where ever possible. a power plant construction whore. i worked 365 days one year. 10 hours minimum. got married saturday, went to work on monday. never took a vacation. being laid off was a vacation. i missed a lot. i am very small. i liked to work big pipe. i found small pipe boring. consequently, parts of my shoulders and back are junk. however, i can hold the master yoda riding position for hours on end.
i retired. the doctor told me i was in excellent shape. so, against my better judgment, i stopped drinking, smoking, and chewing tobacco. the money i saved, i spend on
these boxer twins. hahaha!
take care, J

[SeabeckS]

Johnny,

I hear ya, bro. My comment about only being financially able to own one bike is that I'm living on a limited income from disability insurance. Over a period of 8 years ( in the 90's) I had 9 heart surgeries. Hence the early retirement...it's good to still be top of the grass, rather than under it.

I suppose I could own 2 machines, but that would mean having to give something else up...and I'm having WAY too much fun to cut back...!

Take care...

[SeabeckS]

Oh, and to get back on topic...

I'd have NO problem with a water cooled boxer...as long as it looked as great as a 2004 grey/mandarin R1100S.

It seems somewhat obvious to me that for a variety of reasons, most street bikes are going to be watercooled fairly soon. Maybe a complexity/weight increase, but as "modern" bikes get more complex all the time, not sure we can turn that trend back.

Now...about the final drives...

[PGlaves]

Oh, and to get back on topic...

I'd have NO problem with a water cooled boxer...as long as it looked as great as a 2004 grey/mandarin R1100S.

It seems somewhat obvious to me that for a variety of reasons, most street bikes are going to be watercooled fairly soon. Maybe a complexity/weight increase, but as "modern" bikes get more complex all the time, not sure we can turn that trend back.

Now...about the final drives...

Maybe we need water cooled final drives. The temperature stability would decrease the pressure rise. It would add unsprung weight though. Hmm.

[easy]

BMW could even add a bunch of those misters to the windshield. Then we would have a true waterhead.

E

[johnnywishbone]

Oh, and to get back on topic...

I'd have NO problem with a water cooled boxer...as long as it looked as great as a 2004 grey/mandarin R1100S.

It seems somewhat obvious to me that for a variety of reasons, most street bikes are going to be watercooled fairly soon. Maybe a complexity/weight increase, but as "modern" bikes get more complex all the time, not sure we can turn that trend back.

Now...about the final drives...

harley davidson gave porsche gobs of money to come up with an engine. it's a good engine. nobody cares. the entire concept is a disaster. a failure financially.

porsche 911 or 930, or boxer twin, the purist will lean toward the air/oil cooled ones.

[SeabeckS]

Maybe we need water cooled final drives. The temperature stability would decrease the pressure rise. It would add unsprung weight though. Hmm.

Good point!!! LOL