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Thread: Does BMW need a water cooled boxer?

  1. #16
    Sir Darby Darryl Cainey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenwald View Post
    Sadly, all this a moot point unless BMW perfects a bullet-proof Final Drive.
    If you look at the spy shots the rear drive is on the other side, maybe they fixed the problem?
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  2. #17
    Registered User greenwald's Avatar
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by Mika View Post
    The one that will come with the R1250GS. My initial response to the OP used the WasserBoxer as a basis. We know nothing about it yet.

    For my tastes I find final drive rants as redundant and boring. I took your 'bullet proof' comment as the launching pad for yet another thread to go down that route. my experience in reading threads is no matter what BMW would do to make a final drive bullet prove the would come up at least 1 mile short of the 'acceptable' by that standard.

    I apologize for my knee jerk response to your post. I will exit the thread now.
    No need to apologize. I didn't take your witicisms as personal.

    As one of many (way too many) who has sufferred thru an expensive FD failure, forgive me if I do not share your optimism about the current state of affairs for BMW's shaft system engineering.

    I hope it is re-engineered when the R1250GS becomes a reality. Nothing personal, but unfortunately the posture of "I find final drive rants as redundant and boring" arguably helps prolong corporate BMW ignoring this issue.
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  3. #18
    Registered User greenwald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DARRYL CAINEY View Post
    If you look at the spy shots the rear drive is on the other side, maybe they fixed the problem?
    I hope so Darryl.

    However, BMW has flip-flopped the FD's on previous models (remember the GT?!) without any changes/improvements to the actual shaft system.

    We'll see.
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  4. #19
    Benchwrenching PGlaves's Avatar
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    Here is an article from Motorcycle.com.

    "Liquid-cooling allows a quicker warm-up time, reducing critical post-start-up emissions, while also lowering operating temps. This will help achieve stricter Euro 5 standards slated to begin in 2015. Liquid-cooling also enables increases in power, so along with a bump in displacement to around 1250cc, we expect a bump in power to compete against the latest batch of challengers to the adventure-touring throne."

    http://www.motorcycle.com/manufactur...iew-91202.html
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  5. #20
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    My quick thoughts...

    BMW needs a water cooled boxer for emissions and an HP crazed marketplace.

    Most riders, for how most ride, do not need a water cooled boxer.

  6. #21
    look out!!! Visian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenwald View Post
    Sadly, all this a moot point unless BMW perfects a bullet-proof Final Drive.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mika View Post
    And sadly you and others will continue to grouse about the poor quality of a new final drive unit that has not even hit the market yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by PGlaves View Post
    Here is an article from Motorcycle.com.

    "Liquid-cooling allows a quicker warm-up time, reducing critical post-start-up emissions, while also lowering operating temps. This will help achieve stricter Euro 5 standards slated to begin in 2015. Liquid-cooling also enables increases in power, so along with a bump in displacement to around 1250cc, we expect a bump in power to compete against the latest batch of challengers to the adventure-touring throne."

    http://www.motorcycle.com/manufactur...iew-91202.html
    In practical terms, watercooling will yield the power needed to haul more stuff faster.

    So yes, it's needed.

    Ian

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  7. #22
    Old man in the mountains osbornk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sfarson View Post
    My quick thoughts...

    BMW needs a water cooled boxer for emissions and an HP crazed marketplace.

    Most riders, for how most ride, do not need a water cooled boxer.
    Riders don't need a water cooled boxer unless they want a new boxer. Government regulations determine what we can buy.
    'You can say what you want about the South, but I almost never hear of anyone wanting to retire to the North.

  8. #23
    scqtt
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    my 1200gsa is too big & my 1150gsa is way too big.

    I never do two up or haul a lot of stuff.

    I hate the 800 GS, so it looks like I will get a Turnip 800 XC some day.

    I wish they would focus all their technology in another direction...bigger bigger bigger.....come on.

    How about a 1000cc Adventure with the same torque & HP as what we have now? How about it losing 50 lbs?

    I'm fine with peak 100 HP. How flat of a torque curve can you give it? How small of a package can you put it in?

    They have seemed to go the way of twin turbos for lots of low down grunt in their cars. What would happen if they concentrated their efforts on a small turbo for the 800?

  9. #24
    Registered User xp8103's Avatar
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    Or (GASP!) an 850?
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  10. #25
    not so retired henzilla's Avatar
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    just part of the evolution in engine designs...

    still don't know why they needed an oil cooler and gasp...4 valves per cylinder and FI in the 90's

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  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by SCQTT View Post
    my 1200gsa is too big & my 1150gsa is way too big.


    I wish they would focus all their technology in another direction...bigger bigger bigger.....come on.

    How about a 1000cc Adventure with the same torque & HP as what we have now? How about it losing 50 lbs?

    I'm fine with peak 100 HP. How flat of a torque curve can you give it? How small of a package can you put it in?
    I would have preferred they go this direction as well.
    14 R1200GSA, 93 R100R. No car is as fun to drive as any motorcycle is to ride.

  12. #27
    Benchwrenching PGlaves's Avatar
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    I'm waiting for the 1,000 cc scooter.
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  13. #28
    Focused kbasa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenwald View Post
    What 'new' final drive unit?

    Please enlighten us 'grousers.'
    The spy photos of the GS are showing, pretty clearly, a swing arm on the left side of the bike that from the outside appears to be all new.
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  14. #29
    Focused kbasa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xp8103 View Post
    Ah.... Of course.... I forgot about emissions. Because as we all know, it's about mpg and reducing fossil fuel use until it's about emissions, then it's about emissions, mpg be damned. This rant of course belongs more on the Diesel Truck Registry website than here but the concept is the same.
    Emissions and power are better able to be managed with the engine control systems we have now. The first step in having lower emissions is using less fuel in the first place. Less fuel = better mpg.

    At the same time, engine control systems can provide terrific mpg. Back 15 years ago, who would have predicted a 300HP Mustang that gets 31mpg on the highway?
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  15. #30
    Registered User greenwald's Avatar
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    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by kbasa View Post
    The spy photos of the GS are showing, pretty clearly, a swing arm on the left side of the bike that from the outside appears to be all new.
    I will keep my fingers crossed, and hopes high!
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