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Thread: Who do you blame

  1. #31
    Registered User xp8103's Avatar
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    "During the Membership survey which was conducted in early 2009 and concluded with a random focus group being surveyed at the 2009 Johnson City rally, the VAST majority of responders voted to keep the rally in July."

    I made the point in another thread that this was a few years out from the Lima Ohio rally which, by all accounts was miserably hot as well.

    To all of those who are searching for a better month, I suggest that you skirt the earlier dates as the May/June weather tends toward the wet in a large part of the country and we are as likely to run into a wet one as we were a hot one this year.

    While a September date might not be too bad, you start to conflict with several of the larger regional (and long standing) rallies - Finger Lakes over Labor Day, Vermont the weekend following, etc... as well as getting into the local, county and state fair season. Like the MOA rallies, fair folks start arriving early to set up and linger in take down so you'll likely find fair organizers may be hesitant to schedule in something like what the MOA does within a couple weeks of their own event. In effect you'll now be discounting OTHER parts of the country by moving the date to September to accommodate heat and the south west region.

    It has been well documented that a "moving target" is a recipe for disaster. There is enough case study on how well established events, both large and small, have crashed and burned when this was tried.
    Last edited by xp8103; 07-27-2011 at 03:35 PM.
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  2. #32
    Registered User Doubleplay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xp8103 View Post
    "During the Membership survey which was conducted in early 2009 and concluded with a random focus group being surveyed at the 2009 Johnson City rally, the VAST majority of responders voted to keep the rally in July."

    I made the point in another thread that this was a few years out from the Lima Ohio rally which, by all accounts was miserably hot as well.

    To all of those who are searching for a better month, I suggest that you skirt the earlier dates as the May/June weather tends toward the wet in a large part of the country and we are as likely to run into a wet one as we were a hot one this year.

    While a September date might not be too bad, you start to conflict with several of the larger regional (and long standing) rallies - Finger Lakes over Labor Day, Vermont the weekend following, etc... as well as getting into the local, county and state fair season. Like the MOA rallies, fair folks start arriving early to set up and linger in take down so you'll likely find fair organizers may be hesitant to schedule in something like what the MOA does within a couple weeks of their own event. In effect you'll now be discounting OTHER parts of the country by moving the date to September to accommodate heat and the south west region.

    It has been well documented that a "moving target" is a recipe for disaster. There is enough case study on how well established events, both large and small, have crashed and burned when this was tried.
    I respectfully disagree. BMW Rally is a big rally and will draw the same or even more riders from all parts of the country if the dates moved to a more pleasant time of the year such as early September. As far as crashing and burn it will never happen no matter where and when you held the rally. As I stated in an other thread I invite the board members to conduct a general poll(no more focus groups or calling 30 random members to make decisions) among the members.
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  3. #33
    Registered User Doubleplay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robnye View Post
    When you plan a week of vacation and the weather isn't perfect?

    If you ski and there's no snow the week you go, who do you blame?

    If you go to the beach and it rains who do you blame?

    If you go sailing and there is no wind who do you blame?

    Why do so many of you want to blame someone for a heat wave?
    In any of the above cases I would blame myself for poor planning and not choosing a better time period with better weather patterns.

    In the case of rally I blame organizers for not learning their lessons, and year after year holding the East coast rallies in the middle of the summer when heat and humidity sucks all the time.

    You don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure that out.
    2009 R1200GS LE

  4. #34
    Dum vivimus vivamus ted's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doubleplay View Post
    In the case of rally I blame organizers for not learning their lessons, and year after year holding the East coast rallies in the middle of the summer when heat and humidity sucks all the time.
    You are wrong. The last East Coast Rally, the 2009 Rally in Johnson City TN, also in July and about 400 miles SOUTH of Bloomsburg PA, was downright seasonable if even a bit on the cool side with temps in the low to mid-80's. I even heard some complaining of the low night-time temps.
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  5. #35
    Registered User xp8103's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doubleplay View Post
    As I stated in an other thread I invite the board members to conduct a general poll(no more focus groups or calling 30 random members to make decisions) among the members.
    As noted they did just that in 2009 using a membership survey and determined that the majority favored the July date. I'm sorry that that is not the answer you are looking for but it IS the answer to the question.
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  6. #36
    Old man in the mountains osbornk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted View Post
    You are wrong. The last East Coast Rally, the 2009 Rally in Johnson City TN, also in July and about 400 miles SOUTH of Bloomsburg PA, was downright seasonable if even a bit on the cool side with temps in the low to mid-80's. I even heard some complaining of the low night-time temps.
    I live near Johnson City and the secret to cool is altitude and not longitude or latitude. I went from a cool 2,400+' southern elevation to a very hot 700+' northern elevation in Bloomsburg. I called home and was told it was blistering hot (it got to the mid 90s). I got home and mowed my 3 acres yesterday at almost 90 degrees. After Bloomsburg, it didn't feel hot at all.
    'You can say what you want about the South, but I almost never hear of anyone wanting to retire to the North.

  7. #37
    Certifiable Old Fart beemerdons's Avatar
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    I am with you Doubleplay, I also respectfully disagree.

    Quote Originally Posted by Doubleplay View Post
    I respectfully disagree. BMW Rally is a big rally and will draw the same or even more riders from all parts of the country if the dates moved to a more pleasant time of the year such as early September. As far as crashing and burn it will never happen no matter where and when you held the rally. As I stated in an other thread I invite the board members to conduct a general poll(no more focus groups or calling 30 random members to make decisions) among the members.
    Hear, hear Doubleplay! My Son Seth, then 12, and his Daddy Don spent every single day of the Johnson City Rally on site, except for the organized day ride to Bush's Beans, and we were never polled or contacted regarding future dates!!!

    The time has fully come for a general poll! Not calling 30 people or a focus group!!
    Don Stanley; aka Chuy Medina "El Burrito Ballerina"
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  8. #38
    Registered User xp8103's Avatar
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    Seriously, should I have bolded it? Would that make it more visible?
    Nik #140220 - '88 K75C | '96 R1100RS | '77 R100RS | '06 DL650
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  9. #39
    Out There Somewhere bmwrider88's Avatar
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    yes but the entire point is:

    the simple fact is:

    the Rally is fully, wholly, and completely STAFFED BY VOLUNTEERS.
    IF YOU THINK YOU CAN DO IT BETTER OR HAVE A BETTER IDEA, THEN STAND UP AND TAKE THE LEAD.

    just think for one hot second about how seamless the rally was, in spite of all the heat and other potential difficulties.

    did you personally have a problem?
    was there not enough space?
    didn't you get enough to eat right on site?
    wasn't there plenty of beer?
    didn't the music suit you?
    weren't you welcomed in a hospitable manner at registration?
    wasn't the entire fairgrounds clean enough for you?
    weren't there enough vendors to cover your needs?
    DIDN'T THEY HAND OUT FREE WATER?
    i defy anyone to show me another single event where a bottle of water wouldn't have been 4.00 no matter what.

    guess what. in addition to mowing the grass, raising the kids, going to work every day, painting the house, fixing the car, and all the things that make up every day life, a SMALL HANDFUL of dedicated people put this MOA National Rally together so that several THOUSAND folks could come out and pretty much have everything they needed at their fingertips.

    and this small group of dedicated people do it year after year after year after year. FOR YOU.

    i know for a fact that the same guys have been running the beer operation for ever. to the point of exhaustion.
    it wouldn't surprise me at all to find out that it's the same in every department. so put your money where your mouth is and VOLUNTEER to do it *BETTER*.

    i guarantee that less than 1% of the *happy rally goers* were actually responsible for this entire event. many of the rest of us, it seems, take it all for granted.

    jus sayin.
    Last edited by bmwrider88; 07-27-2011 at 06:38 PM.

  10. #40
    rocketman
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    Quote Originally Posted by robnye View Post
    When you plan a week of vacation and the weather isn't perfect?

    If you ski and there's no snow the week you go, who do you blame?

    If you go to the beach and it rains who do you blame?

    If you go sailing and there is no wind who do you blame?

    Why do so many of you want to blame someone for a heat wave?
    I blame the Whether man cause he refused to tell me whether it would be nice out or not 10 months in advance!

    RM

  11. #41
    Debbie's Servant Lee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasman View Post
    During the Membership survey which was conducted in early 2009 and concluded with a random focus group being surveyed at the 2009 Johnson City rally, the VAST majority of responders voted to keep the rally in July.
    Chuck
    How many members were surveyed in 2009?
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  12. #42
    Rpbump USN RET CPO Rpbump's Avatar
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    Smile

    The Rally was "HOT". I joined a large group that sought relief in the river on Friday. The group of Venders was large, varied, and appreciated by me and fellow rally attendee's. It was nice that many venders were located in air conditioned spaces. The variety of food venders and reasonable prices was also appreciated. The misting tent and sprinklers gave welcome respite from the heat and bottled water was either free or $1 depending on where you looked. Looking back, I should have stayed in the College Dorms where you could sleep comfortably, eat at a nice facility, and use a free bus to/from the fairgrounds from early morning to 11:30PM. This was only my second BMW Rally and it was unfortunate that a major unexpected heat wave would dominate much of the country and affect our National Event. The heat bothered me to the point that I left on Saturday for sunny but cooler Jacksonville, FL. In the future I will try to attend Rallies held in cooler locations or spring/late fall as I can dress for the cold or wet but cannot undress enough for the heat (without getting arrested and affecting ATGATT ). This year I volunteered 4 hours at the registration tent and will do so again. Many THANKS to those who helped set up and run this Rally, you did a GREAT JOB.
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  13. #43
    look out!!! Visian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    Chuck
    How many members were surveyed in 2009?
    A total of 300 interviews were completed from a random telephone sample of BMW MOA members, generated from a membership list provided by BMW MOA.

    The margin of error for the survey was ??5.7%.

  14. #44
    look out!!! Visian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rpbump View Post
    This year I volunteered 4 hours at the registration tent....
    wow, guess you wound up about medium rare, eh?

    thanks for volunteering!

  15. #45
    Registered User MildBill's Avatar
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    How about this as a partial solution? Why not have the rallies in locations that are at least an elevation of 2500 feet? We could leave it in July and at least enjoy cool mornings and evenings.

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