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  1. #1
    Ritalin Poster Boy rob nye's Avatar
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    Who do you blame

    When you plan a week of vacation and the weather isn't perfect?

    If you ski and there's no snow the week you go, who do you blame?

    If you go to the beach and it rains who do you blame?

    If you go sailing and there is no wind who do you blame?

    Why do so many of you want to blame someone for a heat wave?

  2. #2
    Novice Adventurer Newstar's Avatar
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    Good question, Rob!

    (see my post on the GS Giant's FB page.)

    There is no one to blame. You deal with it, or you don't. Find an alternative. Go somewhere that has AC. Keep hydrated. Visit a swimming hole, stand under the mister. If all else fails, go home. But don't blame the volunteers as if they could have prevented such an occurence. Conserve energy by not whining.

  3. #3
    Benchwrenching PGlaves's Avatar
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    This post is not "blame" but part of the learning experience of BMW MOA.

    I can remember at least 4, maybe 5 rallies where the weather extremes were far from the typical or the average - and that doesn't include Loretta Lynn's way back when every body sat in the creek to keep from frying. In no particular order York, Durango, Spokane, and Lima (not to mention Bloomsburg) all were hotter than they were expected to be by enough degrees to make a difference. I can also remember a few which were much wetter than ought to have been expected.

    What MOA needs to have learned is that there really are two weather related questions that need to be asked when considering a possible facility for a rally.

    1. What is the weather expected to be?

    2. Is the facility adequate for a huge crowd if the weather is hotter, wetter, windier, or colder than average.

    As motorcyclists we do fairly well when it is cool in the summer, and even cope with wind fairly well. Most fair ground type facilities have sufficient roof space to keep people safe when it turns soaking rainy. But some facilities are old and tired and don't offer a very good refuge from triple digit heat and high humidity.

    Sometime about 50 or 60 years ago folks started a trend toward the widespread use of air conditioning in buildings used for crowds. The concept isn't new at all. It one thing to go to a fair, or a demolition derby, or a tractor pull for a few hours and then go home in the air conditioned car to the air conditioned house. It is quite another to set up the rally site, work around the site, maybe camp for 3 to 7 days, gear up and ride for transportation, and tear down the site in high heat and humidity with little on-site refuge from the weather.

    Every potential site needs to be looked at with this question in mind: Is this facility adequate for a crowd of several thousand campers if we get triple digit temperatures? When the answer is "no" MOA needs to move on to a less old and tired facility.

    Our First Aid folks and local emergency management officials ought not to have to worry about people dying, and we ought not need to send a dozen or so folks to the hospital.

    I know that I've given my last technical seminar for 3 hours in an overheated livestock barn or arena. It isn't fair to presenters and it isn't fair to attendees and it borders on a waste of my time and theirs.
    Last edited by PGlaves; 07-26-2011 at 01:14 PM.
    Paul Glaves - "Big Bend", Texas U.S.A
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  4. #4
    Outlander Omega Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PGlaves View Post
    This post is not "blame" but part of the learning experience of BMW MOA.

    I can remember at least 4, maybe 5 rallies where the weather extremes were far from the typical or the average - and that doesn't include Loretta Lynn's way back when every body sat in the creek to keep from frying. In no particular order York, Durango, Spokane, and Lima (not to mention Bloomsburg) all were hotter than they were expected to be by enough degrees to make a difference. I can also remember a few which were much wetter than ought to have been expected.

    What MOA needs to have learned is that there really are two weather related questions that need to be asked when considering a possible facility for a rally.

    1. What is the weather expected to be?

    2. Is the facility adequate for a huge crowd if the weather is hotter, wetter, windier, or colder than average.

    As motorcyclists we do fairly well when it is cool in the summer, and even cope with wind fairly well. Most fair ground type facilities have sufficient roof space to keep people safe when it turns soaking rainy. But some facilities are old and tired and don't offer a very good refuge from triple digit heat and high humidity.

    Sometime about 50 or 60 years ago folks started a trend toward the widespread use of air conditioning in buildings used for crowds. The concept isn't new at all. It one thing to go to a fair, or a demolition derby, or a tractor pull for a few hours and then go home in the air conditioned car to the air conditioned house. It is quite another to set up the rally site, work around the site, maybe camp for 3 to 7 days, gear up and ride for transportation, and tear down the site in high heat and humidity with little on-site refuge from the weather.

    Every potential site needs to be looked at with this question in mind: Is this facility adequate for a crowd of several thousand campers if we get triple digit temperatures? When the answer is "no" MOA needs to move on to a less old and tired facility.

    Our First Aid folks and local emergency management officials ought not to have to worry about people dying, and we ought not need to send a dozen or so folks to the hospital.

    I know that I've given my last technical seminar for 3 hours in an overheated livestock barn or arena. It isn't fair to presenters and it isn't fair to attendees and it borders on a waste of my time and theirs.
    Some of the well run trade shows that I attend use This portable air conditioner unit for situations like this.

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  5. #5
    Rally Rat Sue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omega Man View Post
    Some of the well run trade shows that I attend use portable generators...
    I wonder what those cost......
    Sue Rihn #43753
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  6. #6
    Rally Rat Sue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PGlaves View Post

    Every potential site needs to be looked at with this question in mind: Is this facility adequate for a crowd of several thousand campers if we get triple digit temperatures? When the answer is "no" MOA needs to move on to a less old and tired facility.
    Paul - you made some valid points.

    A few years ago, Rob Nye suggested we start rotating among locations we have already gone to, which had newer accommodations. (Redmond, Oregon; Burlington, VT; West Bend, WI to name three) Maybe it's time we revisit that concept.
    Sue Rihn #43753
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  7. #7
    Still Wondering mika's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robnye View Post
    When you plan a week of vacation and the weather isn't perfect?

    If you ski and there's no snow the week you go, who do you blame?

    If you go to the beach and it rains who do you blame?

    If you go sailing and there is no wind who do you blame?
    My former mother-in-law. (Worked for my ex too)

    My rounderometer temperature gague ranges from -6F to 117F so the grousing seems to fall on deafening ears here. Unfortunately the underlying issue raised by riders from some regions of the country is the July rally date seems to preclude them as a national rally candidate. The grousing about heat waves does not move the discussion along of how to either include those areas as national sites or develop regional events that would feature them to the organizations benefit.
    Pass the mustard and UP THE REVOLUTION!

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  8. #8
    Old man in the mountains osbornk's Avatar
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    The rally problems were nobody's fault. Stuff happens. Even with the extreme heat, I enjoyed the rally far more than the flooded Charleston Rally. Heat is better than floating or blown away tents.
    'You can say what you want about the South, but I almost never hear of anyone wanting to retire to the North.

  9. #9
    Registered User greenwald's Avatar
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by robnye View Post
    When you plan a week of vacation and the weather isn't perfect?

    If you ski and there's no snow the week you go, who do you blame?

    If you go to the beach and it rains who do you blame?

    If you go sailing and there is no wind who do you blame?

    Why do so many of you want to blame someone for a heat wave?
    As a veteran MSF instructor, I can certainly sympathize with your 'rant,' but only up to a point.

    I too get 'blamed and flamed' on student-feedback surveys, where they list everything from rain to cold to heat as my fault, as if I had some mythical control over the elements of Nature.

    But whinning a bit after a major event, like our Rally, has its merits, since future rallies are improved not by listing everything that went well, but by reviewing what did not, and prompting people to think how it might go better.
    Kevin Greenwald - Touring Tips Editor
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  10. #10
    God? What god? roborider's Avatar
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    I live close enough to this PA rally to have attended spur of the moment. But in that heat, no way. It's no fun riding, and it's no fun not riding.

    Next year looks the same. You can EXPECT 100 degrees. The time of the rally should correspond to the most favorable expected weather at the location.
    Rob C. , Raleigh, NC
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  11. #11
    Novice Adventurer Newstar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenwald View Post
    As a veteran MSF instructor, I can certainly sympathize with your 'rant,' but only up to a point.

    I too get 'blamed and flamed' on student-feedback surveys, where they list everything from rain to cold to heat as my fault, as if I had some mythical control over the elements of Nature.
    Is it your fault when they do not meet objectives and fail? Or is that just mine alone.

  12. #12
    just hangin' out 2bikemike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robnye View Post
    When you plan a week of vacation and the weather isn't perfect?

    If you ski and there's no snow the week you go, who do you blame?

    If you go to the beach and it rains who do you blame?

    If you go sailing and there is no wind who do you blame?

    Why do so many of you want to blame someone for a heat wave?
    I haven't read a single post where someone blamed the Rally Chairs or anyone else for the heat. I have read several posts that were critical of the month of July being chosen as the time for the rally.
    keep it light enough to travel.....
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  13. #13
    Ritalin Poster Boy rob nye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2BikeMike View Post
    I haven't read a single post where someone blamed the Rally Chairs or anyone else for the heat. I have read several posts that were critical of the month of July being chosen as the time for the rally.
    Blaming the MOA for having the rally in July?

  14. #14
    Dum vivimus vivamus ted's Avatar
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    The Rally site should be in a place that has an average high temperature for the month in which it will be held of no more than, well, let's say 85 degrees. That sounds nice, not too hot during the day, not too cold at night. Just right. Some place like, well, Central Pennsylvania.

    Ted
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  15. #15
    maacova maacova's Avatar
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    PGlaves and the Rally

    I wanted to thank Paul Glaves for his 3 hours in the heat at the Arena. I was kind of surprised that I was going to a cattle barn to here BMWMOA's rock star Paul Glaves. He deserves better. Maybe the highlight of my Rally. I hope they can find a venue that has A/C for the future as I would hate to miss you next year. I also agree that the heat was a danger for the not so young and I was very worried about others and myself. I was going to buy some new gloves but the only ones that fit were 2xx large. Not my normal size. I had swollen hands from the heat. I went into survival mode each day about 3 PM when the A/C quit working at the halls. Took shuttle into town had a few beers and a slow dinner and returned about 8 when the sun was down. Still had trouble sleeping but none of this is the BMWMOA's problem other than the location. There was no way of seeing that heatwave.

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