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Thread: ZUMO Tech Question?

  1. #31
    Unfunded content provider tommcgee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRw2ge View Post
    Theo,

    I believe the routing algorithm are all Garmin's... The GPS just takes raw data from "whatever" source you feed it (i.e. Google) and "recalculates" it and lays down the the route based upon:

    A.)Garmin Internal routing algortihms (laying it onto your internal mapset in your GPS)
    b.) as well as your chosen "routing preferences" in your GPS. (They come into play if you don't have a ton of viapoints forcing everything

    What do you think?
    Garmin's routing algorithms frequently change when there is a map or firmware update, and they are not always the same from one model to the next.

    One reason I like to route by waypoints is to find roads I haven't been on before. I've been covering close to 50K miles a year for the past 35 years doing field service in New England -- and I loved getting dumped on rural tertiary roads in the less densely populated places.
    Salty Fog Rally 2007, 2009, 2011, 2012, AND LOOKING FORWARD TO 2014!

    -Tom (KA1TOX)

  2. #32
    Registered User Jim Rogers's Avatar
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    As a MAC user, I use Garmin RoadTrip to plan all my rides. When I get my quarterly lifetime update from Garmin, it also updates RoadTrip so the map versions between the garmin and the software always match. I just give RoadTrip a starting point and an ending point. It then calculates the shortest/fastest route based on my Preference setting. If I want to then modify the predetermined route, it is just a simple drag and drop various points in the run and the software does the rest. I then tell RoadTrip to load into my Garmin. Again, by setting the Preferences to transfer only the route (route checked, way-points unchecked), that is what it does without making any way-points or any of that extra stuff yet the route and directions are right there. Very easy to use. I know nothing about the PC side.
    Gear Up and Ride Safe
    Jim Rogers
    2010 R12GSA aka Heidi
    Yorktown, Va

  3. #33
    BMW FanBoi drw2ge's Avatar
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    I thought you MAC guys used BaseMap???
    Phil W2GE
    2010 R1200RT 2011 Husqvarna TE310 'Woods-Weapon'
    New Sweden BMW Riders
    iPhone5-> Zumo 660->SENA SMH10, Nuvi 500,

  4. #34
    Registered User Jim Rogers's Avatar
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    Us MAC guys can use BaseCamp for trip planning. BaseCamp is listed in the 'On the Trail' section on the Garmin website while RoadTrip is listed in the 'On the Road' section. I just don't need (nor can my units use) all the extra stuff contained in BaseCamp. So, I have stayed with what works for me and what I am used to using. Maybe, now that I have Heidi and have retired, I should look more into BaseCamp. But that might result in getting yet another Garmin unit, RamMount, etc.
    Gear Up and Ride Safe
    Jim Rogers
    2010 R12GSA aka Heidi
    Yorktown, Va

  5. #35
    Touring Panpsychist Theo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRw2ge View Post
    Theo,

    I believe the routing algorithm are all Garmin's... The GPS just takes raw data from "whatever" source you feed it (i.e. Google) and "recalculates" it and lays down the the route based upon:

    A.)Garmin Internal routing algortihms (laying it onto your internal mapset in your GPS)
    b.) as well as your chosen "routing preferences" in your GPS. (They come into play if you don't have a ton of viapoints forcing everything

    What do you think?
    The "source" program (if it's not MapSource) most likely generates a GPS eXchange file to be downloaded to the GPS unit. These ".GPX" files are actually XML text files with route-points or way-points and some additional information. You can actually open a GPX file with Notepad (Win) or TextEdit (OSX) and see the contents and the tags.

    If your GPX file contains only way-points, it is not a route; it is a collection of locations. You will be able to verify this by examining the GPX text. Way-points have tags that begin with "[waypt]"*. A "[waypt]"* is an isolated location that IS NOT associated with a route by the source that generated the GPX file; there is no data that describes how they might be connected.

    However, if your GPX file contains only route-points then the data specifies the receiving GPS regard the data as a "routed" way-points. Route-points have tags that begin with "[rtept]"*. A collection of route-points specify the street-based path to be taken to navigate from start to finish.

    You may have seen the difference between a list of way-points and route-points after your Garmin has imported a GPX file and converted it to a Garmin-native ".GPI" file. A list of way-points will be located exactly where they are supposed to be (as specified by the source) but the path that is shown connecting them is a direct "as the crow flies" route; the lines connecting the way-points do not lay-down on roads. However, a list of route-points "describes" a path that follows vectors aligned with streets and, thus, create a route that is drivable.

    Most source programs allow you to choose whether you want your route in the GPX file to be saved as way-points or route-points. To preserve the source routing, always choose to save your GPX file as a route, not way-points.

    Garmin software (MapSource, BaseCamp, etc.) creates Garmin-native GPI files directly; no GPX exchange is needed. That is why routes developed from the programs will always be faithfully shown on your Garmin. However, as long as your route planned on Google (seasonal roads being a big issue) or MapQuest is saved as a route and not way-points, you should also see the route as planned.

    * - The actual tags in the XML files do not use square brackets, they use angled brackets: "<" and ">". I have changed them to square brackets because the forum software actually tries to interpret these tags.
    Theo

    2009 R1200RT, 2007 Shadow Aero 750 (sold)
    2012 MINI Countryman S, 2004 MINI Cooper S JCW, 2000 BMW 328i

  6. #36
    Unfunded content provider tommcgee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by THEO View Post
    However, as long as your route planned on Google (seasonal roads being a big issue) or MapQuest is saved as a route and not way-points, you should also see the route as planned.
    My street pilot 3 and 2610 (and some of the C-series) always sent me down gated/seasonal/private/singletrack/paper roads in MA/NH/VT/ME when I set the preferences to shortest distance and didn't check unpaved in the avoidances. Granted that these were not pre-planned routes.

    I usually avoid unpaved because of the backtracking I've had to do.

    Your point about tweaking conversion files is well-taken.
    Salty Fog Rally 2007, 2009, 2011, 2012, AND LOOKING FORWARD TO 2014!

    -Tom (KA1TOX)

  7. #37
    BMW FanBoi drw2ge's Avatar
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    Theo... I think I get what you mean.. I actually often edit Google map routes in Notepad because it isn't one route but many short routes and I must "concatenate" them by editing the Rteps. (all rte's removed after rteps). (after using GMap2GPX) One of the riding clubs I belong too often post routes in Google Maps...

    I rarely use WAYPOINTS.. only for gas stations, restaurants that I WANT to see distance too, along my intended route,etc.. (I may just add them as favorites so they "show" along the route but don't become part of the calculation of the route.) ***I want/use VIAPOINTS at pure intersections.***

    Don't you mean *.GDB versus *.GPI?????? .GPI are point of interest files, i.e. adding speed traps.
    Last edited by DRw2ge; 03-26-2011 at 03:29 PM. Reason: clarity
    Phil W2GE
    2010 R1200RT 2011 Husqvarna TE310 'Woods-Weapon'
    New Sweden BMW Riders
    iPhone5-> Zumo 660->SENA SMH10, Nuvi 500,

  8. #38
    Outlander Omega Man's Avatar
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    You guys are putting together another great resource thread on GPS. Thanks, Gary
    "Well they say.. time loves a hero but only time will tell.. If he's real, he's a legend from heaven If he ain't he was sent here from hell" Lowell George
    2009 F800GS 1994 TW200
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  9. #39
    Registered User Jim Rogers's Avatar
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    Wow, glad to see some people who really know this stuff. I am very limited to using the Garmin software. Here is something that is bothering me - I tried to put a couple of routes from mapquest in my 765T a while back as an experiment to see which I liked better - Mapquest or Garmin software. It is there but now I cannot get it out of the 'My Data' folder. It does not even go away with a 'master reset' (touching lower right portion of screen during power up). It is also not listed in any Garmin directory when connected to the MAC. Nor does it transfer back to RoadTrip. (havent tried BaseCamp, yet) Yet, every time I look at the My Data folder, there it is. Any Ideas?
    Gear Up and Ride Safe
    Jim Rogers
    2010 R12GSA aka Heidi
    Yorktown, Va

  10. #40
    Touring Panpsychist Theo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRw2ge View Post
    {snip}...Don't you mean *.GDB versus *.GPI?????? .GPI are point of interest files, i.e. adding speed traps.
    My apologies! Way-points wind up in the ".GPI" file; route-points end up as a Garmin-specific verison of the GPX format. This GPX format contains Garmin-specific extensions to the basic GPX exchange data. That is why a downloaded GPX file needs to be "imported" to be used by Garmin. The importing for way-points in a GPX file creates a Garmin-specfic ".GPI" file.

    Garmin's route files are added to a large "repository" of Garmin-specific route files in the "Current.gpx" file found in the GPX folder within the top-level Garmin folder. Remember that newer Garmin units can be connected to your computer via USB and appear as a mountable volume. Also, if you are using an storage card in your Garmin, it will appear as its own mountable volume.

    @Jim - I haven't experimented with the 765T, but is it possible that the My Data folder might be on a plug-in storage card? I don't believe a master reset does anything to a storage card. Just guessing here...
    Theo

    2009 R1200RT, 2007 Shadow Aero 750 (sold)
    2012 MINI Countryman S, 2004 MINI Cooper S JCW, 2000 BMW 328i

  11. #41
    Registered User Jim Rogers's Avatar
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    Theo,

    Thanks for the input. I should have mentioned I previously checked the data card. No joy. I also looked at every FAQ on the Garmin site with no joy there either. Oh well, maybe it is just an 'electronic ghosty'.
    Gear Up and Ride Safe
    Jim Rogers
    2010 R12GSA aka Heidi
    Yorktown, Va

  12. #42
    Unfunded content provider tommcgee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Rogers View Post
    Theo,

    Thanks for the input. I should have mentioned I previously checked the data card. No joy. I also looked at every FAQ on the Garmin site with no joy there either. Oh well, maybe it is just an 'electronic ghosty'.
    Could be an invisible file. Check this out: http://kb.iu.edu/data/ajyj.html
    Salty Fog Rally 2007, 2009, 2011, 2012, AND LOOKING FORWARD TO 2014!

    -Tom (KA1TOX)

  13. #43
    BMW FanBoi drw2ge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tommcgee View Post
    Could be an invisible file. Check this out: http://kb.iu.edu/data/ajyj.html
    +1 My thoughts... Just didn't know how to "Show Hidden Files" on MAC

    Betcha that's it...
    Phil W2GE
    2010 R1200RT 2011 Husqvarna TE310 'Woods-Weapon'
    New Sweden BMW Riders
    iPhone5-> Zumo 660->SENA SMH10, Nuvi 500,

  14. #44
    Registered User Jim Rogers's Avatar
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    Deleting Stuff on Garmin - Follow Up

    I could not let my 'ghosty' go. I just went back through the Garmin FAQs and found exactly what I needed buried in the 312 assorted line items. I guess the title of the FAQ threw me off on previous searches since an imported route is one that has been taken form My Data and is available as a Custom Route. I also see the date of the FAQ is 01/09/2011 so it may not have existed on my previous searches. Old Dopey Me.

    From Garmin FAQ:

    How do I remove imported routes from my nuvi or zumo device?

    If you want to remove old imported routes from your My Data or User Data menu in your nuvi or zumo device, then you will need to perform the following:

    Please note that this will remove all the available routes to import from your My Data or User Data menu, but the routes that you have saved in the Routes menu will not be deleted.

    PC Users:

    1. Connect your nuvi or zumo to a computer with a data transfer USB cable.
    2. Open MyComputer/Computer to view your Garmin device drive.
    3. Right-click on the Garmin drive and select Open.
    4. Double-click the Garmin folder (Note: Some units do not require this step. In this case you would skip to Step 5.)
    5. Double-click the GPX folder.
    6. Delete the Temp.gpx file.

    All available routes to import will now be removed from your My Data or User Data menu in your unit.

    Mac Users:

    1. Connect your nuvi or zumo to a computer with a data transfer USB cable.
    2. Your Garmin device drive will show as being mounted on the Desktop.
    3. Double-click on the Garmin device drive.
    4. Double-click on the Garmin folder. (Note: Some units do not require this step. In this case you would skip to Step 5.)
    5. Double-click on the GPX folder.
    6. Delete the Temp.gpx file.

    All available routes to import will now be removed from your My Data or User Data menu in your unit.
    Gear Up and Ride Safe
    Jim Rogers
    2010 R12GSA aka Heidi
    Yorktown, Va

  15. #45
    BMW FanBoi drw2ge's Avatar
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    THanks for info Jim... I've noticed the temp.gpx folder before and found a route in it and thought it was just a route before I had imported it (this was on my Nuvi).

    The Zumo works idfferently in that you don't have to "import" a route from My Data.. after you transfer, it is already in "Custom Routes". (But I'll bet it just does all the keystrokes automatically, i.e. same import steps as on a Nuvi, etc.. So.. same folder structure.

    Has anyone imported a Speed Trap POI? I'm messing with that now.. and am looking for an up to date file.

    http://www.gps-data-team.com/poi/uni...peed_Trap.html

    Found this site.. but haven't tried it yet..

    and sorry if we're taking this thread WAY off-topic... What was it about anyway!?
    Phil W2GE
    2010 R1200RT 2011 Husqvarna TE310 'Woods-Weapon'
    New Sweden BMW Riders
    iPhone5-> Zumo 660->SENA SMH10, Nuvi 500,

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