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Thread: BMWNA PreSale Order Program Open

  1. #16
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    And does that $25K include sales tax and reg. fees?
    '14 R1200GS,
    Priors: '13 K1600GT, '08 R1200RT, '04 R1150RT, '05 R1200GS, '73 R75/5.

  2. #17
    A wandering Bird Vagabird's Avatar
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    I pre-ordered a GT in Denver. The dealer had no firm price yet but said it would be "pushing 24K", which is about what I expected. With tax and license and delivery, that comes out close to $26K. That's about the limit of what I'm willing to pay. If it comes in much more than that, I'll just put a lot more smiles on my RT.

    BUT I get a free T-shirt. (c'mon, man - a t-shirt? )

    - Kate
    Last edited by Vagabird; 12-29-2010 at 04:37 PM.
    '12 K1600 GT

    What is it you intend to do with your one wild and precious life? - Mary Oliver

  3. #18
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    Just curious....supposing the exchange rate reverses and the pricing goes up quite a bit from wha't been rumored here...what happens to your deposit? Is it fully refundable or non-refundable? I assume all they folks placing orders know the answer and I'd be curious to hear it.

  4. #19
    Registered User mneblett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vectorprime27 View Post
    Just curious....supposing the exchange rate reverses and the pricing goes up quite a bit from wha't been rumored here...what happens to your deposit? Is it fully refundable or non-refundable? I assume all they folks placing orders know the answer and I'd be curious to hear it.
    That's strictly a matter between you and your dealer -- my deposit is refundable; other dealers don't have the same policy. It's the dealer's protection from loss if you back out of a deal -- if there's no loss, there's not much reason to keep a deposit, but some dealers don't go with this logic (e.g., to deter frequent mind changes). Negotiate the point if it is of concern to you.
    Mark Neblett
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  5. #20
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    A loss? If you don't buy the bike and they sell it to someone else, how have they lost? I did not get a final answer to that question at the Orlando dealer....they didn't know if it was refundable or not - and if they don't know, who does? Hence my question.

  6. #21
    Registered User mneblett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vectorprime27 View Post
    A loss? If you don't buy the bike and they sell it to someone else, how have they lost?
    In this case, it's hard to imagine a situation in which a loss would arise -- maybe if you farklized the bike in a strange way or had them paint it a color that would make it hard to sell to someone without a discount.

    In the bigger picture, it's Econ 101 (over simplified): With far more demand than supply of goods, a lost sale would cause no harm -- they will have a ready buyer for every machine they can get. On the other hand, a real loss can occur where there is a slow selling model (i.e., more goods than buyers) -- someone backing out of a contract for such a sale would be a lost profit to the dealer (something for which a deposit can help compensate).

    Quote Originally Posted by vectorprime27 View Post
    I did not get a final answer to that question at the Orlando dealer....they didn't know if it was refundable or not - and if they don't know, who does? Hence my question.
    They didn't know?? Horse-hocky.

    From what I have gathered from various sources, BMW only required the dealers provide proof they had actual buyers, by:

    -- sending in a buyer-signed form, and
    -- sending in a photocopy of the buyer's driver's license.

    My understanding is that BMWNA did not also demand that the deposit money be forwarded to NA -- or otherwise provide guidance as to whether the deposits should be refundable (and if I were a dealer principal, I would howl if they did -- that would be infringing on the dealer-customer relationship, a *very* touchy area for all vehicle dealers, as well as State Corporation Commissions). Moreover, BMWNA only sells bikes to dealers, and they go to great pains to *not* have a direct contractual vehicle sale link with the customer (for litigation-related and a variety of other reasons). You can expect that the last thing they would want is to get involved in the dealer-customer contract drafting process (refundable/non-refundable being just another term to be negotiated in the dealer/customer contract).

    In fact, BMWNA said in their pre-order program announcment that all the following "should be discussed in your negotiations with the dealer": "determine your final price, agree in advance on the trade-in value of your current motorcycle, holding deposite, financing options/preapprovals and so forth."

    Bottom line, you're being fed a line -- that dealer can choose to do business on a refundable or non-refundable basis as he/she sees fit. The fact that a straight answer is not being produced would be setting off all kinds of alarm bells in my head.
    Mark Neblett
    Fairfax, VA
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  7. #22
    A wandering Bird Vagabird's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mneblett View Post
    The fact that a straight answer is not being produced would be setting off all kinds of alarm bells in my head.
    Yes. When I signed up with my dealer (Denver), they assured me it was refundable. They keep the money; they don't send it to BMW.

    - Kate
    '12 K1600 GT

    What is it you intend to do with your one wild and precious life? - Mary Oliver

  8. #23
    Registered User mneblett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vagabird View Post
    Yes. When I signed up with my dealer (Denver), they assured me it was refundable. They keep the money; they don't send it to BMW.

    - Kate
    Why the ? The alarm bells would be for a dealer that *wasn't* willing to plainly state their deposit refund policy -- yours did. You should be golden.
    Mark Neblett
    Fairfax, VA
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  9. #24
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    I have two issues that remained unresolved....three actually if you count the fact that they couldn't give me a read on the value of my trade. That I understand, because I'm going to ride it until the new bike arrives, so reserviing thre right to make that call at the time of the deal is okay with me, as long as I get a reasonable "ballpark" idea now.

    First issue is they either would not or could not give me a final price. I think that is the first item in the list of things to get resolved. Nothing. Not even a vague guess as to what it might be. All I got was a very general it'll be what it is. Second issue, is the deposit refundable. Now this could have been the Salesperson, because I found that answer totally unacceptable and stated so. Didn't matter to them. Like you, it raised major alarms. I have access to the dealer in Daytona, although I'm told it's the same Owner....so who knows. At this point, I'll take it as a sign I should wait a bit. Thank for the info...ride safe everyone.

  10. #25
    Registered User mneblett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vectorprime27 View Post
    I have two issues that remained unresolved....three actually if you count the fact that they couldn't give me a read on the value of my trade. That I understand, because I'm going to ride it until the new bike arrives, so reserviing thre right to make that call at the time of the deal is okay with me, as long as I get a reasonable "ballpark" idea now.

    First issue is they either would not or could not give me a final price. I think that is the first item in the list of things to get resolved. Nothing. Not even a vague guess as to what it might be. All I got was a very general it'll be what it is. Second issue, is the deposit refundable. Now this could have been the Salesperson, because I found that answer totally unacceptable and stated so. Didn't matter to them. Like you, it raised major alarms. I have access to the dealer in Daytona, although I'm told it's the same Owner....so who knows. At this point, I'll take it as a sign I should wait a bit. Thank for the info...ride safe everyone.
    Good instincts on the deposit.

    On the price, to be fair, even today there are only the *roughest* of only *ballpark* numbers leaking out of the mothership -- it appears that the dealers truely are nearly as much in the dark as the rest of us -- frankly, I don't believe even BMWNA knows what the MSRP will be yet. They are likely investing a *huge* amount of work in trying to get the numbers narrowed down in the next couple of months (just imagine the factors they have to consider! exchange rate, BMWAG's (likely also still not finalized) pricing to NA, exchange rate projections, anticipated demand vs. pricing to be competitive with other tourers in the market, projections of the progress of the U.S. recovery, etc., etc. -- glad I'm not responsible for this job ...).
    Mark Neblett
    Fairfax, VA
    #32806

  11. #26
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    Surely there's no binding contract when a dealer doesn't yet know a selling price. What can the buyer and the seller even agree to?

    The way my dealer put it, if I'm remotely interested in the K1600's then sign the form and leave a refundable deposit. About all I've bought is the option to buy the bike only if all the details (such as price) eventually fall into place in an acceptable manner. If they don't, then I take back my deposit and the dealer sells the bike to the next guy in line. And I've lost my place in line until the supply catches up with demand. Meanwhile I think I get a free T-shirt. And the dealer gets a K1600GT to sell, maybe to me, that he otherwise wouldn't get.
    '14 R1200GS,
    Priors: '13 K1600GT, '08 R1200RT, '04 R1150RT, '05 R1200GS, '73 R75/5.

  12. #27
    Registered User mneblett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sailorlite View Post
    Surely there's no binding contract when a dealer doesn't yet know a selling price. What can the buyer and the seller even agree to?

    [[snippage]] About all I've bought is the option to buy the bike only if all the details (such as price) eventually fall into place in an acceptable manner. ...
    Precisely -- you're purchasing an option (I thought about mentioning that in my previous posts, but figured I'd get branded as being too lawyerish ).

    Whether your dealer is willing to refund some or all of your money if you decline to exercise the option is a matter of the terms of the bargain struck with him/her. Of course, I'm assuming that everyone knew to ask about this term/condition of the contract before they handed over the deposit money, right?
    Mark Neblett
    Fairfax, VA
    #32806

  13. #28
    Motorman2061
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    I'll just wait until all the beta testing is completed.

  14. #29
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    My dealer did not require a deposit

    I filled out the forms, faxed them in, my dealer received notice of receipt via email from BMW, I have not received a confirmation call from BMW yet, so I wait. No deposit required, yet...

  15. #30
    Manic Mechanic Furman's Avatar
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    I placed an order also on Jan 31. They took a $500 deposit copy my DL and had me fill out a BMW form. They told me BMW would contact me to confirm (nothing so far). The dealer said they would refund my deposit. Order the Premium Package Upgrade. Yes I will be a Beta tester. Did two things I thought I would never do. Buy new. Buy first year model .

    Furman,



    The 2011 K1600GTL in Royal Blue Metallic will include the following:







    Standard Package*



    - Bluetooth

    - Audio system with Sirius and GPS prep

    - Xenon headlights

    - Radio software

    - Heated seats

    - Heated Grips

    - Cruise Control

    - Multi-function display

    - Anti-Lock Brakes

    - Luggage Rack

    - LED turn signals

    - Top case in body color

    - Comfort windscreen/footrests

    - Chrome body kit



    This spec. will run $23,200.00 plus $495.00 freight







    Premium Package Upgrade*



    - Includes all above equipment PLUS:

    - Adaptive headlight

    - Dynamic traction Control

    - Tire Pressure Monitor system

    - LED fog lights

    - Electronic Suspension Adjustment

    - Central Locking System

    - Alarm



    This spec. will run $25,845.00 plus $495.00 freight







    So from here, we would need to discuss which Package interests you for the order and work up an accurate total out the door to expect will Pa. tax and tags. We are recommending that once folks know they are committing, to begin attempting to sell their current machine is looking to let it go. We may be able to accommodate with a consignment come Spring time, but there is no guarantee of an on time sale by the arrival of the special order K bike. It is recommended that it be sold prior to itÔÇÖs arrival in May or June as we are in no way able to control what the trade in may or may not be up until then, and with the current used market- our end will be extremely conservative.

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