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Thread: The Selection of Rally Sites.

  1. #31
    High & Dry statdawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hodag View Post
    didn't we do a town type rally, the split venue rally.
    the one where the beer tent blew down??
    Did I sleep through something that happened at Camp Beers ?
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  2. #32
    look out!!! Visian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrafikFeat View Post
    Has it ever been considered to select a 'Town'?
    Yes. A whole town.
    sorry, just saw this thread.

    Maggie Valley, NC would be a place where something like this can happen. there are cruiser conventions of various ilk that currently take over the place now. i think those people would LOVE a quiet motorcycle meet.

    Since our house is near there, I've looked at Maggie Valley in this vein. there are plusses and minuses, i think a rally there would not be exactly the same as what we've come to expect.

    on edit: but that doesn't mean it isn't worth considering.

    ian
    Last edited by Visian; 11-09-2010 at 09:44 PM.
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  3. #33
    look out!!! Visian's Avatar
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    Basic rally site requirements

    oh, and this fresh off the press (someone, somewhere had asked for this information)...

    1) Site size 100 acres or larger.
    2) Adequate grass camping area of about 50 acres.
    3) Indoor vendor area consisting of 50,000 square feet or more.
    4) Wireless Internet service for vendors and Cyber Cafe.
    5) Adequate toilets and showers.
    6) 2500 motel/hotel rooms within a 30 mile radius of the rally grounds.
    7) Exclusive BMW MOA Beer Garden.
    8) RV Parking - 100 spaces minimum.
    9) Paved area of at least 200 feet by 300 feet (on or off rally
    grounds) to teach the MSF's Rider Courses.
    10) Grandstand or Arena seating for at least 3500 for the Closing Ceremonies.
    11) Off Road area (on or off rally grounds) for GS training.
    12) Six or more areas of various size for holding seminars.


    plus..... we need to be able to sell beer ourselves.

  4. #34
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    Maggie Valley, NC

    I agree with Visian that Maggie Valley would be a good place for the Rally, certainly enough other rallies are held there.

    I don't know if it has ever been held in Asheville, NC but that would also be an excellent location, plenty of hotels and a big fair ground avalable. Up until a few years ago the "Honda Hoot" was held in Asheville until they moved to TN. On a sad note the Honda Hoot has been cancelled the last few years due to a lack of sponsorship from Honda. Sign of the times.
    Mo
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  5. #35
    Registered User chasman's Avatar
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    The fairgrounds in Ashville is not available during the month of July because of standing events that take place every year. A nice facility, tight on camping, but workable...just not available.

    I've been to Maggie Valley several times and it's beautiful. Don't know if our members are ready to try another "Split Venue" rally...I'm certain many of them still remember the 2003 rally in Charleston, WV.


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  6. #36
    On the Blue Roads RevWillie's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Biltmore

    Quote Originally Posted by moshaffer View Post
    I agree with Visian that Maggie Valley would be a good place for the Rally, certainly enough other rallies are held there.

    I don't know if it has ever been held in Asheville, NC but that would also be an excellent location, plenty of hotels and a big fair ground avalable. Up until a few years ago the "Honda Hoot" was held in Asheville until they moved to TN.
    Mo

    BMWRA had their '07 National at Biltmore Estate in Asheville. It was one of RA's largest National's, and it was a good rally. The Biltmore folks were originally very worried about having a motorcycle rally on their grounds, and a lot of Beemer folks down here were wondering about having a rally at such a "proper",historic facility during tourist season. The rumor was that Asheville Chamber of Commerce was pushing Biltmore because of the loss of the Honda Hoot. We had a hard time visualizing BMW bikes running around such a beautiful estate, and camping next to the Mansion, but everything went well and the Biltmore folks were very surprised and very happy.

    From what I have heard from RA board members, the invitation to return to Biltmore has been put out to BMWRA. I know that a MOA National would not fit into the Estate, but there are motorcycle supporters in the Asheville government and the business community. It seems the Asheville community is open for motorcycle events and the money it brings in.
    Last edited by RevWillie; 11-11-2010 at 01:06 AM. Reason: period
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  7. #37
    Old man in the mountains osbornk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevWillie View Post
    It seems the Asheville community is open for motorcycle events and the money it brings in.
    I went to several Honda Hoots in Asheville until it moved to Knoxville. According to many residents and the local newspaper, the mayor of Asheville and the city council pretty much ran them out of town. There is a reason it is known as the San Francisco of the east. The Honda Hoot folks claimed it was because they needed more space. I was there the last year it was there and the local restaurant owners and other businesses were complaining about the future loss of income.

    The bike mixture did change from my first Honda Hoot to the last one. The early Honda Hoots I attended had a high percentage of Goldwings and other quiet bikes. The last one I attended had a lot of unmuffled or lightly muffled Shadows, Valkyres and other Harley wanna-be bikes. My K100RT looked like a German in downtown Tokyo.
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  8. #38
    Benchwrenching PGlaves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasman View Post
    The fairgrounds in Ashville is not available during the month of July because of standing events that take place every year. A nice facility, tight on camping, but workable...just not available.

    I've been to Maggie Valley several times and it's beautiful. Don't know if our members are ready to try another "Split Venue" rally...I'm certain many of them still remember the 2003 rally in Charleston, WV.


    Chuck Manley
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    Chuck and I differ here. But he got yelled at a bit more than I did.

    The Charleston venue was fine. There were a few problems at one of the camping areas down by the homeless camp. Camping by the beer tent on campus was fine. The bus drivers union screwed the shuttle system pooch.

    It was different and some folks can't cope with different. But the big problem wasn't needing to get from A to B. The big problem was counting on shuttle service that suddenly stopped running leaving folks not where they wanted to be.

    So contract terms need to be tightened up and MOA needs to deal with a few details not always needed. Big whoop.

    Historically, in almost every rally campers are near where it's at and motel folks are somewhat remote. For once motel folks were close to where it was at and campers were a bit remote. In Charleston I camped and was remote. In Johnson City I stayed at a motel and was remote. So?
    Paul Glaves - "Big Bend", Texas U.S.A
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  9. #39
    Registered User chasman's Avatar
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    Actually Paul and I don't really differ...Charleston had some very good things. Civic Center with a/c for all the seminars and vendors, lots of close-in motels, great riding. Our members didn't like being seperated into three camping areas and without the promised shuttle service members had to ride to the Civic Center. Those in attendence stated loud and clear in the rally survey "Don't do this again!"

    Never say never...we may try this concept in the future based on what we learned in Charleston. We will plan better and be certain our members are ready to try something a bit different.
    Chuck Manley #12106
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  10. #40
    Benchwrenching PGlaves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasman View Post
    Actually Paul and I don't really differ...Charleston had some very good things. Civic Center with a/c for all the seminars and vendors, lots of close-in motels, great riding. Our members didn't like being seperated into three camping areas and without the promised shuttle service members had to ride to the Civic Center. Those in attendence stated loud and clear in the rally survey "Don't do this again!"

    Never say never...we may try this concept in the future based on what we learned in Charleston. We will plan better and be certain our members are ready to try something a bit different.
    But hypothetically a site with a big downtown convention center and lots of nearby motels; and, lets say a big park next to a high school (with showers) for campers, and the two sites were a mile apart. If reliable shuttle was assured this is no different than on-site camping and scattered motels. Maybe better in fact because I have yet to see a good systematic shuttle system from 17 different motels to the rally site.

    But lots of campers like to drink at the beer garden and walk to their tents while motel folks have to ride away into the darkness. I don't see why reversing this - motel folks walk back to their motels and campers ride back to their tents - is so horrible to comprehend.

    It is simply a matter of who is inconvenienced and who isn't, and what folks are used to. I'm a rally camper so like the historical solution. But for motel folks Charleston worked better. But they were happy so didn't yell as much or as loud.
    Paul Glaves - "Big Bend", Texas U.S.A
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  11. #41
    Chromehead bobs98's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Visian View Post
    sorry, just saw this thread.

    Maggie Valley, NC would be a place where something like this can happen. there are cruiser conventions of various ilk that currently take over the place now. i think those people would LOVE a quiet motorcycle meet.

    Since our house is near there, I've looked at Maggie Valley in this vein. there are plusses and minuses, i think a rally there would not be exactly the same as what we've come to expect.

    on edit: but that doesn't mean it isn't worth considering.

    ian
    I LOVE Maggie Valley! It is a fantastic area.
    We used to take family vacations at Cataloochee Ranch and have been back a couple of times with my kids.
    From the BRP to Cherokee and Asheville, the surrounding area of southwestern NC has great roads and attractions. I'd really need a full week to even make a dent in the variety of things to do.

    Hey Ian - It was great to meet you in Bloomsburg!
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  12. #42
    It is what it is. Bud's Avatar
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    +1 on Maggie. Went on the Blueridge this spring. What a great time. Wonderful roads, fantastic views and nice folks.
    I used to post here, but now I don't.

  13. #43
    Ritalin Poster Boy rob nye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PGlaves View Post
    Depends on who you talk to.

    I camped at the campus, walked to the beer tent (both before and after it blew down and was put back up), rode downtown to the convention center for seminars and vendor stuff, and had a thoroughly good time.

    Folks who stayed in the motels or camped down by the homeless settlement were remote from the beer garden - but that is true for motel visitors often when the beer is at the fairgrounds and the motel is the next town away.

    The shuttle bus service didn't work as promised because management forgot to talk to the union and after a certain length of time the drivers parked the busses and quit driving.

    So there was a lot of grumbling, shouting, and general intimidation of the Board by some members, and the Board generally heard only that side of the issues. That was to the detriment of BMW MOA because it made folks afraid to break out of the traditional fairgrounds/camping in the mud model for the rally.
    I think there were a few major issues with Charleston.

    First the buses were not handled properly, there weren't enough and they didn't run enough hours of the day. As someone who was on the board we were lead to believe this would not be an issue. There was quite a debate on this point as some felt during the day most folks would ride back and forth.

    The second is that there were three different camping locations and rally central in the convention center, yet there were two rally chairs and no individuals with any responsibility or authority to take care of the needs at each of the camping sites.

    As a volunteer is was very frustrating to hear requests on the radio for *somebody* to please find *somebody* to get the porta potties serviced.

    Ultimately the rally is an exercise in logistics and planning. The single site model works so well because it's what we've been doing.

    There is no reason why a venue similar to Charleston couldn't work again, although I admit that personally I prefer a single site. I like to set up my camp, park my bike and walk around, rather than take a bus or ride to visit the vendors or check out a seminar.

  14. #44
    look out!!! Visian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevWillie View Post
    From what I have heard from RA board members, the invitation to return to Biltmore has been put out to BMWRA. I know that a MOA National would not fit into the Estate, but there are motorcycle supporters in the Asheville government and the business community. It seems the Asheville community is open for motorcycle events and the money it brings in.
    i have worked at length with the asheville convention and visitors bureau guy, who is an MOA member btw, and there is no joy for us there.

    a couple years before the RA event at biltmore, i approached biltmore because BMW had planned and then canceled an event there. hey, at least they would consider a motorcycle event! the conversation was going well until i mentioned 9-10,000 people. (i personally think the venue could handle that, but it lacks for exhibit space, showers, and other important rally facility requirements that would require expensive tents and trailers).

    the Asheville fairground that i *think* everyone is talking about is the venue south of town near the airport. that was visited and reported on 5-6 years ago. camping is *right* on I-26 and not enough air conditioned exhibit space. this place could be a possibility if/when they upgrade the facility.

    i have two other *secret* destinations in the same area that i am working on... slowwwwly. need to politic my way in to the town council and get past the beer issues on one of the places, working to see how much the cost will be to meet our exhibit space requirements on the other.

    i still think maggie valley is worth a look. it is not so much a split venue like charleston, because one could walk to just about anywhere there. the location would easily accommodate a shuttle service. there are so many funky little mom and pop motels there, tons of restaurants, a little tight on exhibit space and closing ceremonies would be outdoors, but a very rider-friendly community who would welcome our event with open arms.

    ian
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  15. #45
    Registered User nplenzick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Visian View Post
    i have worked at length with the Asheville convention and visitors bureau guy, who is an MOA member btw, and there is no joy for us there.

    a couple years before the RA event at biltmore, i approached biltmore because BMW had planned and then canceled an event there. hey, at least they would consider a motorcycle event! the conversation was going well until i mentioned 9-10,000 people. (i personally think the venue could handle that, but it lacks for exhibit space, showers, and other important rally facility requirements that would require expensive tents and trailers).

    the Asheville fairground that i *think* everyone is talking about is the venue south of town near the airport. that was visited and reported on 5-6 years ago. camping is *right* on I-26 and not enough air conditioned exhibit space. this place could be a possibility if/when they upgrade the facility.

    i have two other *secret* destinations in the same area that i am working on... slowwwwly. need to politic my way in to the town council and get past the beer issues on one of the places, working to see how much the cost will be to meet our exhibit space requirements on the other.

    i still think Maggie valley is worth a look. it is not so much a split venue like charleston, because one could walk to just about anywhere there. the location would easily accommodate a shuttle service. there are so many funky little mom and pop motels there, tons of restaurants, a little tight on exhibit space and closing ceremonies would be outdoors, but a very rider-friendly community who would welcome our event with open arms.

    ian
    I've done two shows this past year at the location across from the Airport outside of Asheville. They abosulotly have enough room for an inside vending area this past year and their adding a considerable amount for next year. I would think the big problem there would be tent camping, the majority of the area is pretty much a hard surface, stone or asphalt.
    I also have done an HD show in Maggie Valley and I spent a week there this past May. I really don't know of a location that could handle an MOA national. There's the field in the middle of town that has a stage. It could hold 3-4k people, maybe. Where would you shuttle people to? I'm unaware of any indoor location for vendors. Is there one? Also the promoter that does the HD rally there has had big problems with the town supervisors. I have no idea if he's the problem or the town.

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