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  1. #1
    Kbiker BCKRider's Avatar
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    Atgatt?

    Well, sure. But I think I may look at it a little differently than some and would like to hear your opinions.

    "Dress for the crash, not for the ride" is something I've read and disagree with. I would say "dress for the ride with crash protection in mind."

    I believe the most important thing is that we are comfortable (not wet, cold, or too hot.) Not just because being comfortable is a good thing - though of course it is. Any of the conditions listed distract our attention and physical ability to ride in control. IMHO, staying comfortable, alert, and avoiding crashes is far better than surviving them. Though it is good to have gear which minimizes the injuries when things go wrong.

    Probably a dumb post.
    Doug
    1992 K100RS

  2. #2
    sMiling Voni's Avatar
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    Not at all.

    That's why I reject the idea that a rider that hasn't been down is going down. When faced with a crisis I want every fiber of my being to be looking for how to avoid it; not one atom of my being should be accepting it will happen.

    Voni
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  3. #3
    Registered User redclfco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Voni View Post
    Not at all.

    That's why I reject the idea that a rider that hasn't been down is going down. When faced with a crisis I want every fiber of my being to be looking for how to avoid it; not one atom of my being should be accepting it will happen.

    Voni
    sMiling

  4. #4
    Outlander Omega Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCKRIDER View Post
    Well, sure. But I think I may look at it a little differently than some and would like to hear your opinions.

    "Dress for the crash, not for the ride" is something I've read and disagree with. I would say "dress for the ride with crash protection in mind."

    I believe the most important thing is that we are comfortable (not wet, cold, or too hot.) Not just because being comfortable is a good thing - though of course it is. Any of the conditions listed distract our attention and physical ability to ride in control. IMHO, staying comfortable, alert, and avoiding crashes is far better than surviving them. Though it is good to have gear which minimizes the injuries when things go wrong.

    Probably a dumb post.
    Not a dumb post-a good post. The efficiency of dress in relationship to conditions is important. My experience (in a number of things) has proven the right amount of gear to conditions will make the task at hand be a lot more enjoyable and survivable. I find achieving this balance easier said than done. Gary
    "Well they say.. time loves a hero but only time will tell.. If he's real, he's a legend from heaven If he ain't he was sent here from hell" Lowell George
    2009 F800GS 1994 TW200
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  5. #5
    Yankee Air Pirate
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    In the Air Force, there is this motto: "Dress for Egress."

    Basically it means have your gear on that you will need if you have to eject. This sounds pretty normal and should make sense, until you realize that you need to wear thermal underwear around a middle-eastern base where its 120 degrees F in the cockpit, because you are going to be flying over the hindu-kush in Afghanistan for your mission later on, or you have to wear a "poopy-suit" because you are flying over a large body of water, but then are expected to perform intensive flying in a uniform that doesn't breathe. Some additionally load up their survival vest with a bunch gear like they are going on a camping trip.

    I take on another mantra instead: "Dress for mission success" I want enough gear to keep me alive in the very low probability that something goes wrong, but also really want to ensure that my ground-based gear does not affect my performance in the air.

    Much is the same with motorcycle safety gear -- I've had bulky gloves and boots that impair feel and shifting, jackets that are too rigid to move and clear easily, and helmets that are safe, yet stifle vision and movement. I think the #1 consideration is fatigue. If your gear wears you down, through comfort or temperature or whatever, you are far more dangerous to yourself on the road, that being alert in lighter gear. The other thing to think about too, is that your bike is a piece of gear. I think that most people on this forum would agree with me, but others hate hearing it -- the BMW is one of the safer bikes in the world. If you are riding a BMW, you are already maximizing your best piece of safety gear: your brain.

    Cheers!

  6. #6
    sMiling Voni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B1Pilot View Post
    If you are riding a BMW, you are already maximizing your best piece of safety gear: your brain.

    Cheers!


    Voni
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  7. #7
    Seattle-area Rounder OfficerImpersonator's Avatar
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    There is enough variety in the gear available on the market today so that any rider can have complete and total protection and yet still be comfortable and able to safely operate the motorcycle.

    If it's hot, there are evaporative cooling systems and padded mesh gear to help keep the rider cool.

    If it's hot, there are electric jackets, pants, socks, and gloves. There's fleece, Gore-Tex, polypropylene and wool.

    I wear my Aerostich suit in 100 degree temps, and I'm comfortable as long as I'm moving, as plenty of air circulates through the suit. I wear my Aerostich suit in 20 degree temps, and I'm comfortable as long as I have enough fleece on under the suit.

    There is no such thing as bad weather - only inappropriate gear.*

    *I will count ice and snow as "bad riding conditions" - but only if you don't have a two-wheel drive Ural.
    Seattle, WA
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  8. #8
    James.A
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    In the FOGOST M/C (Fat Old Guys On Skinny Tires), we have a slogan; "dress for the slide, not your pride". In the spirit of promoting appropriate riding attire, I have been developing a letter grade system to assign a score based on "dress for the slide". For example, If rider has on a full face helmet, full leathers,and boots, that rider would get an an A. On my scale, every rider without a helmet gets an F. I invite all of you to put my grading system in practice as you observe the other riders among us.

  9. #9
    Registered User greenwald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCKRIDER View Post
    Well, sure. But I think I may look at it a little differently than some and would like to hear your opinions.

    "Dress for the crash, not for the ride" is something I've read and disagree with. I would say "dress for the ride with crash protection in mind."

    I believe the most important thing is that we are comfortable (not wet, cold, or too hot.) Not just because being comfortable is a good thing - though of course it is. Any of the conditions listed distract our attention and physical ability to ride in control. IMHO, staying comfortable, alert, and avoiding crashes is far better than surviving them. Though it is good to have gear which minimizes the injuries when things go wrong.

    Probably a dumb post.
    You're wrong ...... it's NOT a dumb post.

    I like to use "Dress for the ride - not the beach" in my MSF classes. That makes a statement about the standard summer dress here in the midwest (tee, shorts, sandals) being hopelessly inappropriate, and at the same time, stresses ATGATT.

    ATGATT (All The Gear All The Time) doesn't mean you have to settle for too hot or too cold or too uncomfortable - just prepped for the worst, should all your experience and awareness and caution just not be enough today. While a serious crash is not enivitable ("Those who have crashed, and those who will.."), we do engage in a higher level of risk when operating a motorcycle than a car/SUV.

    With ATGATT, I always dress for a pleasurable ride, but know that I am prepared for a slide as well.

    Ride Safe!
    Kevin Greenwald - Touring Tips Editor
    Nationally Certified Law Enforcement Motor Officer (Ret.) / IBA Member #34281
    MSF RiderCoach # 121656 (BRC,SBRC,IS,IME,SMARTrainer)
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  10. #10
    Just me rad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCKRIDER View Post
    "Dress for the crash, not for the ride" is something I've read and disagree with. I would say "dress for the ride with crash protection in mind.".
    Could be; there are a lot of ways to approach this issue, most are not wrong, they just address a different set of needs or priorities for the individual involved.

    I think of motorcycling somewhat like another of my sports, ocean kayaking; In kayaking you have a similar conundrum. Basically, you dress for the water temperature and your survival for an extended period of time in it, rather than the air temperature that you may well be blissfully paddling along in.

    Bottom line, it really is just a personal ÔÇ£risk vs rewardÔÇØ decision. We make lots of them in life and if we could only learn that these decisions are really only correct for the person making the decision, life would be a lot better for us all.

    Holy cow! I think I need a ladder to get down off this soap box

  11. #11
    Registered User mistercindy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCKRIDER View Post
    Well, sure. But I think I may look at it a little differently than some and would like to hear your opinions.

    "Dress for the crash, not for the ride" is something I've read and disagree with. I would say "dress for the ride with crash protection in mind."

    I believe the most important thing is that we are comfortable (not wet, cold, or too hot.) Not just because being comfortable is a good thing - though of course it is. Any of the conditions listed distract our attention and physical ability to ride in control. IMHO, staying comfortable, alert, and avoiding crashes is far better than surviving them. Though it is good to have gear which minimizes the injuries when things go wrong.

    Probably a dumb post.
    Not a dumb post. And I agree with you. Comfort is important. In the hot Texas summers you'll see me riding with a short sleeved shirt and jeans or mesh pants. On cold winter days I'll be ATGATT. That's one of the reason I like riding in Texas winters: ATGATT is not insufferably hot. So, while in the hot summer months I'm never ATGATT, I will always wear, in my own order of importance:
    • Full face helmet
    • Motorcycle specific gloves
    • Motorcycle specific boots
    Grant
    '05 R1200GS
    Former owner of an '03 R1150R
    BMWMOA #113847

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