Snotgnott

[pmdave]

quote from a different thread:

"Saw a cruiser rider in the Cities yesterday dressed in NOTGNOTT"

I propose this be "So, None Of The Gear, None Of The Time (SNOTGOTT)" or perhaps:

SNOTFGNOTT.

However, I confess. I rode the half-mile from the Comfort Suites to the rally wearing street shoes, jacket liner, gloves, and helmet. OK, I was on a three-wheeler, but I certainly didn't walk the talk. And I saw more than a few BMW riders in typical SNOTGOTT riding around Redmond.

Question: were any BMW riders injured during the rally while riding around the vicinity in SNOTGOTT? EMTs, please report in.

pmdave

[jstrube]

I made a beer run in shorts, T-shirt, helmet & gloves... I did swap up my Tevas for some closed toed shoes though...

[darrylri]

From Visian's picture show:



(Actually, I had just finished washing the bike and rode it back to the Beef Barn where the Vintage Display was held.)

[crazydrummerdude]

Cool picture.

[pmdave]

Daryll,

Shouldn't you be wearing lederhosen?

pmdave

[wezul]

However, I confess. I rode the half-mile from the Comfort Suites to the rally wearing street shoes, jacket liner, gloves, and helmet. OK, I was on a three-wheeler, but I certainly didn't walk the talk. And I saw more than a few BMW riders in typical SNOTGOTT riding around Redmond.

Mr. David,
With all due respect. And I mean that, you are rapidly approaching if not already an icon. It's a choice. Perhaps not the most intelligent choice but in this case I have to say that the only one who would be affected is the rider. I take hops on my Vespa ET4 and seldom do I go ATGATT. So that being the case, does one get condemned or a temporary reprieve?

[pmdave]

Well, I think there are very few of us who can do what we want with impunity. Whatever we do affects other people. Even if we don't have friends, family, co-workers, etc. who care about us, the "state" will send out public resources in the event we are injured.

If we crash, and we can't sneak away, the crash affects the statistics, which affect our insurance premiums, political interference, et al. If we're injured and get hauled off to the ER, we run up medical bills. If we have medical insurance, that contributes to rising insurance premiums. And if I manage to bonk myself in a fatal way, there's a lot more bureacratic stuff that comes into play, plus other little niceties such as funerals, memorial services, and tombstones.

So, yes, I feel it's my choice to ride with less than ATTGATT, but I have to consider who else I'm affecting with my decision. It's not an easy choice, because putting on the full armor on a hot day for a short ride seems ludicrous. On the other hand, most crashes occur in just the same situations as riding the half mile to the rally. On the road, at speed, I wear ATTGATT, not out of fear of abrasions and contusions, but because it's more comfortable being protected from wind, sun, etc.

I suggest we take a closer look at the need for riding gear, and make some conscious decisions about what we wear, when, and where. I'm of the opinion that what counts is having the mental and physical skills to avoid crashes, rather than being prepared to survive an unpredictable crash. So, when I see a rider wearing SNOTGOTT, I watch for indications he/she understands the risks. Based on the ongoing attitudes about risk I normally see amoung BMW riders, I have some faith that we know what we're doing, gear or no.

pmdave

[wezul]

To be honest, when I ride the "real" motorcycles (I have two) I at very least am in helmet, gloves, jacket and boots. Seldom with the pants.
But I get it Dave, I don't want to drive up others insurance premiums nor unnecessarily tax any areas EMT facilities.

So I am on "double secret" hyper alert when I am "dressed down".
But if you think people do not see motorcycles, you should try it sometime on a scooter.

Be safe, be well.

[pmdave]

I don't profess to have this all figured out. Back in the days when I was an instructor, the absolute dogma was ATTGATT, and that meant putting everything on just to ride across the practice range, or across the street for gas.

But over the years I've come to realize that in terms of injury protection, even the best gear is not very good. Yes, I realize that sliding down the pavement in leathers is a lot less likely to result in some doc picking tar and rocks out of my skin than if I hit the ground in street pants.

But the human body is just not designed to take sudden blows and tumbles. You can die just slipping on a banana peel and hitting your head on the sidewalk. The very best helmets made are good for attenuating maybe 18 or 20 mph impacts. Of course, motorcyclists most often bounce and slide rather than come to sudden halts against concrete walls. Having gotten used to wearing a helmet, I would not ride the street without one, even at slow speeds.

But my point is, over the years we've been trained and cajoled to believe in the importance of ATTGATT, when what's INSIDE my skull appears to be the critical component of my injury protection.

Thinking back to Redmond, I believe I was compensating for the reduced protective gear by watching more carefully for hazards. Or, maybe I'm just HOPING I was.

When I see riders with bare skin hanging out, my initial thought is that they are foolish. But on second thought, I usually take a closer look to see if there is any indication they know what they are doing. What I've noticed over the years is that those who don't seem to know are often those who don't wear gear. To put this another way, maybe it's not the lack of gear that kills them, but the lack of mental skills.

pmdave

[wezul]

Or the lack of cycling skills, period.
Like I said, I get it. So if you want to be stupid, I guess you get what you get.
Looks like Darryl was on a track or in a lot. Either way, he was stylin'!

Got the noggin' in a box 99% of the time, best you all out there do the same, like Dave says.

[darrylri]

Daryll,

Shouldn't you be wearing lederhosen?

pmdave

Dave, lederhosen would CYA a lot better than those slacks.

But hey, how about that head turn?

[angysdad]

I NEVER ride without jacket, gloves, helmet, boots. I frequently leave the the pants at home (no, not those pants). The other day i was in town (pop 10k), stopped for lunch and left my jacket off to ride across town (1mile at 30mph). It was the first time in at least 10yrs I rode without a jacket and I felt naked and vulnerable. Each year, I see more people riding bikes who, judging by the way they are dressed, would probably prefer to be at the beach!
Their injuries have pushed the price of a bike license to over $600 ($1400 for a sport bike).
So yes, your injuries do cost me.

[RSPENNACHIO]

quote from a different thread:

"Saw a cruiser rider in the Cities yesterday dressed in NOTGNOTT"

I propose this be "So, None Of The Gear, None Of The Time (SNOTGOTT)" or perhaps:

SNOTFGNOTT.

pmdave

I am not sure about "So, None Of The Gear, None Of The Time (SNOTGOTT)" because it contains a double negative.

Maybe "So, Not Enough Gear Any Time" SNEGAT???

snotgott does have a better ring to it but considering how much time we spend arguing about oil we might as well have a new topic to bicker about right?

[LENRT1200ST]

I am not sure about "So, None Of The Gear, None Of The Time (SNOTGOTT)" because it contains a double negative.

Maybe "So, Not Enough Gear Any Time" SNEGAT???

snotgott does have a better ring to it but considering how much time we spend arguing about oil we might as well have a new topic to bicker about right?

Maybe, SNOTROTT... So, None of the gear regardless of the time.

Len

[henzilla]

Their injuries have pushed the price of a bike license to over $600 ($1400 for a sport bike).

It costs to have the privelege to RIDE in Canada?

It is a added endorsement on the regular drivers license after a written/road test in Texas. And maybe a $50 fee...been almost 40 years since I took it.

Or is that the cost of registration of the bike? Still high!