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Thread: The big renovation: 1908 home

  1. #46
    looking for a coal mine knary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBasa View Post
    There's nothing inherently wrong with tract homes. It's just that so many of them are just awful architecture.


    My point was that people talk about these old homes as though they were built with a kind of love, artistry and craftsmanship remarkably different from what you'd find today. I don't see much evidence to back this up. It seems like the same misty eyed nostalgia that would have one believe a new K1300 was somehow inferior to a /7 as though the latter was made with hugs and genius. While I can understand preferring the look and feel of the older product, let's not delude ourselves into believing they didn't come with their own share of issues, mistakes, and corners cut to save a dime.

    Open Studios is this weekend. Who wants to bet I get asked more questions about the house than the paintings?

  2. #47
    Registered User RINTY's Avatar
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    "...awful architecture." Kbasa
    And most new subdivisions, with their cookie cutter architectural controls, are just as awful. I call them the stucco ghettos.

    But I like the older areas where the houses are all different, and where there are generous side yards and set backs, so that there is more light and privacy.

    Of course, in many places, these properties are very expensive.
    Rinty

    "When you don't know where you're going, any road will get you there."

  3. #48
    Registered User redclfco's Avatar
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    I'm a fool for old wood

    Quote Originally Posted by knary View Post


    My point was that people talk about these old homes as though they were built with a kind of love, artistry and craftsmanship remarkably different from what you'd find today. I don't see much evidence to back this up. It seems like the same misty eyed nostalgia that would have one believe a new K1300 was somehow inferior to a /7 as though the latter was made with hugs and genius. While I can understand preferring the look and feel of the older product, let's not delude ourselves into believing they didn't come with their own share of issues, mistakes, and corners cut to save a dime.

    Open Studios is this weekend. Who wants to bet I get asked more questions about the house than the paintings?
    Your bit left buried in the framing is a fine example of your point. What I find amazing in turn of the century homes that I've remodeled is the amazing woodwork; this may not be the case in your home, I don't know.

    I saved all the window trim, baseboard and stripped and reinstalled. The baseboard was 6-8" high, the moldings are curved, beautiful works of art. The stairway banisters are stunning when stripped back to the original red oak, and simply not done in a moderately priced home of today. The liberal use of real oak versus today's particle board, the countless hours put into doing the lathe and plaster amazes me. 9 ft. celings...get out of here! What a great feeling!

    The part that killed me to throw away in the last house was a wood floor done in 1" hickory strips. When I bought this 1898 house, the boiler had shut off in the middle of the winter, and all the water had ended up all over the floors destroying them. Try to imagine my love for little bitty nails!
    I came back with prego; shazam!

    Dollar for dollar was it worth stripping off 15 layers of lead paint on some of this stuff? No. But did it make the sale for the people who bought these homes? Without a doubt, the "love" factor came into play, and in each case got close to the price I was asking with very little haggling.

    The hours and hours of work to put this stuff back on the walls was totally ridiculous, and that time was not factored into the bottom line when everything was done. My only excuse is I love old wood.

  4. #49
    JAMESDUNN
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    Quote Originally Posted by knary View Post


    My point was that people talk about these old homes as though they were built with a kind of love, artistry and craftsmanship remarkably different from what you'd find today. I don't see much evidence to back this up. It seems like the same misty eyed nostalgia that would have one believe a new K1300 was somehow inferior to a /7 as though the latter was made with hugs and genius. While I can understand preferring the look and feel of the older product, let's not delude ourselves into believing they didn't come with their own share of issues, mistakes, and corners cut to save a dime.

    Open Studios is this weekend. Who wants to bet I get asked more questions about the house than the paintings?
    It is and always was a matter of money. One advantage with your old house is that it has full dimensional lumber (not nominal dimension such as a modern 2x4 that is actually a 1 1/2 x 3 1/2) and it was cut from old growth forest with less knots. Stronger frame.
    Having built and remodeled many homes and other structures, I'd say the details are where a lot of the perceived quality and value are added. Trim is very noticable and can be expensive. Tall detailed base and crown molding are details that add value and cost money, as does wainscotting and coffered ceilings; things like that. When these items are installed and done with care and skill it can make an otherwise ordinary house, extraordinary.
    You will no doubt be asked more about the house!

  5. #50
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    I'm convinced that the 1 7/16 x 3 7/16 dimensions of a modern 2x4 is a scam to promote waste and therefore consumption! If they can all be that size, they could all be whatever size they want. Think of how much simpler it would all be if everything was a true unit size!

  6. #51
    JAMESDUNN
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    Quote Originally Posted by knary View Post


    I'm convinced that the 1 7/16 x 3 7/16 dimensions of a modern 2x4 is a scam to promote waste and therefore consumption! If they can all be that size, they could all be whatever size they want. Think of how much simpler it would all be if everything was a true unit size!
    Okay, technically most are 1x 7/16" x 3 7/16". But it is wise to purchase studs for instance, from the same supplier as they can, and oft times do vary in thickness, width and length! I am not exactly sure when the nominal dimensions started (after WW2 sometime) but it has been around a long time. True sizes in any building material seldom applies though. Chipboard (O.S.B.) is sized for spacing and will be smaller as a result. A 3'0"door is actually the opening size, not the size of the door itself. I do know it is traditional now, but misleading, to call a 2x4 that, when it is actually a different dimension. I used to think it would be bettter if all building materials were sold on a "true size" basis. Agree.

  7. #52
    From MARS
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesdunn View Post
    Okay, technically most are 1x 7/16" x 3 7/16". But it is wise to purchase studs for instance, from the same supplier as they can, and oft times do vary in thickness, width and length! I am not exactly sure when the nominal dimensions started (after WW2 sometime) but it has been around a long time. True sizes in any building material seldom applies though. Chipboard (O.S.B.) is sized for spacing and will be smaller as a result. A 3'0"door is actually the opening size, not the size of the door itself. I do know it is traditional now, but misleading, to call a 2x4 that, when it is actually a different dimension. I used to think it would be bettter if all building materials were sold on a "true size" basis. Agree.
    The variations in widths of wall studs sure makes building a "perfect" wall difficult, but I'm not sure I want full dimension lumber to come back at this point in my life. Just think, every three 2X4's would then weigh the same as four of today's. My back hurts just thinking about standing up a wall made from full dimension wood; especially if it has a lot of windows framed out. If I ever have to build myself another house, which I hope to never do, I'm going to run all my framing material thru the planer and standardize the widths.

    The worst part about working in a house that was lathe and plaster, for me, is trying to get the drywall to "flow" smoothly. With plaster, they worked with what they had and made it smooth by varying the plaster thickness; not an option with drywall.

    Red, I like old wood, too. There's nothing like the smell of old heart pine, but forget driving a nail in it. Thank God for torx-head screws.

    Tom

  8. #53
    Cage Rattler wezul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by knary View Post
    Open Studios is this weekend. Who wants to bet I get asked more questions about the house than the paintings?
    So why not have an impromptu mini-show in the gutted house?

    OK, I'm deranged.

  9. #54
    JAMESDUNN
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    Quote Originally Posted by From MARS View Post
    The variations in widths of wall studs sure makes building a "perfect" wall difficult, but I'm not sure I want full dimension lumber to come back at this point in my life. Just think, every three 2X4's would then weigh the same as four of today's. My back hurts just thinking about standing up a wall made from full dimension wood; especially if it has a lot of windows framed out. If I ever have to build myself another house, which I hope to never do, I'm going to run all my framing material thru the planer and standardize the widths.

    The worst part about working in a house that was lathe and plaster, for me, is trying to get the drywall to "flow" smoothly. With plaster, they worked with what they had and made it smooth by varying the plaster thickness; not an option with drywall.

    Red, I like old wood, too. There's nothing like the smell of old heart pine, but forget driving a nail in it. Thank God for torx-head screws.

    Tom
    It is fun following this post! Tom , obviously you have personal experience. You make many good points and all true. Nothing like "hands on" to gain perspective and insight.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by wezul View Post
    So why not have an impromptu mini-show in the gutted house?

    OK, I'm deranged.
    If I'd had the time to really clean the house! Great idea.

    The day went tremendously well. Sold a chunk of work, was flooded with some needed affirmation, and didn't say anything too off color. A very good day.

  11. #56
    From MARS
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesdunn View Post
    It is fun following this post! Tom , obviously you have personal experience. You make many good points and all true. Nothing like "hands on" to gain perspective and insight.
    Not to mention scars and callouses.

    Tom

  12. #57
    ian408
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    Remarkably lacking in photographs after the first batch

    Best of luck to you in getting it done on time.

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by ian408 View Post
    Remarkably lacking in photographs after the first batch

    Best of luck to you in getting it done on time.


    Photos coming.

  14. #59
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    Stay the course

    Scott,
    Great pics! Keep them coming.Remember great projects take longer and as an Architect said to a client once"you can make excuses for time but not for quality".
    Regards,Bruce

  15. #60
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    We've set a lofty goal of christmas dinner in the house.

    Excavation just started for the addition foundation.

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