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View Full Version : K1200GT wobble problem. Help needed



CA1200
08-25-2003, 09:19 PM
I have a NEW 03 K1200GT. Bought it at A&S in Rosville CA. and road it home 80 miles. Called the dealer up and advised them it had a stability problem (wobble) noticed at 50-80, which is as fast as I went that day. That it can be violant and increases with speed. I tested it for a week and it seemed to be related to wind/turbulance. Did not matter if the shield was up or down. I had changed tire pressure and it still happened. I have since then ridden loaded also with and without cruse on. I have adjusted the rear shock from 3-5 loaded. The shop ended up putting Metzlers on it. The Matzlers being the "least" problematic over the original Brigstones. I am 5'10" about 185 dressed to ride. It is not the first bike I have had with a fairing. I have ridden for years and have tried different positions on this bike. I now have 2600 on it and it (after my trip) is again in the hands of the shop.

After the first inspection they have stated:

1) yes there is a problem
2) A new issue for them unkown to GT's and them
3) They contacted BMW and tried what was asked inc different tires but it is still there. Less with the Metz.
4) They have completed papers/forms for an alert on the GT to BMW
5) Their other GT's have deminstrated the same issue. However, they are still selling GT's

(I was advised I could make my trip if I wanted to and return the bike after for further testing, which has been done. BMW stated it was safe for the trip)

So I am back from my trip and hear over the web that a lot of people are having problems with RS & GT's on the issue of "wobbleing". They personally are working on shock,tire, dampening settings and changing parts for aftermarket by themselves. Therefore, I end up wondering if -

1) have any changes you made really cured the problem or just made it less noticable
2) Have you told any shops about the issue
3) Any of you deal with A&S and tell them
4)Why are we dealing with a stability issue on a 18K bike
5) Are there really bikes out there without the issue. Some say yes. Then why are so many dealing with it.
6) has anybody nailed it down any particular thing and solved it

Anything you can add to solve this would be nice. Everytime I read an article on the bike it was good. I even talked to a few editors and they all denied any problems with the bikes they had to test. But stated that they would print anything i could get in writing that deffinately deals with the issue by BMW. So I have no bike and an issue. I am wondering if this can be solved

Help needed
:confused:

fish
08-26-2003, 08:09 PM
CA1200,

I'm by no means a k-bike expert, but I would just like to mention that there is very little about the GT that's new. It's essentially a KRS with a couple of extra fairing bits, but not enough (IMHO) to cause much difference in aero-related stability. I don't recall hearing about any aero-related stability issues on the KRS.
I've ridden a GT and it went through the air just like a KRS...as expected. Additionally, the KGT fairing bits have been in use for a couple of years (maybe more) in various police agencies around the world.

So, rather than trying to jump to a design-related defect conclusion, I have a few questions for you:

[list=1]
Does this happen on all road surfaces or just those with raingrooves? (I notice you are in the Bay Area, where raingrooves are a way of life)
Have you checked runout on your wheels?
When at freeway speeds, can you lighten the pressure on the bars to the point where you can tell if it's the bars wobbling or the entire bike?
Which specific tire model do you have? (I've noticed that Dunlop D220 and Michelin Macadams tend to follow longitudinal irregularities in road surfaces)
[/list=1]

CA1200
08-27-2003, 01:10 AM
Fish -

Thanks for the post. Here is what I can say so far.

1)Does this happen on all road surfaces or just those with rain grooves? (I notice you are in the Bay Area, where raingrooves are a way of life)
* It has happened on many different roads and surfaces even in OR where I was on and off the last week. I have not really had any rain grooves cause me problems.

Have you checked runout on your wheels?
* I personally looked/checked the rear with it was up on the center stand. But, no, not a complete guage/dial check. The shop has it again now and I am leaving it up to them.

When at freeway speeds, can you lighten the pressure on the bars to the point where you can tell if it's the bars wobbling or the entire bike?
* Actually, I have had it happen so much that I have tried different pressures on the bars when it occurs. But was never courageous enough to let go of them when it was wobbling. I would say, it is my opinion that the bars would move some. However, I believe they would not move in such a fashion as to completely indicate what is going on down lower. The feeling transmitted through the bars makes me feel as if the lower area is moving back and forth 4" or more. An exaggeration I am sure. But it sure is unnerving.

Which specific tire model do you have? (I've noticed that Dunlop D220 and Michelin Macadams tend to follow longitudinal irregularities in road surfaces)
* The shop put on Metzlers when they gave the bike back to me for my trip. They stated they "tried all 3 tires rated for the bike and found the Met's ?? 4's to be the best. However, the problem is still there". The originals were Brigstones I believe.

CA1200
09-01-2003, 11:01 PM
I have been contacted by the shop again and was advised that BMW asked them to "try" the ball joint even though my bike is not in the recall group and A&S did not note anything wrong with the joint.

So, they are still investigating and I have no bike.

CA1200
09-05-2003, 12:20 AM
Just got off the phone with A&S / Tim in service. He advised me that everybody is seriously looking at this / my ball joints even though they check out as far as the "current" BMW specs go. However, as I have already posted, BMW asked them to pull the ball joint for a replacement, which they did. They also received several other replacement joints and determined that they were also not quite right. Therefore, BMW is sending out a "special" joint and the opinion floating around is that even though the joints are checking our under current specs, that the current specs need to be revised. In the end, it seems people are starting to believe that there are a bunch of joints out there that check out but are not working properly. Now as per what I have been reading on all the sites that will not be NEW news all a lot of people out there. What may be new is that BMW may be closer to an actual recall if it proves out that there is a joint problem wider than excepted. I know, I know, that would be hard to believe. So I will leave it at this. According to A&S they are working directly with BMW and serious questions have been raised over the handling of my bike and BMW's current specs for parts.

I will know more in time.

PS
I did get something wrong awhile back. I posted earlier that all BMW GT's on the floor of A&S were reported to me to have a problem, which was felt by Tim. Upon further pressing of the situation today, I was advised that several do but there are also some that do not. Why do I not have one of them? Well, that would be because I am caught in the middle of a "warrantee" issue since I took that particular bike. If I rejected it in the first place I possibly would be sitting on a good bike now. It was a case where I test-drove one and was given another. My luck.

BouncinBob
09-05-2003, 07:14 PM
This is all very interesting. I have an original K12RS. While at 4 Winds I was talking with the owner of a new K12GT. He had previously owned the original K12RS (with the non mirror pods). He said the new one did not cut through the wind as well as the old one. Much less stable in truck wash and at speed, hmmm. Wish I knew his name.

CA1200
09-06-2003, 02:00 AM
I wish you did also.

CA1200
09-22-2003, 02:56 AM
I was called by A&S. They / Tim stated that he thought the problem was gone with the last work they did. So I picked the bike up and put about 300 miles on it and I did not encounter the problem.

Yes it danced and wiggled under windshere, as a bike with a fairing will do. Perhaps this bike more than others of about the same size. But it did not get violent and "shaky" as it did before at times. However, remember I only felt it intermittently at 50+. A&S stated they felt something all the time starting at a much lower speed = 25 and growing with increased speed. We may not have felt the same thing. That question is still up in the air. But I did not run into the problem on my first test day and what Tim felt is gone.

I had fellow web member Gary with me on his RS. We had a long ride and he drove my bike just to give an opinion. It did not do it for him either. So, it is up in the air now and will need more testing. But here is an interesting note -

When I went back to A&S to get the bike I asked for an explanation of what was done and why this would effect or cause what I felt. I was advised that the last thing they did was to change my front ball joints. My bike is not in the "problematic" serial number group but they wer to try it anyway. I was told that the word had come down from BMW to try to find two joints which were "matched" and on the loose side. That would be matched in tolerance. Let me explain.

BMW has told A&S that they are now under the impression that if the joints are not matched, problems can occur in handling right from the start or after wear. As we all know, a ball joint works in all directions. Sometimes we forget that it also just turns on one plain. So, if you take a gauge and measure the resistance it takes to rotate the joint, you can measure its drag. BMW wanted two joints equal and on the loose side of their specs. Now I do not know if they have inside knowledge on this from past test or whatever. I was told that A&S was advised to just try this idea. I do not think I was given an answer as to why BMW came up with this idea and I still do not know how it would effect anything but slow speed turning. But they are in my bike and Tim / A&S believes it fixed what he was feeling. I will need more time to ride to see if my problem is gone.

What was done for me? I called BMW after being offered 300.00 to compensate for the 35 days of down time. I suggest that since my monthly payment was 378.00, they should change their compensation to match that figure. They did. I was told I would get a check in about two weeks.

I will give another update after more miles.

kbasa
09-22-2003, 03:13 AM
Originally posted by CA1200
What was done for me? I called BMW after being offered 300.00 to compensate for the 35 days of down time. I suggest that since my monthly payment was 378.00, they should change their compensation to match that figure. They did. I was told I would get a check in about two weeks.

I will give another update after more miles.

That was pretty decent.