Drinking and the bike, how do they do it?

[knary]

I made it home in one piece without incident from the brewpub fifteen blocks away. I hadn't planned on staying for more than one beer or one game of pool, but hours later and mostly sober I was climbing onto the bike. As soon as the bike was moving, I knew it was a very bad idea. Nothing happened, but riding suddenly felt awkward and difficult.

I won't do that again. How do the bar hopping bikers do it? I was barely inebriated last night. I suppose the answer is that they don't do it. They get into 'accidents', that are anything but, and become the source of so many of those motorcycling horror stories that non-riders love to tell - "My uncle died on one of those death machines!".

[BubbaZanetti]

thanks for the honesty, its refreshing to hear someone admit to this cause so many motorcyclist (not talking bikers) pretend like they don't do it. my rule for riding is generally 1 beer or if i'm somwhere for a long time, not more than a beer every 2 hours, and never more than 2 total..........

[Visian]

Anyone seen the billboards "Buzzed driving is drunk driving"....?

How do they do THAT?

Ian

[jmerlino]

Anyone seen the billboards "Buzzed driving is drunk driving"....?

How do they do THAT?

Ian

What do you mean?

[jmerlino]

How do the bar hopping bikers do it?

I guess they rely on luck. Me, I get nervous enough just riding the thing back from the store with a six pack in the side case.

[Braddog]

Some people believe (falsely) that one can build a "tolerance" for alcohol. In other words, it may take more alcohol to get a "regular" drinker inebriated, than someone who doesn't drink much, aka a "lightweight".

The bottom line is that people who drink regularly know how to accomodate, or make allowances for the alcohol. They may be able to walk a straight line better, know how to handle a car, etc. than someone who drinks alcohol infrequently. The alcohol is still impairing them, they're just makling allowances for it. Less "experienced" drinkers may be sloppy drunk.

I'm not talking about weight or food, both of which are factors. I mean, it's quite different if a 300 lb. biker downs 3 beers in an hour, than if a 100 lb. skinny teenager does the same thing.

Most of my drinking these days is down in the comfort of my patio or family room, usually with my shoes off, with no intention of going anywhere except to bed. :drink

[BMWBeauty]

Anyone seen the billboards "Buzzed driving is drunk driving"....?

How do they do THAT?

Ian


I Have, Right Outside The City Where I Live....I Haven't Quite Decided,
Which Makes One More Stupid...The One Actually That Has Done It, Or The One That Gets On The Back Of The Bike And Rides With Him.... :dunno
DAMHIK.......

[enjine]

Ever notice in 'Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance' how they're constantly drinking? It's like... Drive, Pull into town, go to Bar and order beers, Order Steaks, Drink more beer, Pull out of town, Drive.

and Repeat.

(though i'm only about 200 pages in, so that formula may change)

[deanzat]

Well, when you're drinking, good judgment is the first thing to go, so a lot of folks simply don't realize how impaired they are. Even without drinking, there's a proven inverse relationship between competence and confidence; the more incompetent people are, the higher they tend to rate their abilities. Whereas highly competent people tend to always question themselves (and therefore continue to learn). I swear when I read that study I thought it explained nearly everything!

But while we're on the subject of "how can they do that?" I need to know how people can ride without jackets or full helmets with visors. I was riding with my visor up the other day and got nailed just above the bridge of my glasses by an acorn at about 45 mph. I didn't lose control, but dang that hurt, and at 75 mph it would have been a different story. When I look at the dings in my car windshield, then see the rider beside me in a tank top and knee-puck helmet, I'm truly amazed. DZ

[deanzat]

Ever notice in 'Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance' how they're constantly drinking? It's like... Drive, Pull into town, go to Bar and order beers, Order Steaks, Drink more beer, Pull out of town, Drive.

and Repeat.

(though i'm only about 200 pages in, so that formula may change)

I don't remember that part, but I sure remember the book. The philosophy soliloquies can be tedious, but the book has one of the best (and latest!) endings in literature. As a father I get chills just thinking about it. Enjoy. DZ

[RTRandy]

The very first thing they went over in the beginners motorcycle safety course for over an hour was about how all the statistics for motorcycle accidents were totally stacked against riders who had consumed alcohol. It was like 90%. If you want to go drink, then go drink. Just don't bring the bike or car along.

We have a cruiser shop here in Dallas that sells nothing but choppers and connected on the same property is this huge biker bar called Sneaky Petes. It's got tons of beer signs all over it and it's totally packed on the weekends. Sad.

[knary]

If you want to go drink, then go drink. Just don't bring the bike or car along.

I still don't know why our friends/neighbors went to the brewpub a mile away when there's a perfectly good one barely more than a 1/4 mile away. The term is "staggering distance". :evil

[blake]

scott,

thanks for admitting that you were a total asshat for riding after you'd been drinking. :nyah

it would probably be in your best interest to not use up brainpower thinking about how weird it feels. save that mental energy to avoid riding your bike into the side of your house when you make it home.

[Visian]

What do you mean?

Scott asked how do people drive/ride drunk.

I asked how do people drive/ride stoned.

Ian

[BMWBeauty]

Scott asked how do people drive/ride drunk.

I asked how do people drive/ride stoned.

Ian

I Don't Think You Will Get An HONEST Answer To That Question....

[Callmethebreeze]

I Don't Think You Will Get An HONEST Answer To That Question....
Nah, I've driven stoned....drove behind a semi on a gravel road in Montana. Beat the crap out of the bike and me. Never do that again!!!
Seriously though, it would be a tough bet unless you were riding slowly on a bone dry straight slab with no traffic. How often does that happen? Rule of thumb, "smoke a bowl, park the bike"

Breeze

[BMWBeauty]

Nah, I've driven stoned....drove behind a semi on a gravel road in Montana. Beat the crap out of the bike and me. Never do that again!!!
Seriously though, it would be a tough bet unless you were riding slowly on a bone dry straight slab with no traffic. How often does that happen? Rule of thumb, "smoke a bowl, park the bike"

Breeze

And Just How Often Does "That Rule Of Thumb" Happen? Honestly?!!

[username]

Scott asked how do people drive/ride drunk.

I asked how do people drive/ride stoned.

Ian

i have some acquaintances that are clearly alcoholics and drink a *lot.* they are "functioning alcoholics." they hold a job, they drive, they play sports, they read the newspaper, all of this while drinking/drunk. theyve been this way for 10-20 years! to me, it is un-freaking-believable, but it seems that their nervous system has adapted. the three tell tales i've seen from them are really red looking face skin, they talk too much, and they pee a whole lot.

similarly i know some dedicated stoners. same story. they'll talk about a trip rafting through the grand canyon, or climbing a mountain, and they were stoned the entire time. (weed is a way more portable and nature friendly vice as compared to alcohol. :D ) their tell tales are that they are super mellow, don't get all that angry, and are in general, happy people that enjoy almost every situation they are in.

i feel way safer hanging with the stoners.

both of these groups, as i know them, are essentially professional impaired people. they are almost *always* f-ed up.

i think it'd be really interesting to get these people together and test them, and see how impaired they really are. maybe they are just really talented, and the drug brings them to the level of a normal person? i know lots of uncoordinated, blindingly stupid people that hold jobs and operate machinery, and they have far worse track records than the professional impaired people.

the human body and mind are complex and varied systems. it makes sense that some people have a different capacity and ability to function after consuming a substance, just as some people are allergic to things, or some people just have high cholesterol, etc. how do two people eat the same meal and have different:

- preferences for the taste.
- bowel movements.
- weight gain.

[Emoto]

This is not intended as an answer to the original question. I don't know why people who want to go from bar to bar would choose a bike to do it on.

I don't have time to go find one, but there are charts Out There that show body weight and the amount of alcohol that one can metabolize per hour. This is usually accompanied by something that talks about the alcohol content of various common alcoholic beverages. From this information, one can compute, in rough terms, how close to being LEGALLY impaired one is. Cut the "allowable" amount back by, say 50%, and what you have left is an amount of alcohol that you may be able to consume without having a problem. I don't advocate drinking and riding, but understanding the rate at which one metabolizes it can be quite valuable.

If I am out on the bike and going to have a beer, I will tend to make it a Guinness, because it is lower in alcohol than most beers. I have been known to have a couple of beers and then switch to water for an hour or more, just to make sure things have been taken care of before I head out.

[Belquar]

Chew on this for a bit. No alcohol kill someone...accident. Alcohol...kill someone....you were impaired. Much stiffer penalties.

Doesn't matter if you had one beer or twelve. Do what you can afford, not what you think you can get away with. sooner or later your luck will run out. When I was in the army...drove drunk quite often. got away with it. there have been times in my life where I question the next day how I got where I was. BAD!!!!

While living in Durango, CO...working at a dude ranch...me, friends and ranch guests were going out to party in town. I was the lead car...we had only had a few. All were probably legally sober. Drunk guy coming towards us down the road forced me to swerve. Clipped the pickup behind me, bed full of people. 11 total in that little truck. Went head on with the third and final car in our party. Killed our friend John, the driver, made one of our guests a paraplegic, reduced one kid's mentality to that of a 3 year old, severed an ear, broke a girls neck, ruptured her spleen and shattered her maxilla, one guy escaped with just a broken hand and facial lacerations. Windshield broke his fall.

That was it. Lives get destoyed too easily when you drive under the influence. If you do you are a narcissistic A$*hole. No offense to anyone. Just think of it as if it were a member of your family. How would you feel.

[riderR1150GSAdv]

Body weight is a very important factor in metabolizing alcohol and that's one reason big/tall people can have more than skinny/short people.
Personally I don't mix riding/driving and drinking EVER.
This past summer in Paonia there was some REALLY good microbrew :brad and needless to say everyone there was tasting more than should be legal :buds :buds , but NOBODY went for a ride afterwards. As a matter of fact the group I was with didn't ride at all during the rally!

[jmerlino]

I assumed the whole "buzzed driving is drunk driving thing" is tartgeted at people who only have a couple of drinks. People who'd say, I can drive, I'm just buzzed, I'm not drunk. I didn't think it was targeted at pot smokers.

In any case, there's no "how" to it. People just do it. It's not wise, but they do.

[ironMan]

I’ve had the pleasure (not) of riding with a group of bar hoppers a couple of times. What the non hoppers don’t realize is that crowd normally rides with little regard for safety so their riding style after pounding down a ton of alcohol is not much different than their sober riding style. We meet up from time to time and talk bikes but we generally avoid riding together. They just can’t seem to last 150 miles without a couple of beers.

[SNC1923]

I echo the compliments to Knary for his honesty.

I think nothing of having a couple of beers (2 or 3) and driving a car. I'm not saying that's a good idea or that I should, but it's happened many times. Any more than that, and I can feel that I'm not safe and that I could cause or get into an accident. I weigh about 230 pounds, have been drinking beer most of my life, and consider the amount of time it takes me to ingest and metabolize the beer.

I've ridden after having one beer and once after having two beers. It makes me V E R Y uncomfortable and uneasy and I feel vulnerable, as though risking my life (duh).

I won't do it anymore. Too risky. Harleys parked outside of bars make me shudder.

On another note, and this is NO JUSTIFICATION for motoring while drinking, but I think driving and riding are completely different enterprises. Likewise drinking booze and smoking pot. Nonetheless, probably not a good idea to alter your judgement/reaction times and operate "heavy machinery." :buds

[SNC1923]

What a terrible story. Sure does give me something to think about. . . .

While living in Durango, CO...working at a dude ranch...me, friends and ranch guests were going out to party in town. I was the lead car...we had only had a few. All were probably legally sober. Drunk guy coming towards us down the road forced me to swerve. Clipped the pickup behind me, bed full of people. 11 total in that little truck. Went head on with the third and final car in our party. Killed our friend John, the driver, made one of our guests a paraplegic, reduced one kid's mentality to that of a 3 year old, severed an ear, broke a girls neck, ruptured her spleen and shattered her maxilla, one guy escaped with just a broken hand and facial lacerations. Windshield broke his fall.

That was it. Lives get destoyed too easily when you drive under the influence. If you do you are a narcissistic A$*hole. No offense to anyone. Just think of it as if it were a member of your family. How would you feel.

[Callmethebreeze]

And Just How Often Does "That Rule Of Thumb" Happen? Honestly?!!


I'm starting a survey right now. Are you in?


Breeze

[manicmechanic]

Along the lines of honesty, back in my younger days, just before I was about to exit Uncle Sam's Yacht Club, 'twas Halloween. The only vehicle I had was a '74 Kawi 400 with a windscreen, kickstart only. I met up with a couple buds at a place about 40 miles away from the base where the ship was. A band was setting up and I was talking with them, found out they were from a town near my hometown, and that we had acquaintences in common. As the night progressed I got deeper into my cup. Much later became time to head back to the ship. I remember starting the bike, cleaning the frost off the windscreen and saddle, and following my buds to the interstate. I also remember waking up the next morning on the ship, in my bunk, wondering how I got there. I dressed and went on deck, and I could see the bike parked where it was supposed to be. Never again do I drink and drive.

[Bob_M]

In the halcyon days of my youth, taking a long, soul searching (didn't find it) motor trip through mexico on a honda 350, I found myself in the town of Campeche in the Yucatan. Over huevos rancheros that morning I met a local who befriended me and we rode around and he showed me around. My spanish was limited and his english was of no help. About 2 in the PM he took me to his favorite watering hole. I had not eaten. The patrons of the establishment all befriended me yet further and bought me vodka shots. It was long after dark that it dawned on me that I was in a maricones bar (gay bar). I was ripped to the gills, but at that point I decided it was in my best interest to leave. Several weeks earlier I had broken off the kick starter, so I bump started the bike and roared off into the night. Well out of town, I was looking for a suitable place to camp, and rode the bike where I was looking, right off the road! It was a fine place to camp, but not a good place to sleep, I wretched all night, :sick and in the morning found that my hands (even through the gloves) were pretty banged up. I have the opportunity to drink and ride quite frequently, but I avoid it. If my resolve weakens I have a strict one beer limit which does not get broken. Having fallen down while stupid I learned I don't like it.

[BMWBeauty]

I'm starting a survey right now. Are you in?


Breeze


Definitely....And The Answer Is NO.....But I Will Admit To Riding As A Pillion With Someone Who Had Done It.....Actually More Than Once......
So I Guess That Makes Him Stupid And Me Ignorant (I Knew Better)
For Riding With Him.... Thank GOD...Those Days Are Over.....
My Bike Is Hard Enough For Me To Handle WithOut Being Under The Influence Of Anything....

[bullit7801]

On my return to Vermillion last nite at about 10:30 PM, I was greeted by SIX South Dakota State Patrol cars doing a drunk driving stop. They had the road blocked and were talking to everyone. They were polite, I was driving the pickup and had not been drinking. They asked if I had had anything alcoholic that day, and I assume they were prepared to test for greater than .08%. Where was I coming from, where was I going. Move along.

This was the first time I have ever been stopped at one of these. Another reason not to blow .09.

tb

[naddy100]

I was eighteen, once upon a time.

Morgan Freeman's response to the parole board in Shawshank Redemption struck a chord among the incarcerated. Summarized and paraphrased, it's like 'I'm not the person you locked up. That person is long gone. However, if I could, I would go back and explain things to that young person -- but he wouldn't listen.'
Noel

[Cliffy777]

I don't drive the bike after any beer/alcohol 'cuz I remember from my younger days that it felt sooo good to go a little faster after a couple of cocktails. Yipes. Earlier this year I overhead a guy joking about how he rode home so drunk that he forgot to put his foot down at a stop light and fell over in the street on his bike. He thought it was a real hoot.
I was so stunned I didn't think of anything to say.

[knary]

Once upon a time I was an MSF instructor. Big Jim showed up for the class on blackened puddle of filthy oil with a grimy mid-70's Harley jutting out of it. What paint wasn't caked with grime was red. Big Jim's run in with the law after ten too many beers had landed him in jail. The judge had yanked his license and sentenced him to a day or three behind bars and, surprise surprise, riding school. Despite an attitude that only a convict could love and his utter denial of counter-steering, he passed the class without much fuss. The man could ride.

On my way into town, there was a bar I would pass. Nearly every time I went by, there was the same blackened puddle of oil with the old red Harley jutting out of it.

:banghead

[PacWestGS]

Knary, you are one brave soul to post a message like this. And, I can see from the follow-ups that there are and have been others whom have learned some of life's lessons: the easy way, the hard, and the way you never forget.

I'm still working on being perfect, it is not easy but I have learned what I can, and cannot do. For me it's a one drink/hour limit, max three, over that my wife gets the controls, and she doesn't ride; so we better be driving, or I'm staying sober. And it's a rare event to go out to drink, it's more often like knary's deal; sh!t-happens while you are away.

For those who have followed my posts you will remember the one where I said I parked my GPZ900 under a car one night (long story): I won't bore you with all the details and it was 20-years ago. I "thought" I had done a lot of things well before getting on my bike. I hadn't drank much (five or six 4oz JD&Coke over two and half-hours), it was a 'Full-Dress' (Class-A's) affair, Battalion Christmas party with all the Brass present, five-course dinner involved, I left at 10:00, and walked back to the barracks, at 12:30 I was lonely (we'd been deployed for two-weeks and had just returned) I pulled on my leathers got on my bike and drove to a little German town about five-miles away, (great country-western bar) it was about 40-degrees and wet. I got to the bar without any trouble in fact had a triple-digit good time of it. The 'girl' had already left, so I sat there with other friends until closing time 02:00, I now had had nothing to drink (but coke) for four-hours and was {pretty} sober. On the way back to the installation I again had lots of fun riding up and down this (2-mile straight as an arrow road at 125+ miles an hour), once, then I turned around and headed for the barn, except I never made back to the barn (a half-mile farther), the last little German hamlet before the back gate had this amazing blind-"S" curve wrapped around a house. I was going the speed limit 50-Kph (30) when I came around the far side of that blind-"S"-turn, there was a stopped car in my lane making a left turn onto a side road, of all the options that went through my mind in a matter of seconds was this bike can turn sharper than that guy making his left, that and there was another car coming the opposite direction, stopping didn't seem to be an option I was committed to the turn. This time it wasn't meant to be, I felt the back tire go, and could only put the bike between me and him, I totaled the car, bouncing off the right rear tire and up onto the yard of that house, my bike was very wrecked and I had broken several bones in my hand and feet, but my nightmare was only beginning. German Police gave my a breathalyzer, failed, next was the mandatory blood test, of a 0.10 maximum, I was 0.12. Do you think that made any difference, NOPE, none at all; I was guilty as charged, my insurance company paid the other driver and informed me my full-coverage was waived on the account I was guilty of DUI. I lost my license, I paid for a wrecked bike over the term of the loan and faced a Field Grade Article 15. That was a long two and half-years to look out the window at my smashed bike wrapped in a sheet of plastic.

I hope that will convince some of you "That Rule of Thumb" people out there that it's always a losing 'Rule' if you do. Whether it's you or the other guy who’s been drinking someone is bound to lose everything.

I now have a wonderful wife, a terrific job that pays me very well and enjoy the life I have, and I'm retired from that same military. I have watched others over twenty-plus years throw it all away in one night of stupidity and can only think of the night I almost threw it away.

I don’t know how those other guys do it; bar hop or do drugs and survive from one day to the next, I’m sure a lot of them don’t you just won’t hear about it or read about it in the local newspaper because it happens all the time somewhere. It is not a ‘news’ event when some “Biker” wraps himself and anyone with him around a guardrail post outside of any town USA. Ask the Firemen, the Paramedic, or Police friends you know, but they probably won’t tell you about it unless you ask.

I know this; “My life” (all encompassing) is not worth losing over something preventable. Call a cab, call a friend, call the police and ask for a ride home; even they won’t give you one, they will help you get there.

There, that’s the last Russell M. (SFDOC) crash story. If my embarrassing moments and lessons learned stories help you avoid these same mistakes I’m glad to help. If it helps keep any one of you alive it was worth telling.

"Keep the rubber side down, because when it goes up you are no longer in control"

[RTRandy]

I was eighteen, once upon a time.

Morgan Freeman's response to the parole board in Shawshank Redemption struck a chord among the incarcerated. Summarized and paraphrased, it's like 'I'm not the person you locked up. That person is long gone. However, if I could, I would go back and explain things to that young person -- but he wouldn't listen.'
Noel


Get busy living or get busy dying.

[wanderer]

I've been an insurance agent for 21 years now. I've done accident reports of every type imagineable. I knew these people. Auto fatalities, motorcycle fatalities, drunk auto fatalities, both drunks and victims of drunks. Drunk motorcycle fatalities, both drunks and victims of drunks. Multiple fatalities and child fatalities.

I rode Honda's and a Yankee in the 60's, Harleys in the 70's, Honda's in the 90's and Bemmers in this century.

I've driven and ridden totally drunk, stoned on pot, hash, coke, opium and PCP. I rode cross country (1K) on my Harley on PCP. (That little stunt ended me in the drug rehab ward, voluntairly.) That's also when I decided it was time to start a new life, which I did and still do.(about 1978)

I am certain there is no earthly reason for me to be alive. Now days I usually drink tea and don't smoke anything. When bike touring we park for the night and walk or cab if we are going to drink at all.


Here's my point. I really KNOW that absolutely no one could submit to scientific testing and not be impaired to some extent when useing any amount of most any drug. I know, by my own life, you can get away with it. I also know (now) that my BEST chance of always comeing home from a ride is to be totally drug free ( including caffine) and well rested. I'm not trying to tell anyone that my life experience makes me more of an authority than them. I am saying don't talk yourself into some self determined limit under which your drug intake really doesn't matter. It all matters all the time. The real question is, How lucky do you feel? I don't believe that any of the people who regularly post here, if told you will face an emergency on you bike that will test your abilities to the maxium and it will be a life or death test, would have a drink or 2 or 3 or talk about weight or body mass. That's not a put down to any other posts, I'm just asking each of you to be totally honest with yourself. I've never met anyone AFTER the crash that didn't second guess if they could have done better if they were drug free. Sometimes that's a very heavy burden that can last a lifetime.

WOW, that's some morbid crap Eh? But I'll let it stand. :bikes

[Friedle]

Poorly.

Friedle

[deanzat]

Last night I attended a "reunion" of former coworkers with about a thousand people. Normally, I would have been drinking as heavily as everyone else, but I rode, so I stuck to diet coke all evening. I had a great time not drinking, and there was this great relief of pressure I didn't even know I was feeling in the past. I felt smart and cheerful and, for the first time in many years at such an event, didn't wake up worrying if I had said something really stupid.

I like to drink, but I didn't realize how often I must drink just because it's what's going on. My son's high school has this voluntary drug testing program that parents and students sign up for. Apparently, the idea is that kids who don't want to do drugs (like my son) get their parents to sign up. Then, when their friends try to get them to smoke or pop or whatever, they can say their parents have them on the testing program (which is heavily advertised on campus) so they can't. Again, a tremendous relief of peer pressure. Pretty clever, really.

Now I have an equally convenient excuse: I'm riding. DZ

[PacWestGS]

I had a great time not drinking, and there was this great relief of pressure I didn't even know I was feeling in the past. I felt smart and cheerful and, for the first time in many years at such an event, didn't wake up worrying if I had said something really stupid.

DZ

Thread Hijack :dance

Isn't it fun to go to 'Social Drunk Fest' and stay sober? :bottle I have had some of the best times of my life either being the 'designated driver' or staying sober because of my incident. It is really really funny to watch people even your friends get inebriated and make fools of themselves. :boldpurpl :ha :sick Ever wonder what you look like drunk, :jester just look around… :evil



:hide

[wanderer]

Some of the greatest learning experiences of my life were when bar tending. It was amazing seeing some of the same people come in night after night and sit on the same stool and drink themselves into oblivion. Not necessairly humorus or sad, just kind of educational in a different sort of way. :buds

These days I kind of get a kick when I find myself driving late at night and see police. I'm stone cold sober and don't get that oh! oh! feeling I used to have when I used to drink, even moderately, and drive.

[manicmechanic]

On a similar thought, I used to go on charity rides with various groups, so of which were "authority" organizations. I question what image is being presented when all these riders show up for the ride, have a couple before the ride even starts, ride en masse to each stop (about 30 miles per leg), and the stops are at taverns, where a lot of them have a couple more. Sorry, I don't care what the charity is, I'm not going to ride with a bunch of inebriated folks. There is no justification for it.

[BradfordBenn]

The one time I hve ridden when I have had a drink was at a motorcycle rally and I scared the beejuzzes out of myself. Luckily it was a short ride and the roads were deserted, but it still was stupid. With a Capital Dumb A$$

Since then I have set a rule, if I am riding no adult beverages. Period.

[roy]

I have never been drunk so don't know for sure how that feels but have undoubtly done things that were just as dumb.

I have driven for over 24 hrs straight more than once(never on a bike). When I was doing field service work it was not uncommon to leave home and drive 4 hrs to be at a factory by 7:00 AM, work at least 10 hrs then drive home or to the next job site. I know I was far from alert but thank God I never had an accident.

Now older, and maybe a little wiser, I realize it just isn't worth dying over or worse hurting some one else.

[GeneT]

Any time you drink and ride your courage increases, your judgement decreases and you take chances you normally would not consider, hence disaster is foremost.

I am not against drinking, if you were to line my empty scotch bottels up they probably would reach accross the state, but I limit this to my patio, hopefully others do also. :dance

[ironMan]

I am not against drinking, if you were to line my empty scotch bottels up they probably would reach accross the state, but I limit this to my patio, hopefully others do also.

Single or Double malt?

[GeneT]

I am not against drinking, if you were to line my empty scotch bottels up they probably would reach accross the state, but I limit this to my patio, hopefully others do also.

Single or Double malt?

Answer......Both. I once workred in the same place as a painter which insisted they never made a bad scotch and after all these years I believe he was right.
:dance

[SCDorman]

Answer......Both. I once workred in the same place as a painter which insisted they never made a bad scotch and after all these years I believe he was right.
:dance

I tend to agree, but tonight it's Lagavulin 16. Mmm.

[deanzat]

I got introduced to single malt scotch just this January. January 11th, in fact, the day after a flood filled my house with mud (www.pbase.com/deanzat).

Dozens of people showed up on the 11th to shovel mud and help us move all of our surviving possessions out. Then, a little after 5:00, the husband of one of my wife's friends showed up with a bottle of Glenfiddich (sp?).

Every first sip of scotch recalls that "It's a Wonderful Life" feeling, surrounded by people who appeared unasked, just because we needed help.

Dang, I'm getting all misty now. Think I'll go pour one... DZ

[screwtop]

I used to drink and ride, and I'm quite lucky to be able to say that I have never been caught. Looking back, I realize how stupid it was and have friends with 20K pricetags on DWI arrests (lawyer's fees, etc.) that I have used as examples, and learned from their mistakes.

In MD the legal limit is .08, but in the District of Columbia some lady got arrested when she blew a .03 last week. Aparently, she only had 1 glass of wine w/ dinner, but the cop made the judgement that she was impaired and she went to the slammer. This is what it's coming to with 0 tolerance policies on this kind of crap, and even 1 beer puts you at risk if things are open to subjectivity. To make matters worse, cops are all over the place, and they are getting even more clever with their unmarked cars. Hell, I saw one in an unmarked Honda Accord last week on route 70.

Take home story....park the damn bike if you're gonna drink.

[Mika]

Always believed drinking and riding do not mix. What I found this weekend was hangovers and riding don't mix, at least for me.

I know I am opening myself up for the mandatory old jokes or light weight. I am not a prude when it comes to drinking either. The question is – Is there more to the issue of drinking and driving?

My niece was married Friday evening. All had a great reception and I took a cab home. Saturday I was going to go for a ride to “clear my head”. My first stop was the Lilydale gas station. The one mile ride led me to believe I would have to wait for a while before riding. 14 hours after leaving the reception my reaction time and level of awareness was not up to riding. I went riding Sunday.

How many accidents happen when someone is not impaired in the sense of blood alcohol, but are impaired by the aftermath? Maybe it is the adrenaline from our sport that clears the head. Pondering this thread over its life has made me expand the line –

Friends don’t let friends drive dunk – or hungover.

[James.A]

Always believed drinking and riding do not mix. What I found this weekend was hangovers and riding don't mix, at least for me.

I know I am opening myself up for the mandatory old jokes or light weight. I am not a prude when it comes to drinking either. The question is – Is there more to the issue of drinking and driving?

I am here to testify that you CAN get a D.U.I. on a hangover.

[BMWBeauty]

Always believed drinking and riding do not mix. What I found this weekend was hangovers and riding don't mix, at least for me.

I know I am opening myself up for the mandatory old jokes or light weight. I am not a prude when it comes to drinking either. The question is – Is there more to the issue of drinking and driving?

My niece was married Friday evening. All had a great reception and I took a cab home. Saturday I was going to go for a ride to “clear my head”. My first stop was the Lilydale gas station. The one mile ride led me to believe I would have to wait for a while before riding. 14 hours after leaving the reception my reaction time and level of awareness was not up to riding. I went riding Sunday.

How many accidents happen when someone is not impaired in the sense of blood alcohol, but are impaired by the aftermath? Maybe it is the adrenaline from our sport that clears the head. Pondering this thread over its life has made me expand the line –

Friends don’t let friends drive dunk – or hungover.

I Become Very Hypoglycemic With A Hangover....It Takes About 8-10 Hours For My Blood Sugar To Stabilize....From Experience As Riding As A Pillion With A Hangover.....I Know Better Than To Ever Try To Manage Riding My Own Bike....

[DLilah]

I never drink and drive. Never could understand how anyone could - I notice how impaired I am just walking and talking when I've been drinking, let alone driving. Drinking and riding is completely unthinkable. There is too much involved in riding a motorcycle to even think that you can do it with even one drink, or under the influence of anything. I won't even ride if I am not feeling completely well or am tired. I believe that not riding when your head is not 100% in the game, no matter what the reason, will afford you the opportunity to ride another day. To me, it's worth the wait for the next riding opportunity.

Unfortunately, there are way too many people that think they are indestructible. I really believe that people believe it will never happen to them - whether it is an accident or a DUI. And it's not even the drinking and riding that gets me. STRESS and I were driving our truck down Route 89 (a two-lane highway by us) and coming towards us are two guys on sport bikes doing tricks. Not just wheelies. The one guy actually stood up on the seat of his bike riding down this road right before a turn. I was sooo angry. My feeling is that if he cares that little about his own safety and wants to do tricks like that on the open road, that is his business, but if he hit a bump in the road and went flying off that bike, we most likely would have killed him. We are the ones that would have to live with that. I think there are many, many people in this world that put completely innocent strangers in similar situations while they are doing something stupid, especially drinking and driving/riding. It always seems to be the innocent ones that are the ones that suffer the most.

[jmerlino]

I never drink and drive. Never could understand how anyone could - I notice how impaired I am just walking and talking when I've been drinking, let alone driving.

I think there are some people who don't feel impaired when they drink. I don't have any actual evidence of this, it's just a suspicion of mine from observing some people. I have this feeling that there some people who actually feel better when they drink, and even though they know that they shouldn't drive/ride/whatever when they've been drinking, it doesn't feel to them like they're any less capable.

[Kenny2]

Where do I start?...
well, young and dumb and full of..... I rode home from a girlfriends house, remember leaving her place...and hitting the garage door at my house. none of the 20 some miles between the two. :dunno

Today, nothing wrong with 10 hours between bottle and throttle.
And that First cold one AFTER 850 miles in the saddle going cross country. MMMMM..

:drink

Don't drink it untill I park it!!!

[The_Veg]

I knew a guy in the army who got taken in by the MPs for drunk driving once. After our NCOIC picked him up from the MPs he took a dismissive tone when he said a drink or two doesn't hurt anything. Oddly enough his dad was a liquor wholesaler. I wonder what ever happened to him.

[twins4life]

Even without drinking, there's a proven inverse relationship between competence and confidence; the more incompetent people are, the higher they tend to rate their abilities. Whereas highly competent people tend to always question themselves (and therefore continue to learn). I swear when I read that study I thought it explained nearly everything!

DZ
Thats great, where did you read that?????

[jmerlino]

Thats great, where did you read that?????

That IS great. On a musicians forum I read, some guy came on, announced that he'd been riding his bike (some torquey japanese sport bike) for a whole week and it wasn't powerful enough for him anymore. He wanted to know what the fastest, most powerful bike out there was. One can only take comfort in the fact that he'll probably be out of the gene pool before he has a chance to reproduce.

But when you think about it, that kind of attitude actually makes sense. If you imagine that most skilled rider ever has a skill level at (or approaching) 100%, and someone who'd never sat on a bike had a skill level of 0%, a new rider is going from 0% to, oh, let's say 40% fairly quickly. Whereas from that point onward, he might gain a few points every year. Also, he's unaware of just what the 100% point might look like. The initial big jump is pretty heady, and he's not going to realize he's not all that until he encounters a tough situation or two.

[deanzat]

Thats great, where did you read that?????

http://www.phule.net/mirrors/unskilled-and-unaware.html

[BMWBeauty]

Originally Posted by deanzat
Even without drinking, there's a proven inverse relationship between competence and confidence; the more incompetent people are, the higher they tend to rate their abilities. Whereas highly competent people tend to always question themselves (and therefore continue to learn). I swear when I read that study I thought it explained nearly everything!

DZ


Thats great, where did you read that?????

The Focus Still Appears To Be On Drinking And Riding.....
Buzzed Driving IS Drunk Driving...... Some Smoke A Bowl....Ride The Bike....Meet With Friends....Smoke Another ...Ride The Bike....
What Is One's Competence/Abilities Under The Influence Of That? Or Do They Even Consider That......I Doubt It....
Where Do Liabilities Fall Into Place When Passengers Are Involved...
Or Is That Taken Into Consideration?.... I Am Quite Sure It Isn't....
Sooner Or Later It Catch's Up With Them......

[jmerlino]

I think it's safe to say that one shouldn't ride under the influence of anything. It's dangerous enough riding under the influence of other motorcyclists.

[BMWBeauty]

Shouldn't Ride Under Influence Of Any Substance....And Doing So Are 2 Separate Issues......It's The One's That Do It But Refuse To Admit It, Are The One's That Scare Me....

[einnar]

I never really 'had the chance' to drive impaired. I went straight into the military out of HS, and became an MP. I've also worked Search & Rescue. During the course of learning/doing all that, I saw countless accidents involving alcohol. It seemed there was a fatality about 80-90% of the time, and injuries almost 100%. Usually not the person drinking. Having to see the trauma up close, and seeing how it affected those people associated with the victims, I never had the urge to drive impaired. After going through a phase where I went drinking with buddies on off weekends, and not remembering any of them, I cut way back. Regardless of what I'm doing now, 2 is a maximum. If I'm in the car, 1 to be social, max of 2 if I'm eating as well. (with a long cooldown with water, etc after.) If I'm on the bike, the count will always be 0.

I can respect everyone who's made their mistakes, and lived through it to learn something. At the same time, I'm glad I was spared from those experiences.

[BMWBeauty]

I never really 'had the chance' to drive impaired. I went straight into the military out of HS, and became an MP. I've also worked Search & Rescue. During the course of learning/doing all that, I saw countless accidents involving alcohol. It seemed there was a fatality about 80-90% of the time, and injuries almost 100%. Usually not the person drinking. Having to see the trauma up close, and seeing how it affected those people associated with the victims, I never had the urge to drive impaired. After going through a phase where I went drinking with buddies on off weekends, and not remembering any of them, I cut way back. Regardless of what I'm doing now, 2 is a maximum. If I'm in the car, 1 to be social, max of 2 if I'm eating as well. (with a long cooldown with water, etc after.) If I'm on the bike, the count will always be 0.

I can respect everyone who's made their mistakes, and lived through it to learn something. At the same time, I'm glad I was spared from those experiences.

Do They Really Learn From It....Or Get Back On The Bike And Ride Again?....
Again We Are Just Not Speaking Of Drinking And Riding...But The Buzzed One's As Well......From A Pillion's Experience...(Riding With Someone Buzzed) I Have Learned My Lesson....
And I Guarantee It Will Never Happen Again..... Thank God No Accident Occured.....And I Am Quite Thank For It Will Never Be Repeated.... :)

[jmerlino]

Do They Really Learn From It....Or Get Back On The Bike And Ride Again?....

I'm sure it's like anything else. Some people do, and some people don't. There's enough stupidty in the world to go around, and then some.

[Mika]

Learning is simply the acquisition of knowledge. Wisdom is in the application of the knowledge. Knowledge can be acquired in many ways. There continues to be a great deal of learning going on; however wisdom, like common sense, remains an uncommon event it seems.

[MarkF]

I still don't know why our friends/neighbors went to the brewpub a mile away when there's a perfectly good one barely more than a 1/4 mile away. The term is "staggering distance". :evil

I was at a rally in Canada and stayed at a B&B 1/4 mile down the gravel road instead of camping there. They had a good comedian and I stayed later for beers. I have no idea how I got to bed but I do remember being scared to death. Never again. Two rules now. Only 1 beer with dinner if I'm riding and if I'm drinking I'm camping there.

[BMWBeauty]

I'm sure it's like anything else. Some people do, and some people don't. There's enough stupidty in the world to go around, and then some.


I Am Sure There Is......Denial Happens To Be The Ones That Refuse To Admit They Have Ridden Buzzed, Just Can't Seem To Admit To It.... The Sad Part They Get Back On Their BMW'S And Ride Buzzed Again.... That's Where Stupidity Overules....
. Not Pointing Fingers....Butt Some Haven't Replied To This Thread....
Don't Want "Friends" To Know They Do It.... :p

[The_Veg]

They Have Ridden Buzzed

I had to read that again- for a second I thought you said "Ridden Buzzard..."

[BMWBeauty]

I'm sure it's like anything else. Some people do, and some people don't. There's enough stupidty in the world to go around, and then some.

When It Comes To Stupidity......There Are Those Who Were First In Line.......
Stupid Is As Stupid Does......
Have You Ever Been Asked By A Stoned Rider In A Public Place..." Do I Look Stoned?"..... :(

[MarkF]

Have You Ever Been Asked By A Stoned Rider In A Public Place..." Do I Look Stoned?"..... :(

Nope.

[jmerlino]

Okay, Debra, we get it. You know someone who's ridden stoned.

[BMWBeauty]

Thanks , He Continues To Still Ride Stoned, Imagine That.....OH....He Is A Forum Member.....But Doesn't Want His Forum Friends To Know..... :hide
It's No Big Deal.....But For Him To Hide It, Refuse To Admit It Is Another Story..... Even To Himself.....It's Something I Can't Begin To Understand...... I Have Seen My Share Of Motorcycle Related Accidents Where DUI Is A Factor...... I Am A RN ............. Wow!!! In An Earlier Post....You Didn't Even Know What "Buzzed Driving Was"....
Do You Happen To Support That Type Of Riding?
A Shift In A Trama ER Setting, Or A Critical ICU May Change That....

[BradfordBenn]

Ahem.... let's remember this is supposed to be a fun place and attacks will not be tolerated - by either party.....

One of your friendly neighborhood moderators.

[James.A]

she sez "there is no looking back", but she never passes on a chance to kick Loraz in the nuts.
Dear Mr. moderator, since I will not be home for several days, you may edit or delete this post as you see fit, regards, JAS.

[BMWBeauty]

James..... I Don't Recall The Mention Of ANY Names,,,,'
Why So Defensive Here?

[BMWBeauty]

Ahem.... let's remember this is supposed to be a fun place and attacks will not be tolerated - by either party.....

One of your friendly neighborhood moderators.

Does This Include The MultipleThreads That Have Had Offensive Remarks About One Another? Or Is It Just Friends Of The Moderaters?
I Don't Recall Mentioning Names....

[Rich]

she sez "there is no looking back", but she never passes on a chance to kick Loraz in the nuts.


Yep, what he said. It's getting a little old.

[MarkF]

she never passes on a chance to kick Loraz in the nuts.

That pretty much sums it up. If it ain't about club business take it outside.

[BradfordBenn]

It has been taken care of, I hope.... :brow

[BubbaZanetti]

It has been taken care of, I hope.... :brow


i hope too..................... :brow

[jerryb]

Well, when you're drinking, good judgment is the first thing to go, so a lot of folks simply don't realize how impaired they are. Even without drinking, there's a proven inverse relationship between competence and confidence; the more incompetent people are, the higher they tend to rate their abilities.
Whereas highly competent people tend to always question themselves (and therefore continue to learn). I swear when I read that study I thought it explained nearly everything!
But when you think about it, that kind of attitude actually makes sense. If you imagine that most skilled rider ever has a skill level at (or approaching) 100%, and someone who'd never sat on a bike had a skill level of 0%, a new rider is going from 0% to, oh, let's say 40% fairly quickly.
Whereas from that point onward, he might gain a few points every year. Also, he's unaware of just what the 100% point might look like. The initial big jump is pretty heady, and he's not going to realize he's not all that until he encounters a tough situation or two. DZ


Great Stuff dug out of the archives.

jerryb

[jgr451]

A friend of mine who was not shy about drinking and thinking he was being creative about it by choosing when to peak,has sobered up since he bought a business with a bar.Now,he shakes his head at how stupid drunks are(he having been one of them).I agree....Though I drink,I do not drink and ride.Period.
When I drink I am prepared to be the fool that I am. :buds

[GregFeeler]

A friend of mine who was not shy about drinking and thinking he was being creative about it by choosing when to peak,has sobered up since he bought a business with a bar.Now,he shakes his head at how stupid drunks are(he having been one of them).I agree....Though I drink,I do not drink and ride.Period.
When I drink I am prepared to be the fool that I am. :buds

Each culture has it's norms, and one of the things I make a point of telling my non-riding friends is how it's just not done in the BMW community to drink and ride. Ride - then drink. Given the overpowering media portrayal of the drink-and-ride "biker" image they are often amazed, if not somewhat incredulous.

[Belg]

I have a pretty unique perspective on drinking and riding. I survived my own stupidity.

I used to drink anywhere from 3-5 long islands (the full 5 liquor variety) then proceed to get on my kawasaki, go dragging footpegs, pull over, get stoned on the finest kind buds, drag some more footpegs, pick up a 12'er or a half gallon of rum at the store, stuff it in my jacket, drag some more footpegs home, smoke more, drink more, and ride back to the store when I ran out...

This was my life for 6-8 months. I know it was at least 6 months, but it's pretty effing fuzzy. Not just weekend binges, this was -every- day. I would -average- 68 mph on Hwy 9 from Santa Cruz to Felton.... passing cars on blind corners, at high revs, low gears, and impossible lean angles. And I was not alone, my best friend and co-conspirator matched me drink for drink and toke for toke, turn for turn, and race for race, be it up to Boulder Creek, across Bear Creek, into Big Basin, up Empire Grade, or running at 130mph down PCH...

I've since realised just exactly how lucky I was. I didn't care back then whether I lived or died.... nor did I realise or care how close I came many times. But I never, ever, ever once dropped the bike except when I was stone cold sober, and under the speed limit.

I can't in good conscience call someone stupid for having a beer and getting on the back. But I can point out my own stupidity and show others what the excess may look like.... and thank God every day that I lived to grow out of it.

Mark

PS - Yes, I was goign through and incredibly deep greif at the time. Through my own action and inaction, I had cost myself the woman whom I was certain I would have married. And she proceeded to stick the knife in deeply about it. No apology was ever good enough, and nothing I could do could win her back.

So I gave up on myself.

[PacWestGS]

I have a pretty unique perspective on drinking and riding. I survived my own stupidity.

So I gave up on myself.

Hey Mark, you just described nearly ever man I know. What a bunch of losers we are. :nyah

Hey if you're at the Rally first beers on me. (After the Ride) :thumb





And we said our parents were stupid and couldn't understand us? :dance

BTDT

[Belg]

Have to take ya up on that one :=)

[jerryb]

I have a pretty unique perspective on drinking and riding. I survived my own stupidity and thank God every day that I lived to grow out of it.

Mark


Mark, Thanks for sharing that with us.

Jerryb

[Belg]

No problem, I just hope someone doesn't do it becuase I did :=)

[j-budimlya]

Has, like me, probably survived a close call while under the influence....

If you are reasonable bright, and maybe if not, all it takes is one close call..

And you learn...how risky it is to drink and ride a MC.....

some may take longer to learn, and sadly some learn too late...

I drink, and I ride MC's....

But I never do both......at the same time.....

Life is too good and too short as it is...... :thumb

[john1691]

At the Advanced Rider Course I recently attended, they asked about what signs would indicate that a fellow rider is impaired. After many good comments, I put in my two cents and said "they're riding a Harley?" I got a few laughs from the Honda Goldwing club that was there, and some howls from the Harley guys. The instructor who (was on a Harley) commented that it is sad, but true, the bikes typically seen outside bars are Harley's or look a likes.

I tend to stick with my flight training, "8 hours from bottle to throttle". Which means, unless I'm staying overnight, not one drink. May seem a little anal, but I guess maybe I'm already dumb enough, I don't need additional impairment.


john1691
'00 K1200RS

[knary]

At the Advanced Rider Course I recently attended, they asked about what signs would indicate that a fellow rider is impaired. After many good comments, I put in my two cents and said "they're riding a Harley?" I got a few laughs from the Honda Goldwing club that was there, and some howls from the Harley guys. The instructor who (was on a Harley) commented that it is sad, but true, the bikes typically seen outside bars are Harley's or look a likes.

I tend to stick with my flight training, "8 hours from bottle to throttle". Which means, unless I'm staying overnight, not one drink. May seem a little anal, but I guess maybe I'm already dumb enough, I don't need additional impairment.


john1691
'00 K1200RS

A rider once lost his license to one too many DUI's.
He showed up at the MSF class to regain his license.
Muddling through some very bad habits, he passed the class.
Not a day later there his bike again was seen in front of the bar.

[jerryb]

If you want a real dramatic example of how much drinking affects your riding skills, drink just two beers and try to guide a dirt bike through trees on a tight trail. It's not that you'll crash or otherwise not get through, it's the extra concentration and effort you expend to the point where what was fun sober is no fun at all with two beers in you.

jerryb

[Motorman]

Drinking and then driving a motorcycle is an automatic application for a Darwin award. Hopefully you won't spread the award to someone who has not done something stupid to earn it.

[ASPHALT]

Last year I stopped off to see my friend as he and his wife were coming back from the Love Ride (SoCal big Harley fund-raiser). A LOT of riders at that event swill beer all day, then get on their bikes and ride over to Chueys (restaurant) and drink more. So, I'm waiting at his house and here he comes, with his wife on the back. A soon as he said two words I knew he was tipsy. I laid into him and reminded them both that I am the godfather to their daughter...but I am not really ready to raise her just yet. I got some blank stares on THAT one. Then they apologized and tried to make excuses...none of which I bought. :nono

[dancogan]

A soon as he said two words I knew he was tipsy. I laid into him and reminded them both that I am the godfather to their daughter...but I am not really ready to raise her just yet. I got some blank stares on THAT one. Then they apologized and tried to make excuses...none of which I bought. :nono
Friends don't let friends ride drunk (or tipsy). Good for you! Hopefully, they'll thank you some day.

[GregFeeler]

Friends don't let friends ride drunk (or tipsy). Good for you! Hopefully, they'll thank you some day.


I have a real appreciation for having a good party - under the right circumstances. I guess I believe the art lies in being responsibly irresponsible. :dance

[The_Veg]

I like my fellow 59 Club guys, but most of their rides are bar-hops so I've been hanging out less with them. Nobody has yet shown obvious intoxication (which means nothing of course), but I'd rather spend a nice day tearing up the countryside than the streets of D&FW anyway.

[John Brase]

Yesterday's local paper contained a story of a rider who broadsided a pickup truck after blowing a stop sign. He's in the hospital in not good condition. His blood alcohol count was an amazing .237%!

I doubt I could even walk at .237%.

John

[Belg]

Trust me. You can walk at .237 :=)

[bubbagazoo]

My rule is really simple -- motorcycle = no beer until I get home. Beer = taxi or walk (depending upon distance).

Sunday afternoon, the missus and I went to her parents' place for coffee (ended up being supper as well). This little trip took 158 km to go 15 blocks. I digress. Her dad just didn't grasp the concept that I don't drink and ride motorcycle. As it was, I played delivery boy and went and got the KFC. Now my top case smells like chicken.

Once we got home, the missus and I had a beer. But not before.

One of the guys I work with tells me he has a 2 beer limit. So far as I am concerned, that's two to many.

[DSBMW1]

I have a BWW 2 blocks away from my apartment. It is so easy to stop by and have a beer on the way back from a ride. My roomate and I have walked the bikes home many a time. It is nice to live within pushing distance.