Serious Oil Question. Really!

[calnalu]

This is not a question or comment about conventional vs. synthetic oil.

My question is: Can you mix the two? :dunno

I've got 20/50 BMW oil (yeah, yeah, more expensive, doesn't last as long, etc. I know) in my ride now and it needs topping off. I've got a quart of 20/50 Mobil 1 in my garage. Can I use synth to top off an engine full of conventional oil? Or should I get my lazy butt over to the BMW dealership and buy a quart of conventional?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Marty

[manicmechanic]

They mix quite well.

[StevieWonder]

ABSOLUTELY, you can mix them.

In fact, several companies including Castrol, Valvoline and Quaker State (just to name a few) market a blend of conventional and synthetic oils.

If you can't justify the cost of synthetics, the blends provide a substantial improvement over plain conventional oils, particularly in extreme service conditions (notably heat).

[johngrump]

Hello Marty. Most of my knowledge of motor oil I attribute to Matt Joseph, an auto expert that is a walking encyclopedia on anything related to autos and what makes them run. Motorcycle Consumer's News ran a series of good articles on what makes the best motorcyle engine oil a couple years ago. Synthetics are superior lubricants due to their lubricity and heat tolerant capabilities. Since synthetics and standard oils have different additive packages, it is not a good idea to mix them. That is not a difinitive statement since most packages are proprietary but it can be Russian Roulette and why take the chance. ;)

The other thing to note is that current auto engine oils SJ have very low levels of Sodium due to EPA requirements for pollution control. Due to the higher revs of a motorcycle engine and heat transfer it is not advisable to use anything but motorcycle oil. There was an excellent session at the International Rally in Spokane on the differences in the two types. I run a full synthetic motorcycle oil in my RT. The old saying goes; pay me now or pay me later. I run a 10W30. When the difference in the numbers are greater than 25 (30 minus 10) the greater the need for additional additives to increase the range of viscosities. These additives break down in time and create some chemistries that are potentially harmful to your engine during extended oil change intervals. I never skimp on the oil in any of my engines-it is their life's blood!! Good luck

[StevieWonder]

One thing about opinions ... there's never a shortage of them.

My family has been in the oil business for over 80 years. Concerns with compatibility of varying additive packages went out decades ago. ALL similarly SAE rated lubricants are compatible with each other. I'm not sure why anybody would mix brands except in a crisis of availability, but it won't hurt anything if it meets the SAE rating requirements, old wives' tales and ancient stories aside.

Those who sell "motorcyle" oil would have you believe that it is necessary to have their secret set of additives, but the reality is that any quality synthetic oil is WAY more than sufficient to provide your bike with great lubrication.

Porsche engines used Mobil 1 as their factory installed synthetic in the final days of the aircooled Porsche 911s. They produced dramatically more heat with less airflow cooling than any BMW oilhead. The oil was promoted by Porsche as a 15K mile interval lubricant. BMW put Castrol synthetics in the $150K Z8 with a 15K mile change interval. The list goes on and on. These oils are more than adequate to meet any service demand on any bike ... period.

Bottom line:

1. Use a properly rated SAE engine oil of the recommended viscosity.
2. Change the filter at every oil change and use a quality filter (some have internal pressure bypass relief).
3. Change the oil more frequently in high-stress environments (lots of heat such as extreme ambient heat). Carefully consider using a synthetic oil if you frequently drive in these high-stress environments.

[dano]

:thumb to the above post. :clap

[riderR1150GSAdv]

Hear hear. Finally some sense. The same oil debate rages on in the outboard motor industry with all kinds of urban legends sprouting up like mushrooms. All of them are BS. In another post I mentioned a wrench telling me Mobil1 wasn't formulated for saltwater use,HAHAHAHAHA total BS of course. :doh
As long as the oils meet or exceed the engine manufactures specs you can use it.

[Bfish]

as long as the bike is ready for syn i've been told it's not a problem to mix. if still "wearing-in" it might not be as good an idea. i know that could stir debate but so what!!!!!!!!!! :dunno

[riderR1150GSAdv]

as long as the bike is ready for syn i've been told it's not a problem to mix. if still "wearing-in" it might not be as good an idea. i know that could stir debate but so what!!!!!!!!!! :dunno

Hi Brian :wave
You just stirred the mother of all hornet nests! :bolt :hide

[Bfish]

hey big "o". sittin here cranking out tax returns. figured i needed to make someone else use their brain and dispute the weekly oil issue! going to bike week? :wave

[riderR1150GSAdv]

hey big "o". sittin here cranking out tax returns. figured i needed to make someone else use their brain and dispute the weekly oil issue! going to bike week? :wave

No, can't make it, gotta catch fishies and get taxes done and pay bills and ride a little and..and........oh well you know, I gotta work. :wave

[Bfish]

...ditto...getting back to oil...almost at 6k and the consumption is starting to drop noticeably, whic hmakes me happy! :D :D

[dano]

Prior to me purchasing my 2003 RT, I asked the salesperson specifically about BMW's and their history of using oil. He told me that it isn't uncommon for BMW's to use 1 qt. of oil per 1000 miles.

He went on to tell me that oil use would drop off as the engine wore-in. I thought 1 qt. per 1000 miles was quite excessive, but there wasn't much I could do about it.

I'm happy to say, that my RT didn't use enough oil between oil/filter changes to be concerned. I don't know if using synthetic oil played a part in that result or not. I used the MOBIL 1 15w/50 in the engine from about 3500 miles on.

[Bfish]

from what i've learned 1 quart per 1000 mi is pretty good during wear-in.

[SuperMoto7]

I've been using MOBIL 1 15w/50 "red cap" in my track bikes for a few years now. I just checked the valves on my 450 and all internals looked great. On a GP course that little 450 is at 10,000 RPM's all day long in the Florida heat. I will be using Mobil 1 in my GS on the next change. ;)

[Grey Matter]

My 04 GS Adventure has just over 15,000 miles on it. I just switched to BMW Synthetic oil this week.

[StevieWonder]

Hey ... you can also put on solid gold valve stem caps to keep the theme going. And don't forget the platinum electrical wire. :dance

You're paying about $4/quart extra for the privilege of being able to throw away a container of Castrol synthetic with the BMW roundel on it. :bolt

[dano]

If BMW thought they could put a BMW roundel on air and charge for it.....they'd do it in a flash........... :laugh

[StevieWonder]

Hmmm ... I see a HUGE future for you in the BMW Motorrad marketing department.

"Official" BMW motorcycle air for your tires ... much better than the run of the mill air available from your Sears air compressor or local service station.

Ka-ching ... (pathetic attempt at cash register sound) :twirl

[Grey Matter]

Hey ... you can also put on solid gold valve stem caps to keep the theme going. And don't forget the platinum electrical wire. :dance

You're paying about $4/quart extra for the privilege of being able to throw away a container of Castrol synthetic with the BMW roundel on it. :bolt
Bla, bla, bla…:rolleyes

I was at the dealer so it was convenient for me to just buy it there. $16.00 over-spent on oil Hmmm, for a $16,000.00 motorcycle… Hey I also over-paid $6.00 on a BMW oil filter too while I was at it.

My point was that I just switched from dinosaurs oil to synthetic oil. If you think I over paid for BMW stuff then woopty-freaking-do

[StevieWonder]

Hey, if you've got money to just throw around, send some of it this way. :brow

[Grey Matter]

Next time you are in the Seattle area let me know, the drinks are on me.:buds

[dano]

I won't mention what I'm using in lieu of the OEM BMW oil filter....... :D

I don't want to offend anyone. :wave

[StevieWonder]

You haven't ... at all. :thumb

Luv to take you up on that offer. Going to NorCal this summer but don't think I'll make it all the way up to Seattle. Man, that would be one AWESOME trip. The scenery from SanFran to Seattle must be simply incredible.

If you get to God's country, I'll reciprocate ... throw in some Mexican food that'll help propel you back north when you're done !!! :fart

[bearsfolks]

The largest user of motor oil in the world is the U.S. military. Their specifications ensure that all brands are compatible ( you can imagine the problems if they are not). Mix and match all you want. If the viscosity and the SP ratings are the same, so is the oil.

[Mr. Frank]

Hey ... you can also put on solid gold valve stem caps to keep the theme going. And don't forget the platinum electrical wire. :dance

You're paying about $4/quart extra for the privilege of being able to throw away a container of Castrol synthetic with the BMW roundel on it. :bolt

Last time I checked the BMW oil was made by Spectro. You will be hard pressed to find any SG, SH rated oil that meets BMW warranty requirements that does not cost close to four bucks a quart, including Castrol MC oil.

[peterb]

first post: why not chime in on oil...


i used to buy and use BMW synth - good stuff; dealer closed; went looking for Golden Spectro, the reported manufacturer of our beloved BMW synth oil; whoa - more expensive than the BMW equivalent at my dealer...

So, now for less than $100 i now have a case of Amsoil and 3 filters to go with the flow.

i'm with one of the others above - i don't want to throw away the bucks, but it is an expensive machine. $30 'n change for an oil and filter change - doesn't seem too bad.

what does yours cost? :brow

[dano]

MOBIL 1 15w/50 is $3.39 qt. at Wal-Mart and Target stores. :thumb

It's as good, if not better, than any oil available.

[StevieWonder]

That's a GOOD price. Mobil 1 is just a smidge under $4 a quart at Sam's Club around this area.

[Mr. Frank]

Word is that Mobil I 15w50 red cap is being phased out in favor of an extended interval version that will cost more. If you like the red cap, stock up.

[StevieWonder]

That's a true statement ... red cap is soon to be history. Gold cap is the "new and improved" replacement.

[dano]

Word is that Mobil I 15w50 red cap is being phased out in favor of an extended interval version that will cost more. If you like the red cap, stock up.


Good to know! :thumb

I'll be going out soon and buying as much as I can safely afford........ :D