Need Ergonomic Help (R1150R)

[bobclift]

Thanks for the opportunity to register on your site! I'm a new user and a new R1150R owner (been riding a Honda Valkyrie and wanted to switch to a lighter, more nimble ride). I'm 6'3" and weigh in at 250lbs. I bought the bike new and I know I need changes to the riding position (but I love the quality look and feel of the bike!).

I've ordered the Wunderlich Vario risers to get the bars up and back some (taking pressure off palms, lower arms and shoulders). My knees are bent to a greater degree than I'd like and my seat (stock) puts a lot of pressure right in the center of my butt (tail bone). I'm considering lowering the footpegs and replacing the seat. I've seen several aftermarket products for both and need/want your help in knowing what's worked for you. Is there a seat with a better distribution of pressure across the rear end? With my height and the risers, if I get a tall seat, will I find myself bent forward again? I'd like to be more straight backed. If I go with a lower seat to get my back more straight (a more vertical angle), my knees will be more bent. What have you found are good lowering kits for the footpegs that don't take away too much clearance? Do these impact shift lever and brake lever length.

I'll consider anyone's opinion helpful, especially those of you who may be about my size and have made comfortable adjustments. I don't want to turn my bike into a cruiser, I just want to tour unbent! Thanks to all... Bob

[bigfoot105]

As far as the seat is concerned, You may want to try an Air Hawk seat cushion. When properly used, the function of this cushion will take all the pressure points off of your A$$ and will add around 1/4 inch to your overall height. They are not cheap though around $165. USD I think they are worth it and still a lot cheaper than a custom seat. :thumb

[Cliffy777]

hey bob - i just wanted to welcome you to the forum. i am a 6'3" 230 lb rider of an 1150 rockster, but i find the riding position very comfortable and have made no mods.
hope you get lots from this forum. you know we all want to see pics of you and the bike, right?

[bobclift]

Great advice, guys! I'm espeially glad to hear opinions about Russell and to hear of the Suburban Machinery peg kit. John, the vario risers are said to bring the bars up 29mm and back either 16 or 32mm (adjustable). I've seen another thread on seats and I realize this isn't an easy question. A seat that spreads the pressure over a wider area and doesn't slide me forward toward the tank as much would be great. Cliffy, I'll post a picture or two after some (hopefully successful) mods. All you'd see now is a stock bike and a big grin! I'll keep watching for more perspectives. Thanks - Bob

[HMushman]

Just a quick note about the stock seat, Bob. Mine used to be really uncomfortable to me too when I first got my bike ('03 1150R) and I was counting down the days until I could afford a new Sergeant seat, but somewhere over the next 15,000 miles, mine finally got somewhat "broke in" and now it's less of a priority for me. If the height isn't correct for you though, that's a different story... at 5'8" and 205 lbs, I can't really relate.

Good luck, welcome to the forum, and great choice of a bike, man!

[BobFV1]

Hi Bob -

I'm 5' 11" and weigh about 200 pounds. I found the "stock" setup of my 03 R1150R to be totally ridiculous. It pitched me forward just enough so that my fingers became numb after riding about 30 minutes. I installed the GenMar X102 riser kit which adds an inch in height and brings the bars back 1 3/8 inches. (www.zianet.com/GenMar/) That really helped the riding position quite a bit.

Picked up a Sargent touring saddle (front and rear - but in retrospect would have gotten the front only) or would have stayed with the stock seat with an Alaska Leather (www.alaskaleather.com) sheepskin "buttpad". The sheepskin is really a great addition and doesn't add as much height as the Sargent seat, which does "cancel out" some of the ergo gains from the handlebar risers.

Since I am not as tall, the footpeg position doesn't bother me as much.

You know, yesterday I took long test rides on the K1200GT and the R1150RT. The GT is a beauty but has the same ergo issues as the Beakster. The RT was an extremely comfortable, upright bike and I think I am going to trade in my beloved Beakie for one in the next month or so.

Good luck on your ergo fixes!

[bobclift]

Thanks H_Mushman and Bob FV1. I don't think I can wait 15K for the seat to break in. I'll have to do something. I like the GenMar riser but I've already ordered the Vario riser from Wunderlich. I guess I'll start there and, after mounting, decide on the seat (high, low, original). In 3rd priority (and only if necessary) I'll move the foot pegs. Terry at Suburban has been helpful already. I rode some today, both on my new Roadster and on my Valkyrie. Of course, there's no comparison in handling but it would sure be nice to make the BMW and comfortable as the Valkyrie is... Bob

[tiginbna]

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Hey Bob, I suffered some of the same things you speak of. I am 6'2" and about 230 so our sizes are comparable. I am currently on an 1100GS. My first BMW as well. I did some of the standard shifts of equipment (bars forward, seat up, rotate grips etc.) and was startng to get worried that I would find it too uncomfortable for long trips. I then took a bit of advice from someone who wrote in on a earlier post by me. I asked about seats and what would be best. The poster said to give it a bit of time and just ride with the stock setup. (I did however purchase the Alaska Leather Butpad, it solved the sliding forward problem.) And lo and behold a 6 hour day around the Cumberland foothills in central PA was no problem and I am looking forward to longer and more timely sojourns. Hope this helps
Tig

[hwunger]

... this is what I had to do to get comfy on mine:

1) Light, nimble, and quick - oh, it already has those !!!

2) SEAT - I will sell you my used Corbin (worked for me!)

3) Peg lowers from Suburban Machinery (now your knees feel better)

4) Handlebar risers from MV (Multivario ?) worked the best as they bring the bars UP 1" and BACK 1"

These bikes are a blast compared to the Valkie, eh ?

[bobclift]

Thanks for the tips, Hwunger, I've found and purchased a slightly used Corbin Canyon Runner seat (on the R1150R.net site). I've been for a ride (only about 60 miles so far) but I like it much beeter than stock, Two thoughts so far: 1) It's heavy, 2) It's hard (but still wide enough to spread pressure out away from tail bone). Since you're offering up your Corbin seat, I'd like to know if your Suburban peg lower kit or your risers are up for sale? Also, I can't find a link to that brand of riser? Thanks again. Bob

[BobFV1]

Hey Bob -I traded in my Roadster yesterday, but before I did I took off the Gen-Mar rissers and they are available. I will put them on Ebay later in the week but if you are interested drop me a line and maybe we can do a deal. Bob

[hwunger]

Sorry but the risers and peg lowers went with the bike ! ... glad you found a used Corbin ... they are a bit hard, but the 'bucket' shape worked great.

[JCBR1150R]

Bobclift,

My name is Clay B. from Va BCH,Va. I have 14 years street riding experience in all weather on several makes and styles of motorcycle.

I owned a ZX-9R for 4 years. The bike, while livable, was never actually comfortable when compared to my VFR 750. Neither bike was as comfy as the KZ I had a long time ago, even though they both were 40 times quicker and a helluva lot more responsive to my inputs.

Fast forward several years...After having a mid-80's UJM for about a year, I was put in the hurt locker on a R1150RS test ride--the bike I tested before the Roadster. The riding position of the RS was comparable to the ZX (at least for me) and my hands were numb in a matter of minutes. The Sales Manager explained that after riding a bike with more spread out ergo's, it would take some time to get aclimated to the new machine. I think this could apply to you as well. I took a sit down on a '02 ('03?) Valkyrie (the last year of production which ever year) and it is a BIG machine...and I am 6'1" 200lbs. While the Roadster can't match the Valk for comfort, it's a far cry from a full sportbike.

Thanks for allowing me to explain my experience, hope it helps.

[Jim Shaw]

[QUOTE=bobclift]
> Do these impact shift lever and brake lever length.
Suburban Machinery has an optional shift lever for the R1150R. Try the peg lowering kit first, and you can order the lever option later, if necessary.

John Ryan (Jim Shaw, typist)

[bobclift]

Thanks John Ryan (Jim Shaw too!) and JCB: I think I'm on my way - I've replaced my stock seat with a Corbin (see prior post) and BobFV1 has sold me a set of GenMar risers (I'm anxiously waiting). Next step will be the peg lowering kit. I understand the Wunderlich unit comes with everything (inc shift lever) and, with the Suburban, you buy the shift lever if needed (they said with my size 13s, I'd probably need). I've got another quandry now. I have the BMW touring windshield. It measures 21 inches up from the headlight. I don't get the amount of wind protection I want. I've been advised to check Cee Bailey but their tall euro is 21.5 which wouldn't seem to be a big difference. Parabellum has a 23 inch Super Tour which might do it. Of course, I've seen the large Aeroflow model. I don't want to go as big as the Aeroflow but do want more protection. For those of you with experience, could a difference in angle from vertical be a player? The Cee Bailey mounts on the BMW shield frame so I don't know if there would be an angle difference but the Parabellum comes with hardware? I've seen posts that say we R1150R riders get a good bit of wind over the tank and under the windshield. Aeroflow has something called tank wings to address this. Any comments on the difference in peg lowering kits (besides the obvious price difference) and how the Cee Bailey stacks up against the Parabellum? Any experience with the tank wings out there? Thanks again (and thanks for the risers BobFV1). Bobclift

[username]

[snip]might do it. Of course, I've seen the large Aeroflow model. I don't want to go as big as the Aeroflow but do want more protection. For those of you with experience, could a difference in angle from vertical be a player? The Cee Bailey mounts on the BMW shield frame so I don't know if there would be an angle difference but the Parabellum comes with hardware? I've seen posts that say we R1150R riders get a good bit of wind over the tank and under the windshield. Aeroflow has something called tank wings to address this. Any comments on the difference in peg lowering kits (besides the obvious price difference) and how the Cee Bailey stacks up against the Parabellum? Any experience with the tank wings out there? Thanks again (and thanks for the risers BobFV1). Bobclift

bob, i'm not trying to give you a hard time, but are you trying to turn your r into an rt? that's how it is starting to look from here.

[Pete43011]

Bob-
I have an '04 R1150R with the BMW sport shield and about 11K miles now. From the beginning I was not happy with the seat- the "tall" model.
Seemed like it kind of settled after about 30 minutes of riding plus wasn't quite tall enough. We have a local auto upholstery guy that I talked with. He pulled the skin (cover) off to discover BMW's padding strategy. Pretty interesting!
He sent me to a "foam shop" to acquire some scraps of various stuff. About $8.00 worth. Carved out a big chunk of BMW foam and inserted new pieces. Better!
Then we added some more/different durometer scraps- still better, but not quite there.
Lately I've been riding on another piece of "scrap" foam working on the elevation issue. It seems to solve the remaining problem and will shortly be added to the pile- and under the skin.
Amazingly- the seat pan and skin will accomodate numerous R&R's and still look good, and the best part is I'm still under a hundred dollars in this process.
(I was real reluctatnt to tell some guy miles away what my issues were and then for two to five hundred dollars rely on that verbal exchange to get my butt up and comfy).
Just a thought for your consideration.

[bobclift]

Thanks for the foam thoughts, Pete. We have a seat guy that does foam here as well. So far (couple of hundred mikes) I'm much happier with the harder yet wider Corbin and may not mess with the seat further for right now (at least until I get other ergo stuff figured out).

Thanks for your thoughts too, Username. (1) I'd love to have an RT but if I did have one, I'm sure I'd want it to "fit" me just right as well. Not all people are built on a "standard" frame (I'm certainly not one). I've seen plenty of posts from RT owners looking at a variety of windshields and seating options. Actually, (2) I bought the R because I rather like the naked bike look and, while I want some more wind protection, I don't want to interfere with the R's appearance by adding bulkier items (don't mistake this for a judgement on those who do). For me - I like the "honest" style of the R (sort of like "honest" architecture - - nothing hidden) all mechanics except those that need to be encased in a fluid are visible. That's why I also ride a Valkyrie as opposed to the equally excellent Gold Wing.

I'd especially enjoy hearing from anyone on my Cee Bailey vs. Parabellum windshield question or anyone who has tie breaker opinions on the Wunderlich vs. Suburban peg lowering kits. Thanks for all the great help I've found in this forum! Bobclift

[bobclift]

I guess we'll see about the Parabellum. They are (or were - look and see) running a market test on ebay. Although they listed a medium height super tour for the R1150R, they agreed (by e-mail) to supply me with a tall windsheild if I won the auction. The starting price was $169 (with $12 shipping) which includes hardware. I was the only bidder at the starting price. When I won I contacted them and told them I wanted the light gray tint and that I'd pay them the (advertised) $10 charge seaparate from the auction. They told me my tall tinted would be shiiping Monday (with no comment about an extra charge). I'd say that's great service! Contrast this to my requests for information from Cee Bailey. First I receieved incomplete information in a phone call (they didn't know - or to be fair - the guy I talked to didn't know - how much taller their +2 was over a BMW touring windshield (in short, how many inches up from the headlight). I was concerned so I wrote them an e-mail with detailed questions 2 weeks ago and, as of now, no answer. I hope the Parabellum is an equal or superior product. I'd hate to get held up (ransom - poor service) as the cost af buying a better product. For now - Parabellum has my money. I'll let you know what my experience is with installation and wind protection. Bob

[pmdave]

Motorcycle/rider ergonomics really are tricky. Change one item, and it changes the relationship. For instance, forward bars that require a little stretch are hard on the wrists for cruising around town, but at road speed the wind supports your chest--unless you install a taller shield that cuts down the wind.

With handlebars, it's important that the angle of the grips is appropriate for your arm length and riding position. When seated at "road speed" position, your elbows should be slightly bent, so you steer with your arms, not your shoulder muscles. One good experiment is to cut a couple of lengths of tubing--say a broom handle--and hold them in your hands like grips while seated in riding position. That will help you imagine the ideal grip position, pullback angle, horizontal drop, etc. If you grasp your simulated bar end, you'll notice that the most comfortable angle isn't perpendicular to your arm bone, but at a slight angle. Likewise, you'll probably find that having the grips point down slightly at the ends will allow your wrists to rotate to a more comfortable angle.

One important consideration for me--as an OG--is to have my torso angled high enough so my neck isn't strained. On my K1, I had to pull the bars up and back 4 inches, for example.

The concept of a comfortable saddle isn't softness, but shape. What causes pain is pressure points. Too much pressure on any part of your butt actually squeezes the blood out of the flesh, and it starts to die. Ideally, a motorcycle saddle should support your weight with equal pressure all across your butt, including the back of the legs that contact the saddle. That means there should be two dished out areas under the "butt bones", so the pressure is supported by more flesh.

There needs to be a lump in the "family jewels" area to prevent you from sliding forward, and there should also be a raised edge at the rear to keep you from sliding backwards.

OK, this business of ergonomics took Paul Kuhn about six articles in MCN several years ago, so figure on taking your time to get the bike tuned to your size, weight, and physique.

pmdave :thumb

[Mika]

I ride a 02 R1150R. I am just on the south side of 6’ 5” and pack more weight than you. Hated all the things you did in the first year. IMHO take a step by step approach to the changes.

The Suburban peg lowing set is the place to start. Dealing with the knees allows your legs to carry the weight they need to in the 3 point European riding position. I agree with the advice not to purchase the shift lever extension. Depending on your boot size you may well find as I did with the minor adjustment allowed on the shift side you will be very happy without spending the extra C note. The brake side has plenty of adjustment to work great.

The second thing I wanted to change was the seat. For a quick fix while I was deciding I picked up a pad from Aerostich. Looks like a black sheepskin. I am not in the market for the seat any more; it took care of that just fine, and for only about $60.00.

Bars were the last thing I considered changing. I have spent a lot of money on bars and risers in the past as my first modification and have found by experience that for me it is the last place I will spend money when tuning the ride position of a bike for my body type. I ride without a fairing or fly screen. Driving at city speeds can be a pain in the wrist after a half hour or so. At touring speeds I am fine with the stock bars. Without any screen your body becomes an air dam like a ski jumper and your chest ends up carrying some of the upper body weight. Raising the bars can be counter productive. By changing your position from an airfoil to a wall the pain you feel now will move to your shoulders. I am looking into bar options, a GS bar style for fire road work, and even a lower bar (like the 90S bar) for long cross country freeway rides. For the sport touring that the bike seems best at the stock bars can work fine with proper modifications elsewhere.

Good luck finding what works for you.

[bobclift]

Wow - great perspectives M1Ka and pmdave. Thanks a bunch for all the pointers. It's good to see how many of you have been there before me and are willing to share your good choices, and the ones you wouldn't make again. I especially agree with your saddle shape comments, pmdave. The indentations for my but bones allow presure to spread across the rest on the Corbin I've mounted for now. M1Ka, I agree with your step-by-step approach as well. It's almost like medicine. If you're sick and you take three prescriptions and feel better, how do you know which worked? I'm going to slow down where I am and tinker from here on with one item at a time. This has been a really instructive thread and I appreciate thoughts from all! Bob