Home Theater Suggestions

[paulsibek]

I am buying a HT and want suggestions. What do you recommend???

[BradfordBenn]

Okay so if money is no object...

Lexicon MC12 Decoder
Lexicon LX7 amplifier
JBL LSR 32 speakers
JBL LSR 28P subwoofer
Barco 6300 Projector
Faroujda (spelling might be wrong) line quadrupler
Stewart Screen
Sony ES Series DVD PLayer
Monster Cable Video cables
A room with no parallel walls or ceiling, no windows
High Definition Tivo DirecTV Receiver
Sony SuperAudio CD player
PLayStation2
XBox
Gamecube

I think that is most of it...

Of course just like motorcycles everyone has their preferences.

[Colt03]

Bradford gave the high end version.

For the slightly above average joe, I purchased a Yamaha xyz 1400 surround sound receiver. the letters arent really xyz might be like cvr or something. I bought it last december and have been happy with it. I am watching a 36" Mitsubishi TV. I will up grade to a plasma when the prices drop.

my .02 cents

[username]

my recommendations to you are sort of broad, but hopefully useful. instead of telling you what equipment you should get, i'm recommending a mindset and a process that will allow you to learn and make decisions that will fit your situation. (unless you are really wealthy, in which case hire an installer and give him brad's list of equipment. :D )

you gotta tell us a few things...

1. whats your budget.
2. how often will you use it for listening to music?
2.5 is it just for movies, or also TV?
3. what components do you already have?
4. whats the room like that you are putting it in? (dimensions, carpeting, etc.)
5. how long can you wait?
6. what do you already know?

#5 is the most important, because it will allow you to do the most with #1 and #4. it took me about 15 months to get my HT equipment together the way i wanted it. im a pretty patient fellow. (like siddhartha, i can wait, i can fast, and i can think.) i spent most of that time reading the boards at www.hometheaterforum.com and www.avsforum.com. you should do this.

as an example, my answers to #2 and 2.5 were very seldom - MP3s only, and primarily for movies, respectively. i am not an audiophile, i do not have golden ears, and i dont care what other people think about me. this allowed me to spend less time worrying about accurate soundstage reproduction from the speakers. (i have a small room, so it was sketchy that i would ever get there anyway.) i knew i wanted a fairly large screen relative to my room size. i knew i wanted an HTPC so i could send custom resolutions and timings to my display and get super high video quality without motion artifacts and color innaccuracies. when i started i was pretty sure i wanted to achieve a flat response in my room as well. when i calibrated the HT, i found that i've got bass spikes at ~41 and 53 Hz, which was what i expected to see based on my room dimensions. what i learned was that after watching a few movies, those peaks are not terribly noticeable, except on one or two movies, and even then, only *i* notice them, and others just shake their heads at me. which brings up an important lesson - the more you learn about home theater, the more you have spend to make yourself really happy. ignorance is bliss and cash free for other things. :D

1. go to the forums above. hometheaterforum is a better place to go as a novice - they have a beginner forum there, and lots of nice people to help you. avsforum has more of an 'advanced' feel to it, and it can be intimidating.

2. plan to spend a lot on your mains. (two front speakers.) dont worry so much about the surrounds if youre mostly watching movies. the surrounds are used primarily for things like door knocks and enveloping sounds like rainfall. you can use really cheap speakers back there, and they do not have to be voicematched to the front/center channels. (unless youre an audiophile that wants to listen to 5 channel music...)

3. be sure that your center channel is voice (timbre) matched to the mains. buying the same speakers intended for home theater use will help with this.

4. if you think your tv is the right size, get one a little bigger. trust me.

5. be patient, and wait to get what you want, you'll be happy if you do.

6. figure out what kind of display you want. this is a strong function of budget. front projection? regular tv set? rear projection? i highly recommend scrounging up the cash to get an HD ready set. the ability to display 540p/1080i, with proper video scaling and timing will give you a film-like experience. i can discuss this more offline. this can be acheived economically, cheaper than you might think. youll also want the option for a digital input into the TV. DVI is what it's called. there is also HDCP with is some sort of copy protection thing that i havent paid any attention to, because it doesnt apply to me.

7. don't get all hung up on a super whizbang receiver at first. if you take the time to know the room, and think about how much power you'll really need to acheive reference levels (and you'll only want them for calibration, after that, you'll likely watch movies at 10dB less than that) then you can save money. also, when buying one, look closely at the specs - they often define THD and power levels when driving each channel by itself. for HT you're likely to be driving 2-3 channels, and that'll make it work a little harder. spending at least $500 will help you avoid common pitfalls. just make sure you can manually set the subwoofer crossover frequency on the receiver. you do not want to rely on the adjustments at the sub itself.

8. only get HTIB (home theater in a box) if youre lazy or have extremely low expectations and quality standards for watching movies. (there is nothing wrong with this, but be honest with yourself.)

9. know that TVs in showrooms have the brightness and contrast turned up WAYYYYY too high. this is so they look good in brightly lit stores with tons of flourescent lighting. are movie theaters lit that way? no. so youre going to have to adjust the TV's settings. plan to get a calibration DVD (AVIA is the one i use) and you will reduce the red levels, brightness and contrast, as well as things like convergence. this is wayyyy easier than it sounds, and it'll make watching movies more pleasurable for you. (i recommend that all of you do this with your tvs btw.) if youre rich, you can pay a guy to do an ISF calibration, but you can do 80% of what he can do yourself. the big thing an ISF will get you (IMHO) is that they can set the temperature of your grey level perfectly, and then the resulting colors and dynamics range of your set will be great.

10. know that some TVs have crappy black levels. LCDs were notorious for this when i was shopping. basically, what this means is that stuff that should be deep black is dark grey. this will bug you if you know about it.

11. look really hard at the samsung DLP sets. they are very good if youve got the money. the internal electronics and the chip used to convert the video are very well regarded. theyve got the faroudja chip brad mentioned, great black levels, and they are really thin.

12. dont skimp on your sub woofer. (the .1 in 5.1) HT bass should be clean and non-boomy. (the opposite of car audio bass.) to get this you need a decent subwoofer, and you need to place it in your room in a corner, and in such a way that you dont get heinous nulls and peaks. this is not that inimidating, you'll figure it out in an hour.

13. speakers are a matter of CHOICE. most will sound good in demo rooms. you have to figure out what you like. TAKE YOUR TIME.

14. plan to calibrate. budget money for the AVIA disc and a sound meter. ($60 total.) this is the way that you can make a mid-level HT sound really really good. i have friends that have spent 10k on equipment, and they dont calibrate it. the result is that they whole thing sounds imbalanced and out of whack, and it is distracting. (i usually watch a movie at their place, then show up the next day with the disc and the meter and fix it for them, taking all of 15 minutes. no one has complained yet! :D )

when you start, it seems overwhelming, and the temptation is to go the HTIB route. all big problems are made up of small problems. tackle them as small problems. have a method, a process, and a goal in mind. youll get there. it'll be worth it.

also, most of this is all about perception. i recommend that you try to understand what you can and cant sense, and what you do and dont appreciate. this is important for displays and main speakers. i spent time listening to really expensive speakers. i could tell that they were different in some ways, but it wasnt pleasurable to me. the guy would say, "hear that horn, it sounds like it is right over here!" and i'd think, "yeah, but my room is smaller than this, and i dont like this kind of music. i dont need the soundstage." i had him put in some movies, and the differences between the speakers were less noticeable, and i knew i didnt need to spend a fortune on speakers to be happy. (this is like realizing that you like a VW jetta as much as an audi a4, and being smart enough to just get the jetta and keep >10k in your pocket.) a home theater is to enjoy, so if you dont get enjoyment from a purported benefit, dont spend the money. i found that i was really sensitive to displays, and worked to find one that didnt have the defects that i hated. (crap black levels, bad stretch modes for what little tv we watch, low dynamic range (linked to black levels.))

your budget will set good limits on all of this stuff. if your budget is low (like under $1,000 and you need a tv, speakers, and receiver) forget everything i said and dont learn anything. just buy HTIB and forget that other options exist. ;) or better, save up more money, and gradually add good stuff to your setup.

everything i say may be wrong.

[username]

a couple of resources to help you with planning and room layout, which you should do before you buy anything...

this link (http://www.myhometheater.homestead.com/viewingdistancecalculator.html) will help you calculate the right viewing distance for a particular display. i have found that this is very useful. i recommend adhering to it.

go to the dolby website (http://www.dolby.com/consumer/home_entertainment/roomlayout.html), and they talk about speaker placement. this is also a great primer on all the 5.1 stuff. you'll see a diagram like the one below. follow it, and your life will be easier. there are variations on the dolby guidelines, and depending on your room, you can do different things with the surrounds.

so now you can sketch your room to scale on graph paper and figure out what goes where. :D

[SweetT]

I like to think I have a pretty nice HT.
I've been a DJ for about 7 years and a classical musicial for about 15 and IMO I know how music and speakers are supposed to sound, and I am really impressed with the speakers by Klipsch and Paradigm. Although, more recently Klipsch has made some lower end speakers that are sold at places like Best Buy and I think these speakers suck. Buy your speakers from a place that deals in only hi-quality equipment. You'll pay more, but it will be worth it. A lot of these places will work out package deals with you if you're buying several things at once.

I've had recievers/decoders from sony, denon, and yamaha and the yammy is my fave. Their "Natural Sound" amplifer circuts really do sound good and they're not that expensive. As with the Klipsch speakers, Yamaha makes some lower end amps too. Save a little longer and buy the nicer models if you can.
Also I have to stress getting an amp with a DTS decoder. DTS really puts Dolby Digital to shame.

You may also want to consider a DVD player that will play DVD-Audio or SACD formats. I have an album of Frank Sinatra doing a concert at the Sands casino that is recoded in DVD-Audio and the sound resolution is amazing. It really sounds like you're in the club with him!

[username]

paul - tarren brings up an interesting point, and it is the 'dolby vs dts' one. again, this is preference, and if you look at the DVDs youre watching now, notice how many have a DTS audio track option, and which dont. ive noticed that the DTS tracks are louder than the dobly, but i've been unable to say that i obtain more pleasure from the occasional DTS track than a dolby one. just about every movie coming out now is recorded as dolby 5.1, so you definitely want a receiver that does that.

i think most good amps decode both anyway, but take a listen sometime and see if you care.

[Grey Matter]

username you’ve got game…

[Montana]

I second the Yamaha vote, that is what I bought nearly 20 years ago, I think it's an A500, it was one of the first truly digital-capable units and it just recently died, it was WONDERFUL. Actually, it isn't totally dead but a couple of things don't work anymore, so it's relegated to our music studio instead of being part of our main entertainment unit.

So now we've got an HTR-5750 which is AMAZING. It decodes everything, it's 6.1, the selection of inputs and outputs and assignablility and reassignability, with the front panel, back panel, remote, and the adjustments to sound field, menus to store your "special effects" settings tailored to your room and your setup, the display tells you everything you need to know as you navigate; Sheesh, it was somewhere in the neighborhood of $350.

The other thing we just bought is our first disk player, it's a LITE-ON All Write 5005 and it has input and output options that are great and handles EVERYTHING round. Oh, but not Super Audio CD. I read all the media options, all the format options, and all I can say is: COSTCO $199.

(I forgot to mention, I understand this disk player is EPROM upgradeable, you just burn a CD from the vendor's website, load it in the unit, and it installs updated drivers on its own, so Super Audio CD may yet happen.)

My last piece of advice: Put real money into the speakers.

[BradfordBenn]

my recommendations to you are sort of broad
---- lots of good info but snipped----

13. speakers are a matter of CHOICE. most will sound good in demo rooms. you have to figure out what you like. TAKE YOUR TIME.

14. plan to calibrate. budget money for the AVIA disc and a sound meter. ($60 total.) this is the way that you can make a mid-level HT sound really really good. i have friends that have spent 10k on equipment, and they dont calibrate it. the result is that they whole thing sounds imbalanced and out of whack, and it is distracting. (i usually watch a movie at their place, then show up the next day with the disc and the meter and fix it for them, taking all of 15 minutes. no one has complained yet! :D )

----more good stuff but snipped----
everything i say may be wrong.

username is pretty much right on, I gave a flippant answer and just named the top of the line stuff. However in the interest of full disclosure I happen to work for Crown International, an amplifier company and part of the Harman International company. We happen to manufacture the Lexicon amplifier ... no I can't get free samples. As a result of what I do for a living I do a lot of critical listening to lots of stuff. However the key is that I listen to material that I know. I have my calibration tools including the Avia that is really good. But the most important thing is my ears. I listen to stuff.

So when you go to the store to listen to speakers, don't let the sales guy tell you what you hear. Bring your own reference, the type of music you like to listen to or the type of movie you like to watch. Purchasing a DVD before you have a DVD player may sound silly, but as you look at stuff you can use a reference. Some stores like BestBuy don't like it, but most of the real stores will let you do stuff like that.

Just because something is labeled a "Collector's Edition" or "Limited Edition" or the like does not mean it is a good movie or DVD so pick something that you may have seen before. An example is "Total Recall - Ultimate Limited Super Expensive Edition" is one of the worst transfered movies I own. It is like watching cable not a DVD. So don't believe the hype believe your own eyes and ears

Also be careful about listening to video and watching audio. What I mean is that for me the best way to see any artifacts or blemishes when watching a movie is to turn off the sound. It is amazing how the little imperfections will pop up because you don't have the closure of the sound. When listening to speakers, why are you looking at them?

Also like username said watch out for gain tricks. Not only will the brightness and contrast be way up on the TV, usually when demoing speakers people play them way louder than they really will listen to them. So set the level at a level that you like.

Ultimately though it all comes down to what makes you happy. I gave my brother a Home Theater in a Box for his wedding present, and he loves it. Me, I built my system piece by piece and I love it. In the long run we both got what we want, a place to go that makes us smile. So don't use price as a measuring stick. More expensive is not always better. :thumb

[RTRandy]

Brad,

I can't believe you work for Crown. No Way!!! You're to young to remember, but back in the 70's they made this kick ass giant ( they were all giant back then) reel to reel tape deck. I want to say it was called the DC3? That's the plane. DC300? Never could afford one of those bad boys, but it sure sounded great.

Randy

[BradfordBenn]

Actually the DC300 was the first solid state amplifier. I know about the tape decks, cause believe it or not I had one. They were great machines and many of them are still running. Unfortunately mine has been sold for about 10 years cause I didn't realize what I had :doh

You can check out the timeline at http://www.crownaudio.com/crntime.htm

[RTRandy]

Funny how I remembered that model number from Crown even though I was thinking that was their tape deck model. Then again much of what I remember from that era is still kind of a blur :groovy :groovy

Loved the timeline.

That's a great thing to work for a company that strives to make quality products. Good for you :thumb

[Montana]

Those large tape decks were great for disco, right, Randy?

[RTRandy]

You're showing your age, Montana. We're talkin reel to reel here, not 8 track :brow