Ilmor 700cc 3-cylinder 5-Stoke

[Mika]

Yes a five stroke – Thekneeslider.com (http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2009/10/19/ilmor-5-stroke-engine-700cc-turbo-3-cylinder-130-bhp/): Ilmor 5 Stroke Engine – 700cc Turbo 3 Cylinder – 130 bhp, Better Mileage, Less Weight

The Ilmor web site at ilmor.co.uk (http://www.ilmor.co.uk/concept_5-stroke_1.php) has this introduction to a series of pages with facts figures and more information on this engine idea.

“Our objective with the 5-stroke engine is to develop a gasoline engine with fuel consumption and emission levels comparable to that of current diesel engines, without the serious problem of particulate and NOx emissions that plague diesels.

The engine concept, which was invented by Gerhard Schmitz, has been developed by Ilmor into a working engine using a rapid prototype cast cylinder head, a machined from solid cylinder block and separate electrically powered oil and water pumps. Two overhead camshafts operate the conventional coil spring valvegear with the HP camshaft running at 0.5 x crank speed and the LP camshaft running at 1 x crank speed. The engine is also turbocharged to increase the engine rating.”

The engine makes peak torque at 5,000 rpm and peak hp at 7. On first blush those seem reasonable revs for an application in a motorcycle. Maybe as our frined Miracle Max would say maybe our friend the ICE is not dead yet, just mostly dead and could be revived.

[BubbaZanetti]

i recall reading something about a fuel saving engine being developed by a guy in western mass, but for the life of me can't remember the name. it worked on a similar concept of increased efficiency by not "wasting" exhaust gasses.

[crazydrummerdude]

Sweet.

[ragtoplvr]

Similar engines have been developed over the years.

As an example, you can design a gas engine with a 18 to one compression ratio, and close the intake valve early or late, or simply regulate manifold vacuum, and achieve an 8 to one compression ratio and 15 to one expansion. Mazda had one of these called Atkinson on the Millenia, and it did work well, much simpler than the 5 stroke.

There is also turbo compounding, where the turbo drives the crankshaft. So far none of these has had any long term success, and I would expect the same with this approach. Those extra cylinders add a lot of expense and friction. If I were to vote for one approach it would be turbo compounding, also not quite there yet.

Rod

[Rpbump]

Turb-compounding worked quite well on R3350 aircraft radial engines but they had the displacement and operating enviorment to make it work. I'm not sure that a 1200>1300cc engine would benefit enough to make the concept viable. remember you are adding mechanical complexity along with heat to the engine. Ride Safe :usa :usa

[Gilly]

i recall reading something about a fuel saving engine being developed by a guy in western mass, but for the life of me can't remember the name. it worked on a similar concept of increased efficiency by not "wasting" exhaust gasses.

Stirling?

[35634]

Along the lines of turbo-compounding, VW has some super-turbo charged gas and diesel engines in development, I think for sale in Europe. The supercharger give low end boost, then disengages at higher speeds where the turbo takes over. Gets ~170 hp from 1.4 L (Not sure of the figures) and good mileage. Interesting to see if it makes it over here.

[PGlaves]

I never count something like this out until it's out. We are, after all, still driving cars and riding motorcycles using engines based on the Otto cycle first patented (not by Otto) in 1854 or some such similar year. While there have obviously been refinements in metallurgy and precision, fuel delivery, ignition strength, etc., the basic design of the 4 stroke is the same.

Chrysler and others tried automotive turbines. Wankel invented a rotary. Each of these achieved some success, but none displaced the Otto cycle 4 stroke as the predominant automotive powerplant.

Yet. Some day something will and I hope it isn't the horse.

[laguna]

Chrysler only made 50 or 100 of the jet turbine cars - I used to ride in one because when my family moved back to Texas in 1964 we had a friend down the block that had one.(Chrysler would not sell it to him- they would only lease it to him.) Anyway, it was not as powerful as the big block engines of the day, but it was so smooth and made a sound like a jet aircraft; not like a car at all. It turned out to be a turkey because when he hit the throttle(?) the jet took a couple of seconds to spool up and get going- which did not work even in the uncrowded streets of north Dallas of 1964 and 1965. The streets were so deserted that we used to tune our enduro go karts by driving down Forest and Marsh Lanes in the middle of the day!! Does anyone know where they are and sorry I got so off the topic .

[Mika]

Wikipedia has an article on the Chrysler Turbine Car. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrysler_Turbine_Car) The article suggests that many of the cars were destroyed, as was the normal policy for the auto industry, but some were decommissioned and sent to museums. Leno ( http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20090803/OPINION03/908030315/1383/OPINION0308/Jay+Leno+gets+rare+Chrysler++author+gets+plug+for+ book) apparently got his hands on one.

The References for the Wiki article includes a link to a pdf that is fascinating: History of Chrysler Corporation’s Gas Turbine Vehicles (http://www.turbinecar.com/misc/History.pdf) The document is 49 page history of Chrysler’s development of the gas turbine through seven generations of development. It was prepared by Technical Information Engineering Office of Chrysler in 1979.

I enjoy reading about things like the Ilmor engine and the Chrysler Turbine. I am not an engineer and am at best an average shade tree mechanic yet I find the variety of subjects you can dig into great reading and fun to discuss. Thanks for the hijack.