R1150RT Question

[drummer]

Did all R1150RTs come with the fully integrated breaking system? If not, how do I know which did not?

[Motor31]

the 2005 1200's do not have the whizzy brakes. All the 1150's do have them AFAIK.

[drummer]

Thanks for the input - I had been looking to purchase an R1150RT but I guess it is not such a wise idea. I haven't heard that many good things about the fully integrated ABS.

:scratch

[Jeffhorn]

It took a few days for me to get used to the whizzy breaks but now I love 'em. Saved my butt from a flarge flock of wild turkeys crossing the road. However, I dead the day when I'll have to have work done on them.

[Brownie]

I kinda felt the same way as I made friends with my "Inga" ('04 RT).....a couple years down the road, now.....no big deal...BUT keep both arms ready/rigid if you really need to stop.....the brakes ( F + R) are really gonna stop you!!!:thumb

[E_Page]

I've had no problems with the brakes on my '02 RT, but the maintenance is a bit pricey.

These breaks saved me from rear ending a car in heavy traffic last year. Everyone was moving along at about 30 mph. I glanced over my shoulder to check the lane next to me in preparation for a lane change, and when I looked back, the line of traffic directly ahead was rapidly coming to a full stop. I managed to stop less than 6' from the bumper ahead of me.

Asisde: Personal lessons: 1. Glance quicker, 2. Add mirrors to minimize need for over shoulder glances, 3. Keep one eye ahead at all times, 4. always own a bike with ABS for commuting in traffic.

Leave more room ahead? Not likely. The problem is that every time I do, somebody in a car or suv takes it as an invitation to pull in front and leave about half the space that I otherwise would. So, leaving the space is safer until somebody inevitably makes it much less so than my minimum (somewhat) safe distance.

[NavyDad]

My 04 RT has 40K on the clock and no braking problems so far. I love the way the brakes perform and I bleed the complete system every two years. Probably should do it yearly, but this has been working for me. Learn to do this little trick yourself and save some $$$. I don't look forward to the day that I may have problems, but I don't sit around and worry about it either. When she goes she goes, I will decide then what to do. One thing I have come to realize in 40 years of riding. When it comes to motorcycles, they make new ones every day.

[DrPaul]

My 04 RT has 40K on the clock and no braking problems so far. I love the way the brakes perform and I bleed the complete system every two years. Probably should do it yearly, but this has been working for me. Learn to do this little trick yourself and save some $$$. I don't look forward to the day that I may have problems, but I don't sit around and worry about it either. When she goes she goes, I will decide then what to do. One thing I have come to realize in 40 years of riding. When it comes to motorcycles, they make new ones every day.+1:thumb Whizzy brakes are good brakes. They have saved my a-- more than once. Like everything else on our bikes, they need regular service. You can do it yourself and save a bundle.

[drummer]

Maybe I am wrong, but doesn't the fully integrated breaking system mean that both breaks are applied at all times? If so, it has been my understanding that both breaks should not be applied in all circumstances. So, for those of you that ride these bikes, what is your take on both breaks all the time?

[ragtoplvr]

I also have and get along the "wizzy" brakes.

The system is automatic, meaning it applies both front and rear as requested by the force at the lever or petal until lockup is occurring. At this time electronics take over, and modulate forces. You probably will not know if this occurs, I never feel a pulse at the lever. If you go over a hole or dip and cause tires to lose contact it will feel like someone let off the brakes for a fraction of a second. The system just avoided a lock up for you, and may have just kept you from going down. Good shocks are a requirement for keeping tires on the road. There are cases in low speed maneuvering where people want to use only the rear brake. Unless you have a RS you will not be able to do that. However, if you just use the normal brakes with a light touch, like one finger only, you should be able to get the same results.

My observations only, there are lots of "wizzy" brake haters. I do agree that power assisted brakes on a bike are a solution for a problem that did not exist. They do work well for me and are not a significant problem once you get used to low speeds and low speed oversensitivity. They have made me zero speed drop the bike on occasion before i switched to one finger. And if I ride something else, I do have to be careful.

Rod

Rod

[JALAIMO146577]

By wizzy and integrated does that mean linked? If so which brakes work with lever and whcih with the pedal?

[Jeff488]

Whizzy = linked/integrated. Whizzy is just the noise the actuators/servos make.

The hand lever activates both front and rear, but proportionally(less to the rear).
The foot pedal also activates both, and that is what I do not like. It would be better if the foot pedal was only a rear brake. I understand that the foot pedal puts more braking force proportionally to the rear than does the hand lever, but I may be wrong.
Clearer?

[JHGilbert]

I've had the whizzy brakes for a bit over a month and about 1500 miles.
They're pretty dogone good. You squeeze the brake lever hard and the bike stops much better than any bike I've ever been on. Slow maneuvers are still easy with an easy touch on the footbrake or feathering the clutch. But be prepared, until you get used to them, slow maneuver tail braking may cause the bike to stop when you hadn't planned on it.

But yes...they are AWESOME brakes.

[drummer]

Thanks all for the input - sounds like I should revisit looking at the 04 RTs after reading what I have. Thanks again .... :thumb

[Red100RT]

Thanks all for the input - sounds like I should revisit looking at the 04 RTs after reading what I have. Thanks again .... :thumb

And the good thing is if you decide you just can't stand the things you can always get rid of them and end up with great non-abs brakes and loose about 17 pounds in the process.:wave

[drummer]

And the good thing is if you decide you just can't stand the things you can always get rid of them and end up with great non-abs brakes and loose about 17 pounds in the process.:wave

Seriously? I would bet the cost of so doing would be around $2000 with BMW pricing.

[OfficerImpersonator]

You can always get an RT-P, which doesn't have linked brakes...

[ALIENHITCHHIKER]

My understanding is that whizzy, linked, and ABS refer to three different technologies.

Whizzy = servo assisted (power) brakes. With oilheads, this appeared with the 1150 series. The servo motors make a whizzy noise when they activate.

Linked = a connection between the front and rear brake levers, so that applying the rear brake pedal also actuates at least one set of front brake pads, and often vice-versa. Honda and Moto Guzzi have offered this 'safety' feature for many years. It appeared on oilheads beginning with the 1150 series.

ABS = anti lock braking. Just like ABS in cars, if one wheel stops while the other is still moving, the brake on the stopped wheel releases in a pulsatile manner. On 1100 series BMWs (not sure about later models) the ABS system does make a weird whizzy noise when it initializes as the bike first takes off.

That's all I know.

[mneblett]

Whizzy = servo assisted (power) brakes. With oilheads, this appeared with the 1150 series. The servo motors make a whizzy noise when they activate.
Minor footnote: Not all the 1150's have the Integral servo-assisted (whizzy) brakes -- the wife's '01 1150GS has the no-assisted ABS II brakes.

[drsales]

I just picked up a 2004 about 3 weeks ago. Learning the brakes is just like going from standard car brakes to power brakes. (I think I just dated myself)

Just be careful to truely understand how well they do work. One or two fingers on the front brake is all you need. Go to the local high school after hours and practice the feel and how they work for and against you.

I've done 1000 miles since I took delivery and I am just loving it. What a great road bike. I like it better than my 2002 R1150R.

Good luck, it WILL grow on you.

[adooley]

Hmm. My 2002 RT-P has the servo-assisted linked brakes. Does the pedal only operate the rear brake on the RT-Ps? I'll have to check that out. I have no issue the linked brakes. Like anything else, it took some time to get used to it and learn its nuances. Now, we get along just fine and it has saved my bacon on a number of occasions here in DC. :thumb

[prhkgh]

I too wondered if my 2002 R1150RT-P had 'linked' brakes or not...and it's VERY easy to figure out what with the bike being almost perfectly balanced when on it's center stand, once someone else mentioned how to me. It was truly a 'duh' moment.

Put the bike on the center stand. Turn on the key so the computer is live and the power brakes have power.

TEST if rear brake pedal activates front:
If the rear wheel is on the ground and the front is in the air, standing on the right side of the bike and spin the front wheel by hand,then step on the rear brake pedal. Did the front wheel stop? You have linked rear to front. (My RT-P model does NOT have this, my understanding is civilian RTs do.)

TEST if front brake lever activates rear:
Put some weight on the front of the bike, or take off the rear boxes, so the bike is on it's front wheel with rear wheel in the air. Hand spin the rear wheel, squeeze the front brake lever. Did it stop the rear wheel? Then your front brake lever IS linked to your rear brake, and using the lever actuates both front and rear. (My RT-P DOES do this.)

I do not know what parts might be needed to convert standard RT brakes to RT-P. I'm sure it's theoretically possible, but probably more $$$ than anyone would want to spend.

I went to the R1150RT-P from a 2000 R1100RT. While both had ABS, it did take a while to get used to the power brakes, and although everything else being equal I'd probably stay with the non-powered, it didn't take TOO long to get used to them. The only problem I have is they are kind of grabby 1st thing in the morning at ultra low speeds, like when I'm horsing it out of my garage to the street.

Want some really awful brakes? Bike I had before the R1100RT was a 1995 URAL 'Sportsman' (Sidecar and "open differential" 2WD.) (Later URALS had locked differential 2WD, much better.) But to the brakes. NOT power. NOT disk. NOT even hydraulic! Rods and cables all the way. Braking was "a nice notion", it took much more distance than a normal car stopping normally. I'd leave very long following distances at 45mph, and STILL had a number of OMG will I stop in time? moments. New URALS still use drums on the back and sidecar, and now have a disk on the front. I've heard NOW when you panic stop you get to slide the front wheel as you glide into whatever was in front of you...

Yeah, whizzy (power) semi-linked ABS equipped disk brakes...if you don't like em, ride a URAL or DNEPR for a while.

Paul
02 R1150RT-P
98 HD Sportster

[OfficerImpersonator]

I just finished spending three days riding my RT-P around Mt. Rainier and Mt. St. Helens with friends riding an Aprilia RST 1000, a Ducati 1000, and a Triumph Daytona.

Not only could my RT-P keep up with them all - quite often they were the ones working hard to keep up with me - and we're not talking straight roads here, we're talking about the twistiest, most technical roads in Washington State - Forest Service Road 25 between Randall and Cougar and Forest Service Road 99, from FS 25 up to Windy Ridge next to Mt. St. Helens.

The combination of my powerful brakes and my superior suspension allowed me to go faster through corners on uneven and off-camber pavement than the sport bikes. At first I thought I was a far better rider than I thought I was, but then I realized my bike was what enabled me to do what I was doing. I used the entire tread surface of my tires - the tires are now scuffed all the way to the sidewalls, and I scrapped my pegs on four different corners and scraped some of the paint off the center stand with some of the big dips in the road.

I don't care that the brake servos make noise. I don't care that it takes some experience to learn how to brake hard without the "grabbiness". What I do care about is that this is a superior braking system that when coupled with a superior suspension design outperforms newer liter sportbikes, and that's good enough for me.

[adooley]

Paul, you are absolutely right about the RT-P not having linked brakes. I tried your little test and the front wheel spins freely when the foot pedal is pressed. I learn something new every so often! Thanks again. Makes me really appreciate my 2002 R1150RT-P just a little bit more. :bliss

[prhkgh]

I'm glad you figured your linked-or-not brakes out, that your BACK brakes don't activate your FRONTs. But I'll bet you're still half-linked, with the FRONT brakes activating the rear. (At least that's how my RT-P brakes are.)

I have to admit years back I fell into the habit of generally only front braking, when riding a HD Sportster whose rear brake was subject to hanging up every now and then. And with the way the RT-P works, there is seldom a real need to hit the backs as well as the fronts.

Then earlier this year I took an ERC class and came away with a resolution to discipline myself to use both brakes, just like I did for the 1st 30 of the ~44 years I've ridden. I ride my bike and drive my cars pretty conservatively, leaving pretty sizable following distances in traffic, "leaving myself an out", "getting the big picture", and trying to almost always have a "swerve plan" (is the space to my right open? to my left?) before needing it. As such it is quite rare for me to have a 'panic stop' situation (now that I no longer ride a URAL.) Rare, but not non-existant.

So why get in the habit of using both brakes when the front is more than sufficient? And when the front activates the rear anyway? So it will be 2nd nature in the rare occasion I really NEED to, when I don't have time to think "should I?"...especially if I happen to be on some other bike with non-ABS non-linked brakes. I want my 'muscle memory' to automatically get 'em both.

Finally, even if you are a 'front brake only' rider, remember to watch the wear on your rear pads, since you're using the rear every time you hit the front lever. I've read elsewhere that the rear brake pads on linked bikes wear out quicker than the front pads, but I don't have enough miles on my RT-P to verify it or not.

Ride safe.

[OfficerImpersonator]

I go through two sets of rear brake pads in the same amount of time I go through one set of front brake pads.

I use both brakes almost all the time, but use the rear brake exclusively for extremely low-speed maneuvering (i.e. creeping along in a long line of cars waiting for their turn a a four-way stop) where I want a firm grip on the bar with my right hand while my left hand works the clutch.

[Landfellow]

Whizzy = linked/integrated. Whizzy is just the noise the actuators/servos make.

The hand lever activates both front and rear, but proportionally(less to the rear).
The foot pedal also activates both, and that is what I do not like. It would be better if the foot pedal was only a rear brake. I understand that the foot pedal puts more braking force proportionally to the rear than does the hand lever, but I may be wrong.
Clearer?


That's what I love about my RT-P Front brake activates both front and rear, foot pedal only activates the rear. It has saved my a** a few times. You can stop on a dime if needed. It is the best of both worlds

[Paul_F]

I met a rider last summer, who had just recently purchased a 2004 R1150RT. He told me that his bike, an anniversary model, had the front brakes linked to the rear, but not the rear to the front. After reading your posts, am I correct in assuming that he was mistaken? :dunno

[adooley]

I met a rider last summer, who had just recently purchased a 2004 R1150RT. He told me that his bike, an anniversary model, had the front brakes linked to the rear, but not the rear to the front. After reading your posts, am I correct in assuming that he was mistaken? :dunno

I am not sure about an 04 1150RT anniversary model. I believe that the brakes were linked regardless on all the R1150RTs in the US except for the police versions, which were partial linked. The foot brake only activates the rear brake for the police versions. Of course, that person's bike might have been modified to de-link the rear brake.

[laguna]

02 rt awesome brakes but no linear feel.
I like using the friction zone of the clutch for low speed movement and at low speeds just a very light touch on the rear brake, like going down hill on loose surfaces.
Anyway,to me, it is fun to practice as many kinds of braking skills on every ride as I can.

[bikerfish1100]

I like using the friction zone of the clutch for low speed movement ......

no guarantee, but your bike is becoming a likely candidate for early clutch replacement if this is frequent behavior. single disc dry clutches are not so keen on FZ usage.

[GSAddict]

Leave more room ahead? Not likely. The problem is that every time I do, somebody in a car or suv takes it as an invitation to pull in front and leave about half the space that I otherwise would. So, leaving the space is safer until somebody inevitably makes it much less so than my minimum (somewhat) safe distance.


Doesn't that just PISS you off? :banghead:banghead

[laguna]

Parking lot ,narrow alley U-turns is where FZ helps. I'm a hick- when it breaks I'll fix it.
I practice 20,30,40,50,60,70,80,90 and ton mph stops every week that I can find semi-dry pavement on the Padre Island Seashore road,(cs) which is every week.IT IS FUN. Yes it uses brake pads at about 37k .:dance I like g's that one of the reasons that I ride ! + or -. Do not most bikes have more BHP than HP? Anyway I must be the only one who just does not like the ghost in the machine feel of the brakes when they take over.

[bikerfish1100]

should be able to u-turn a beemer (or most anything other than a really raked out chopper, for that matter) in under a 20ft width without use of FZ. counterweight & a good head turn with smooth throttle control should do it.
of course, if you enjoy replacing clutches, that's cool too.

[laguna]

Hey yeah 20 ft, I am talking 7,8 ft-run over 100k without clutch problems-so what. No worries man.

[bikerfish1100]

if you are u-turning an RT in 7 or 8 ft widths, youz gotz mad skilz, fo sho :thumb

[OfficerImpersonator]

if you are u-turning an RT in 7 or 8 ft widths, youz gotz mad skilz, fo sho :thumb

If you can turn the bike within a distance that is the same as the bike's length, your RT is either on a turn-table, is parked on glare ice, or has a reverse gear.

[maxscycle]

Leave more room ahead? Not likely. The problem is that every time I do, somebody in a car or suv takes it as an invitation to pull in front and leave about half the space that I otherwise would.


I get that from lots of folks about how you can't have adequate following distance
(as in 2 seconds following distance), because someone cuts in just in front of you. I'll argue that you can have 2 seconds following distance. I did it while commuting on the Baltimore Beltway and on the DC beltway.
For example if everyone is doing 65. I would do 63. You're right, just about the time I got my 2 seconds, someone did cut over. But they are doing 65ish. And about the time I got my 2 seconds again, someone else would cut over. But they are doing 65.
I never got run over, I rarely had anyone ride my rear. Lots of folks did honk at me as they passed me. Sometimes they would wave, but not use all there fingers.
But did I care? I had a 98 miles cummute home. And by doing 63 in a 55, when everyone else is doing 65. The increased time to get home was insignificant.
max

[althotos]

Hope you bought the R1150RT, since this is an old thread. I just bought a 2002 R1150RS and it has integrated brakes for the handbrake. Foot pedal only activates rear brake. Additionally, my bike has a servo-assist mechanism for the front ABS brakes, which allow 20% faster activation. Hope you are enjoying your bike.:wave

[E_Page]

I get that from lots of folks about how you can't have adequate following distance
(as in 2 seconds following distance), because someone cuts in just in front of you. I'll argue that you can have 2 seconds following distance. I did it while commuting on the Baltimore Beltway and on the DC beltway.
For example if everyone is doing 65. I would do 63. You're right, just about the time I got my 2 seconds, someone did cut over. But they are doing 65ish. And about the time I got my 2 seconds again, someone else would cut over. But they are doing 65.
I never got run over, I rarely had anyone ride my rear. Lots of folks did honk at me as they passed me. Sometimes they would wave, but not use all there fingers.
But did I care? I had a 98 miles cummute home. And by doing 63 in a 55, when everyone else is doing 65. The increased time to get home was insignificant.
max

Perhaps in Delaware everyone drives a fairly constant speed. Not so in most places I've driven/ridden.

That approach doesn't work because you cannot maintain anything approaching a constant speed until you are well out of the urban/suburban areas. On the 35 mile freeway portion of my 55 mile (one way) commute, I am constantly adjusting speeds anywhere between 10 and 75 MPH, as that is the dynamic nature of the flow of rush hour traffic in the Sacramento area. And it is not rare for it to become stop-n-go at times.

If you try that method of trying to maintain a truly safe distance, you will soon find yourself slowing to well below the flow of traffic, and I've found it to add a non-negligible 20 minutes or so to my commute time on bad traffic days.

Hyper vigilence seems to be both the most practical and, if on my bike as opposed to in my truck, the safest.

[laguna]

I did not mean to say I can u-turn in a bike length-I can u- turn in a one lane width(8' 2'' in Texas.) You can too, I had to keep trying and trying.