1960 R69 barn find

[flymymbz]

The better half got to talking to a guy about bikes and guy tells him he has a 60 R69 in his garage that he wants to sell. I don't believe it is an S model. Bike has been sitting for over 20 years. Says it looks like all of it is there, but it'll prolly need to be completely torn down and rebuilt. What is something like this worth? We'd like to make an offer on the bike, but don't know what a fair price would be. help!

Thanks

Dee

[DarrylRi]

1960 would be the last year before the R69S came out. These bikes, completely and accurately restored, are fetching in the $20,000 range. A few years ago, when they were getting about half that, there was a rule of thumb: $5k to buy a complete bike; $5k to mechanically restore it; and $5k to cosmetically restore it. But, as you can see, prices have gone up.

Almost regardless of what needs fixing, you can get it done. BMW has commissioned suppliers to provide a lot of the parts for these bikes. Visit Craig "Vech" Vechorik at Bench Mark Works (http://www.benchmarkworks.com) for an idea about parts availability and prices. Call him on his advice line and you can get a lot more information. You can do the work yourselves or there are a few places that can do some or all of it for you. You could also join the Slash2 email list (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/slash2) for a lot of information.

Good luck!

[72598]

1960 would be the last year before the R69S came out.

I'm not attacking you Darrel, I first used 1960 because that was the first time line about the R69S that I read. (it puts me in a dilemma when two or more trusted sources disagree with each other)

Seems to be some debate about the first year of the R69S. Most sources state 1961 some 1960 and one stated 1962. (I know that 1962 is wrong and I have never actually seen a 60)

The 1960 is the debatable year, I have heard several reasons for this. (no conformation this is just what I have heard/read, and one book I read said 1960 was first year and then in a later chapter said 62!)

1) there was no 1960 R69S (this is the generally accepted theory)

2) The 1960 R69S was a late year addition not listed in 60 ads

3) being a late year production all R69S built in 1960 were titled as 61s (magazines tested these in 60 but bikes were actually 61 year models)

4) the 1960 was Euro only (I also heard this about the 61s)

5) the 1960 was a proto type and not put into production till 61

6) the R69S heads were available in 60 and a few wound up on R69 as performance parts

7) the planned 1960 had production problems and was listed in parts inventory but actual production was postponed till 61 (or R69S specific parts were available before the bike)

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Also as stated by Darrel, Craig Vech is the best single source of parts and advice. I have also found that Clem at BMW of Denver, Boxer Works, Blue Moon, and Bob's BMW are also good sources. (Bob's even has some NOS parts for the /2s)

Also the restoration cost as stated by Darrel includes labor and much of this could be a lot cheaper if you can do some of your own work. (much labor cost on a restoration is unskilled menial work like cleaning and prep for paint)

This is very informative if a little hard to navigate.

http://www.snafu.org/restore/index.html

[Mika]

BMW Motorrad International lists the production dates for the R 69 ( http://specials.bmw-motorrad.com/com/en/index_frameset.html?content=http://specials.bmw-motorrad.com/com/en/fascination/history/history_main.html) as running from 1955 to 1960 and the R 69 S ( http://specials.bmw-motorrad.com/com/en/index_frameset.html?content=http://specials.bmw-motorrad.com/com/en/fascination/history/history_main.html) running from 1960 to 1969. They don’t break production down by month.

Is some of the confusion in various source references the difference when any BMW model production began or ended and the model year; for example production beginning in 1960 for the 1961 model year for the R 69 S?

:lurk

[flymymbz]

Thanks!

Its entirely possible that this is a Euro model, we did buy one bike from him that was never imported here.

Still haven't decided if we want the bike or not, but the pics I've seen of that model that are restored sure are purdy. Just not sure I'm ready to take on another project right now. Guess I could just shove it in the corner of the shop and throw a cover on it.......its been sitting for 20+ years, whats a couple more???? :laugh

[DarrylRi]

The reason for the confusion on the model year is that BMW has, at least since WWII, started their model years in September. In Germany, everyone takes vacation in the summer. BMW has traditionally closed their factory in August to retool and prepare for the next year's production.

So, my 1961 model year R60/2 (#336 in the series) was actually built in December of 1960. But it's definitely a 1961 model year bike.

Another factor, at least in the US, is that until surprisingly recently, many states didn't take much care in checking the paperwork submitted by dealers when selling new bikes. In the '60s, some BMW bikes sat around on the floor for a long time, and when a dealer would sell it, he might "update" the year on the title/registration paperwork so that the purchaser might not realize he was buying a bike that was a couple years old.

[20774]

My R69S was built in Apr/May 1968 according to BMW records. It was bought (don't know when) by a US serviceman and broght back to the states. The bike is a '69 model as far as I know...that is what it was titled as.

[marchyman]

Another factor, at least in the US, is that until surprisingly recently, many states didn't take much care in checking the paperwork submitted by dealers when selling new bikes.

Subject creep...

Not that recent, Darryl. The model year (not the date of manufacture) is encoded in the 17 character VIN which has been in use since the early 80s. It is the 10th digit of the VIN. Letter 'A' was used for model year 1980. It will be used again for 2010. The letters I, O, Q, U, Z, and the numeral 0 are not used.

More than you care to know about VINs is at http://www.vinguard.org/vin.htm

Back to vintage stuff

[DarrylRi]

Subject creep...

Not that recent, Darryl. The model year (not the date of manufacture) is encoded in the 17 character VIN which has been in use since the early 80s. It is the 10th digit of the VIN. Letter 'A' was used for model year 1980. It will be used again for 2010. The letters I, O, Q, U, Z, and the numeral 0 are not used.

More than you care to know about VINs is at http://www.vinguard.org/vin.htm

Back to vintage stuff

Maybe that's not recent to you, but I only have 2 bikes (of 7) that have a "modern VIN". :)