I want my Hog back...

[WolfRun]

I sold my HD Ultra Classic last year due to the a downturn in my business, and have since sold the company and received a refund of the taxes that I overpaid. I decided it was a perfect time to buy a BMW, a bike that I've always wanted to own. I bought a new '09 R1200RT and it's a great bike, but it's definitely not an Ultra Classic. I slide forward toward the tank all the time, there isn't any way to move around on the footpegs, as the Harley had footboards, and the ride is much more harsh.

All said, it's a great bike, but I want my Ultra back! I considered the K1200LT, but it just wasn't the real "boxer" BMW, and that's what I'd always wanted. And, there's still no way to move your feet around, not to mention that it's not the prettiest bike on the planet (sorry, just my opinion).

I became disheartened by the Harley thing due to all the add-ons and accessories that you had to purchase to make the bike personal. They sell them "incomplete" with crappy handgrips and seats, then you have to spend thousands to make the bike your own. I was also tired of the entire Harley crowd. Ride from bar to bar, and park your bike most of the time. I like to RIDE!

Now that I have the Beemer, I want my Ultra back. It's just the best touring bike out there, in my opinion. It's faster and more powerful than my R1200RT, and the windshield doesn't flop all over the place while riding (what's up with that, BMW?). I also miss the stereo, but I do love the heated seat and handgrips on my RT.

Don't get me wrong, the RT is a nice bike, it's just not the bike I hoped it was.

Anybody looking for a beautiful, black metallic RT out there? It's for sale, if you're interested!

[HexST]

Not to rain on your memories but unless your Hog was heavily breathed on it was not as powerful as the RT. They make floorboards for the RT too. One thing about the boxer that is very different than the HD is where the power is if you get above 5500 RPM I think the Beemer will surprise you with it's 100+ HP compared to around 71Hp for the HD that not taking into effect the over two hundred pounds of weight difference. I'm not saying the Ultra is not a great ride it's just you might have to change your riding style to get some love from the RT.

[rbertalotto]

All bikes are great............All depends on what you want.

Harleys are Harleys and BMWs are BMWs..............Not much in common. Lots of folks try to make the leap from one to the other and are dissappointed. Nothing wrong with that.

Sell the RT and find another Harley and you'll be fine...............

Or keep that RT and let it grow on you and after a few miles of twisties or a sudden emergency stop, or a couple 600 mile days you'll wonder how in the world you ever rode a Harley......................:thumb

[Oldhway]

Moved to campfire since it's about bikes rather than the club.

[108625]

"If you want a unique bike; buy a Harley and leave it stock, or buy a BMW and modify it."
I don't remember the first time I heard it, but it's true.

[Visian]

IDon't get me wrong, the RT is a nice bike, it's just not the bike I hoped it was.

try a GS. :nod

despite the image BMW presents for these bikes, they are phenomenal continent crushers.

(and, used harleys are a real deal these days.....)

ian

[lawman101]

Or keep that RT and let it grow on you and after a few miles of twisties or a sudden emergency stop, or a couple 600 mile days you'll wonder how in the world you ever rode a Harley......................:thumb

Ditto!

I too came off a new Ultra in 05 and went to a new 05 RT after nearly going down on an emergency stop..I will never go back to a non ABS bike.. It took me some time to adjust to the different ergonomics and make the changes I needed to get comfortable but now I wouldn't consider going back..Barbacks will help. A custom seat will help. Time on the bike will help..Once you get used to the suspension, brakes, and handling of the RT you likely will never be satisfied to go back to the Harley..I say keep it, make it comfortable for you and ride it..In six months you'll be glad you did..:thumb

[osbornk]

You have to give it some time. BMWs are an acquired taste. Years ago, when I got my first BMW, I wondered why I had bought it instead of keeping my old Honds Magna and Kawasaki GPZ. They were both much faster and smoother. However, after I rode it for a while, I began to appreciate and enjoy it. I also found out that I could get parts for older BMWs more easily that for my prior bikes.

[Squatch]

After owning an Ultra for 6 years, I sold it at the end of last summer with the anticpation of buying an 09 GSA in the spring. Well, long story short, I just got back from a 4500 mile trip in 12 days that included a couple of 700 mile days and am absolutely astounded at how I enjoyed the GSA. Now I will say I added a Russel seat but there is absolutely no way I could have enjoyed that ride on my Ultra. Then you throw on top of that the performance in the twisties and the ability to forge down those less travelled dirt roads and I'm a happy man.

We stopped by Laconia for bike week and I will admit that there were some momentary lusting for the harley but it quickly faded to a distant memory as we headed toward Lake Placid and those wonderful twisties in the canyons.... I could possibly see a Harley in the future but only if I become a multi bike family because I am not going to part with my GSA for a long time. :thumb

[Brettendress]

Harley more powerful and faster than a BMW RT??? I don't think so LOL, you must be getting too much grief from the bar crowd.

[Brettendress]

Not being rude in my comment above but the Harley rates and ranks last in every magazine against every other touring bike out there. The Goldwing, BMW Lt both spank it in every way except price. Riding position is cruiser style which is proven uncomfortable Etc Etc. It took me a few weeks to love my GS after many other bikes I almost could not believe I bought it (buyers Remorse) but as the weeks came and went all other five bikes in my garage seem to sit now and at four years the 04 GS has 67,000 miles 1996 VFR 11,500 the Vulcan 6,700 Scramber 4,000 all and also 1970 r60/5 does have 40,000. So take the BMW on a big trip and stretch its wings you will fall in love with it. Sorry about the above LOL comment but Harley just doesn't hold a candle to BMW in any way except "look at me" category. I know I hate them and some love them but no one will ever change my mind so don't even try, I would hate to see you make such a big mistake.

Harley Hater
Brett Endress
Altoona Pa

[OldNuke]

The problem is, living in Delano, you're too close to a Harley dealer. The Ultra radiation waves emanating from the dealer are affecting your thinking.

Get on the RT and take a "long ride" to clear you mind. That is a sure cure for Ultra radiation sickness. :thumb

Fellow Minneeesotan

[ragtoplvr]

It takes some time for a former Harley rider to learn to wind the BMW a little tighter.

Then you go to a Harley and hit the rev limiter all the time. Then stuff starts dragging.

You might consider renting a Harley for the weekend, and make sure you still like them. Sometimes if you buy the rental is credited for the purchase price. This way if memory is a little less than perfect you discover it on your own. A beemer feels different than a Harley.

rod

[Easy]

Not to rain on your memories but unless your Hog was heavily breathed on it was not as powerful as the RT. They make floorboards for the RT too. One thing about the boxer that is very different than the HD is where the power is if you get above 5500 RPM I think the Beemer will surprise you with it's 100+ HP compared to around 71Hp for the HD that not taking into effect the over two hundred pounds of weight difference. I'm not saying the Ultra is not a great ride it's just you might have to change your riding style to get some love from the RT.

+1 :thumb

Having owned three Harleys and ridden many more, comparing the two would be like comparing apples to oranges.

The RT definitely has more horsepower, remembering torque is a different matter.

If you don't like riding close to the tank, put a 1/4 inch wooden dowel between the front seat and the mount and the problem is cured.

Easy :lurk

[108625]

Thinking about it, if it's the "dresser" type cruiser/tour bike you want, why not one of the Japanese V-twins? I mean, that's a closer match to the style of bike you've been riding than the RT is, but they don't charge HD prices and then rape you again at the parts counter too.

[WolfRun]

After the last post, I went on an extended ride on the Beemer, and fiddled with the suspension, and now it's nearly perfect. I still find it "different" from the Harley in that you can't move your feet around as much, but it was very comfortable. I may try a different seat to keep from sliding forward, but it really wasn't a problem today.

As for the power of my Ultra, yes, it was heavily modified which is another reason I wanted something different. Too much money spent on accessorizing the bike. You wouldn't believe the power (torque) that the Ultra is capable of after massaging it a bit. It would pull away like a barnstormer! It wasn't great in the twisties, but it was a touring bike, after all, and meant for the open highway.

All in all, they're both fantastic bikes. Each in it's own way. I sure enjoyed the ride today, though! Another thing I noticed on the Beemer is that while it may not seem like you're moving fast, one look at the speedo and you realize that it's moving quite a bit faster than it feels!

Thanks for all the great advice and feedback. And yes, I do live less than a mile from the local HD dealer, and they are beautiful bikes to behold, and built very well. But like they say, different strokes for different folks. If I could, I'd own one of every type of bike out there!

My favorite comment was from "108625" -
"If you want a unique bike; buy a Harley and leave it stock, or buy a BMW and modify it." - never heard that one, but it's true!

Take care all, and thanks again!

Happy to be a Beemer owner again...:thumb

Kurt

[WolfRun]

Love it! I'll have to remember that - Ultra Radiation Waves!!!:laugh


The problem is, living in Delano, you're too close to a Harley dealer. The Ultra radiation waves emanating from the dealer are affecting your thinking.

Get on the RT and take a "long ride" to clear you mind. That is a sure cure for Ultra radiation sickness. :thumb

Fellow Minneeesotan

[WolfRun]

Rape doesn't even come close to the parts prices! :thumb

Thinking about it, if it's the "dresser" type cruiser/tour bike you want, why not one of the Japanese V-twins? I mean, that's a closer match to the style of bike you've been riding than the RT is, but they don't charge HD prices and then rape you again at the parts counter too.

[WolfRun]

I'm not impressed with the magazine reviews, they've always cut down Harleys, and they're dead wrong. Harley's today are very great bikes, and built like tanks (yes, they're heavy). I wouldn't buy a GoldWing, as I may as well be driving a car! That's another reason I went with the BMW. It's got personality, just as a Harley does. No offense to anybody riding a GoldWing, as they are great bikes, but just too "car like" to me, if that makes any sense.

Love your signature, though! Harley Hater!



Not being rude in my comment above but the Harley rates and ranks last in every magazine against every other touring bike out there. The Goldwing, BMW Lt both spank it in every way except price. Riding position is cruiser style which is proven uncomfortable Etc Etc. It took me a few weeks to love my GS after many other bikes I almost could not believe I bought it (buyers Remorse) but as the weeks came and went all other five bikes in my garage seem to sit now and at four years the 04 GS has 67,000 miles 1996 VFR 11,500 the Vulcan 6,700 Scramber 4,000 all and also 1970 r60/5 does have 40,000. So take the BMW on a big trip and stretch its wings you will fall in love with it. Sorry about the above LOL comment but Harley just doesn't hold a candle to BMW in any way except "look at me" category. I know I hate them and some love them but no one will ever change my mind so don't even try, I would hate to see you make such a big mistake.

Harley Hater
Brett Endress
Altoona Pa

[nevada72]

Happy to be a Beemer owner again...:thumb

Kurt


Well, that was fast. I suspect you'll go back and forth on this issue. You're between two very different, but very nice bikes. I have a GS and I love it. Just finished a 3500 mile week on it, one day was 18 hours of riding. To be honest, sometimes I was wishing I was on an Ultra (but it would have to be an 09). On the open highway it's tough to beat the HD. I have logged a bunch of miles on rented Ultras and I love the adjustable backrest option, electronic cruise control, floor boards, and just the relaxed feel. I can ride all day and my back feels great. Can't say as much about my GS. That said, when I get into the twisties or off pavement I remember why I'm on a GS and not an Ultra.

As far as modification goes, if RTs are anything like other BMWs, a new seat is in order immediately. I have a Russell Daylong and love it. Butt pain (or sliding forward) is never an issue. Do yourself a favor if you keep the RT - get a Daylong. Can't imagine spending more than an hour on a stock BMW seat. You can also lower the pegs to relax the legs a bit as well as make handlebar adjustments. I did all of that to my GS and transformed the bike. It's almost as comfortable as an Ultra on the Hwy, but infinitely more capable on everything else. That said, I would really love an Ultra as a 2nd bike. The 09s are vastly improved machines.

[Montana]

You could find a happy compromise. Go for a torquey shaft-drive BWM boxer with ABS that seems like a cruiser:

http://www.chromeheads.org/cgi-bin/discus/board-profile.cgi?action=pict&file=96698.jpg

Oh, wait. It is a cruiser.

[glennhendricks]

Wolf

Had the same problem even with an aftermarket saddle. Got some washers in a seat lift kit and raised the front by about 1/4 inch or so, maybe 3/8.

Huge difference and a cheap fix.

[hlothery]

YMMV always, here is my humble opinion:

When I bought my Road King in 2003, it was far superior to the Yamaha VStar 1100 I had been riding, in power, and in ride and handling. I could lean the RK a lot lower in corners without anything dragging. Once I got the hang of the air shocks, the ride was great. When I got my RT in 2005, it was that much better again than the RK in comfort, power, and handling/ride, once I got the damping right. A Rick Mayer seat and a few farkles made it even better. Now, my Goldwing is the apple of my eye, and once again (IMHO, of course) a step above in comfort and power. I'm still adjusting the damping for the ride I like best. It corners like a bandit. And the farkles are great.

Bottom line - I like bikes.

Ride safe.

[WolfRun]

Well, that was fast. I suspect you'll go back and forth on this issue. You're between two very different, but very nice bikes. I have a GS and I love it. Just finished a 3500 mile week on it, one day was 18 hours of riding. To be honest, sometimes I was wishing I was on an Ultra (but it would have to be an 09). On the open highway it's tough to beat the HD. I have logged a bunch of miles on rented Ultras and I love the adjustable backrest option, electronic cruise control, floor boards, and just the relaxed feel. I can ride all day and my back feels great. Can't say as much about my GS. That said, when I get into the twisties or off pavement I remember why I'm on a GS and not an Ultra.

As far as modification goes, if RTs are anything like other BMWs, a new seat is in order immediately. I have a Russell Daylong and love it. Butt pain (or sliding forward) is never an issue. Do yourself a favor if you keep the RT - get a Daylong. Can't imagine spending more than an hour on a stock BMW seat. You can also lower the pegs to relax the legs a bit as well as make handlebar adjustments. I did all of that to my GS and transformed the bike. It's almost as comfortable as an Ultra on the Hwy, but infinitely more capable on everything else. That said, I would really love an Ultra as a 2nd bike. The 09s are vastly improved machines.

Thanks for the advice, I'll check out the Daylong seat and the dowels mentioned previously. You're right about the Ultra being a great bike on the highway. It's the "original" highway cruiser, and that's why it's been copied by so many others. Look at the new Kawasaki cruiser with the "batwing" fairing. I had a ton of engine work done on my Ultra, and the torque was amazing. It pulled like a freight train, and was as smooth as silk going down the highway. I also had the adjustable backrest, which vastly improved the comfort on a long ride. I could ride that thing all day long and never had any issues with comfort. I will probably get another Ultra someday, but for now, I'm enjoying the BMW. I hadn't fiddled enough with the ESA, but now that I've figured that out, it's much more comfortable. I also purchased a brake pedal extender, but I'm not sure I want to use it. I'm actually getting used to the short pedal on the bike, and I'm afraid that the extender could fall off during a long ride, and if I was used to the placement, I'd step down and it wouldn't be there!

I'm planning a trip from Minnesota to Austin, TX soon, and I'm looking forward to any advice others can give me as to what type of additional luggage to put on the bike (tank bag, rear bag, etc.) I'm not sure that I like the BMW tour box that they offer for the rear, but I've seen some pretty nice looking aftermarket textile bags that are light and easily removable.

Thanks again to all!

[MLS2GO]

I seem strangely compelled to join this as I have an 07 Ultra and a 07 RT.
The stock seat sucks on both bikes. I use a Mustang on the HD and a Russell on the RT. I insisted with Russel to have a small scoop to the seat, I Hate sliding forward. Done. When I got my RT I called Mustang in hopes they made seats for BMW, but alas they don't. Great seats much less than custom made ones.
People ask me all the time which I like the best. I ask them for what type of riding. My wife prefers the Ultra so we take it on all couple type rides. I also have a one wheel trailer I pull with the Ultra, that I wouldn't pull with the RT.
I do some IBA rides and that is one big reason I bought the RT. It is set up for that and I really enjoy it for that, and it is much more fun in the Twisties.
I can enjoy and speak HD with that crowd on Beemer with the BMW set. Not all HD riders ride bar to bar as is the common snide reamark on most other forums. And not all BMW Riders only ride from latte stop to latte stop. For example in out HOG Club I know of 9 or 10 IBA Members for example, and the winner of the localmileage contest normally has 35,000 miles or so. Enjoy each motorcycle for what it is, not what it isn't.
Every motorcycle is perfect for someone.

[SIBUD]

Every motorcycle is perfect for someone.

You meet the nicest people on a Honda. :thumb

[kgadley01]

I sold my HD Ultra Classic last year due to the a downturn in my business, and have since sold the company and received a refund of the taxes that I overpaid. I decided it was a perfect time to buy a BMW, a bike that I've always wanted to own. I bought a new '09 R1200RT and it's a great bike, but it's definitely not an Ultra Classic. I slide forward toward the tank all the time, there isn't any way to move around on the footpegs, as the Harley had footboards, and the ride is much more harsh.

All said, it's a great bike, but I want my Ultra back! I considered the K1200LT, but it just wasn't the real "boxer" BMW, and that's what I'd always wanted. And, there's still no way to move your feet around, not to mention that it's not the prettiest bike on the planet (sorry, just my opinion).

I became disheartened by the Harley thing due to all the add-ons and accessories that you had to purchase to make the bike personal. They sell them "incomplete" with crappy handgrips and seats, then you have to spend thousands to make the bike your own. I was also tired of the entire Harley crowd. Ride from bar to bar, and park your bike most of the time. I like to RIDE!

Now that I have the Beemer, I want my Ultra back. It's just the best touring bike out there, in my opinion. It's faster and more powerful than my R1200RT, and the windshield doesn't flop all over the place while riding (what's up with that, BMW?). I also miss the stereo, but I do love the heated seat and handgrips on my RT.

Don't get me wrong, the RT is a nice bike, it's just not the bike I hoped it was.

Anybody looking for a beautiful, black metallic RT out there? It's for sale, if you're interested!

I have to agree with you!!! after years of riding Harleys I finally got to where I could afford two bikes. I bought a BMW RT and while its a lot of fun to ride, it doesn't have much low end torque. the beemer takes a lot more maintence than the Harley. I've just turned 46K on my Electra Glide and the only thing I've replaced is the shifter linkage for $19.95 . on the RT I've had a final drive fail, and a Hall sensor fail for a total of $1432.00. I still like the RT but I believe the Harley to be a better bike in the long run...

[kgadley01]

PS... ask anyone that was at last years Daniel Boone Rally what I rode to the Rally. I had no choice but to ride the Harley, because the Beemer was broke again...:usa

[WolfRun]

+1 :thumb Great post! We need more people with this attitude. On both sides!

I totally concur! I'm sorry if I brought up the Harley riders going bar to bar, but the group I rode with did just that. Although I was a HOG member, I never took the opportunity to ride with them. My mistake. My best friend and fellow rider and I would go to the bars with the rest of them, and drink Root Beer. You won't believe what great root beer they serve at bars. Most of the brands I've never heard of, but it was the best root beer I've ever had!

I'm very pleased that MLS2GO commented on the post. Sounds like a great person, and someone that I would love to ride with. :thumb

Take care all,

[WolfRun]

You meet the nicest people on a Honda. :thumb

I think you can meet the nicest people on any type of bike! There a a ton of great people in this world. Too bad it's the one's that cause trouble that we remember...

[WolfRun]

I seem strangely compelled to join this as I have an 07 Ultra and a 07 RT.
The stock seat sucks on both bikes. I use a Mustang on the HD and a Russell on the RT. I insisted with Russel to have a small scoop to the seat, I Hate sliding forward. Done. When I got my RT I called Mustang in hopes they made seats for BMW, but alas they don't. Great seats much less than custom made ones.
People ask me all the time which I like the best. I ask them for what type of riding. My wife prefers the Ultra so we take it on all couple type rides. I also have a one wheel trailer I pull with the Ultra, that I wouldn't pull with the RT.
I do some IBA rides and that is one big reason I bought the RT. It is set up for that and I really enjoy it for that, and it is much more fun in the Twisties.
I can enjoy and speak HD with that crowd on Beemer with the BMW set. Not all HD riders ride bar to bar as is the common snide reamark on most other forums. And not all BMW Riders only ride from latte stop to latte stop. For example in out HOG Club I know of 9 or 10 IBA Members for example, and the winner of the localmileage contest normally has 35,000 miles or so. Enjoy each motorcycle for what it is, not what it isn't.
Every motorcycle is perfect for someone.

Thanks for the reply, Bob. You are correct! :thumb

Ride safely, and enjoy!

[MLS2GO]

Thanks for the nice responses. I just think there are too many motorcyclists who categorize people instantly by what they ride. All of us need to stick together.

[hcmiller52]

Ditto!
I too came off a new Ultra in 05 and went to a new 05 RT after nearly going down on an emergency stop..I will never go back to a non ABS bike.. It took me some time to adjust to the different ergonomics and make the changes I needed to get comfortable but now I wouldn't consider going back..Barbacks will help. A custom seat will help. Time on the bike will help..Once you get used to the suspension, brakes, and handling of the RT you likely will never be satisfied to go back to the Harley..I say keep it, make it comfortable for you and ride it..In six months you'll be glad you did..:thumbI ride on both sides of the fence and can relate entirely to what you're saying. I had an Electra-Glide UC and traded it for a very tricked-out Sportster (90 bhp!!!). The UC had some problems that prevented me from taking it on a long trip so I made the swap. I've owned 2 RTs, an 1100 and an 1150 and loved them both. I now own a 2008 K1200GT as my touring bike. I ride about 25,000 miles a year, so I beocme accustomed to a bike's peculiarities very quickly.

First off, NO Harley beats a boxer in speed or acceleration. Simply not a fact. Even though I have about as much power coming out of the 1200 EVO engine as it can make (heads ported, cams, pistons, ignition, Thunderheader exhaust), and all the guys at the Harley store who build it and sold it to me believe it is the hottest thing on two wheeels, my 2007 R1200S will blow it into the weeds. In truth, it's about as fast as my old R1100RT , which is still respectable. An UC isn't near as fast as a 1200 Sportster, so there you have a pretty fair comparison.

But, owning a touring bike isn't about speed anyway, is it?

The one thing I've learned about Beemers is that they don't "fit" well. No matter what adjustments you make, they still lack the comfort of the Harleys. There are no highway pegs to allow you to stretch or change position on a BMW. The seats on BMWs all pitch you into the tanks, exascerbating discomfort. I've even put $1,200 into new Corbin seats on my GT and R12S and the one on the GT still pitches me into the tank! I've built a foam wedge and put it under an AirHawk seat cover to solve the problem. Even the stock seats on a Harley are comfortable (if not a little cramped for my 6'2" frame).

I only make these assessments after thousands of miles and hundreds of hours on these bikes. These aren't flippant or casual comments borne of a need to have something to say in a forum.

My solution: own one FLHTCUI and one Boxer and you can switch off, enjoying the best of either. The Boxer is a true fanatics delight and I always want one in my garage. They are a purist's ride, much like a fine fly rod is to a fly fisherman.

In any case, do what you need to to get comfortable!

Curt

[kgadley01]

hcMiller52, I agree 100% with your statement. thats why I own both. :thumb

[DarrylRi]

I have bought 5 new BMWs and put 4 customs seats on them. (I found my 1985 R80, set up with S bars and fairing, to be fine right out of the crate. Otherwise, they have never been comfortable for me for more than a couple hours.)

A lot of people buy Corbin seats, they have the look. But they are not particularly "custom" in the fit dept. And $1200 is incredibly steep for a seat! I put a leather covered Rick Mayer seat on my R1200ST for $500. It's made specifically for me and is very comfortable. Search the forum for custom seats and get some information about what's out there, there are a lot of options and you ought to be able to get a seat that's as comfortable as you need.

[nevada72]

The one thing I've learned about Beemers is that they don't "fit" well. No matter what adjustments you make, they still lack the comfort of the Harleys. There are no highway pegs to allow you to stretch or change position on a BMW. The seats on BMWs all pitch you into the tanks, exascerbating discomfort. I've even put $1,200 into new Corbin seats on my GT and R12S and the one on the GT still pitches me into the tank! I've built a foam wedge and put it under an AirHawk seat cover to solve the problem. Even the stock seats on a Harley are comfortable (if not a little cramped for my 6'2" frame).
Curt

Depends on what you mean by fit. The Germans have a very different idea about what fit is vs Americans. The Germans are all about form. You vill be in proper form ven riding. In general, and especially in the twisties this is a good thing. But, on the open hwy it gets old fast. That's where good old HD is in their element. Relaxed, feet forward, arms low, upright (but not forward) riding position - wonderful.

Also, not all BMWs are the same. My RR was very cramped (factor I'm '6-5"). I had to lower the pegs and raise the seat to make it even remotely comfortable. I rode a K1200GT - same. I would like to try a RT and a LT. My GS is very good right out of the box, but still needed work - new seat (better and higher), new pegs (lower and wider), Rox Risers (more back than up) and I would really like to try a Bakup.

I don't think you could ask for 2 better, or different bikes. As I said, I would love to have both. Maybe.....

[108625]

Depends on what you mean by fit. The Germans have a very different idea about what fit is vs Americans. The Germans are all about form. You vill be in proper form ven riding. In general, and especially in the twisties this is a good thing.

Oh please! The German's idea of "proper form" has little to do with why they're so uncomfortable. As far as "in the twisties" is concerned, there are a lot of bikes out there set up with better ergonomics for that as well, and they don't make me as uncomfortable as my beemer did either. I don't know what the problem is, but I can ride bikes that look like they ought to be a lot less comfortable than a beemer for a lot longer, and even if they're set up to handle more aggressively, they feel better on the highway as well.

I know this thread is aimed more towards tourer-dresser type bikes, but honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if across the range, you'll find the competition's products are often more comfortable. (Not just seating, but ergo's and aero's too.)
Too many BMW owners are routinely replacing, modifying or augmenting their seats to limit the discussion to simply "my german seat doesn't fit my american @ss".

I know, I know, someone will respond with "BMW riders spend more time in the saddle". That's not true as often as some like to think, and many of those custom seats are going on low-mile bikes, anyway.

[nevada72]

Oh please! ........

I'm speaking in general terms regarding the more aggressive, legs tucked, forward riding position of the typical BMW vs the Barco-lounger position of the Harley only. The Germans have long had their own ideas as to what constitutes proper form and the resulting ergonomics. You can not deny that the aggressive riding position of any sporting (most BMWs are sport tourers aren't they?) machine is not as comfortable on the long haul as the relaxed position of a dedicated touring machine. On the other hand, in terms of rider position, I would rather be on pretty much any BMW in the twisties than any Harley. I don't think a lot of people, even HD owners, would argue with me on that point. You'll also note that I'm not comparing the BMW against other bikes nor am I saying that the BMW is perfect or even the best. The seats do suck. I will never own another BMW with a stock seat - brand new or otherwise. However, that is not unique to BMW. You'll find that there is a burgeoning aftermarket seat industry for pretty much all brands.

[butbmw]

I just got off my 06 Street Glide and on to an 09 R1200RT, No Complaints.I loved my Harley, but there is no comparison.I had forgotten what riding was.I too had grown tired of bar hopping and the idea that a ride lasted an hour or so between stops.My wife and I put 300 miles on the first day we had it,didn't even scratch the surface of what is possible.We have done the same ride on the Harley, but somehow this was different. I was riding like years gone by and the wife, she was happy,comfortable and ready for more. Bye Bye Harley,I'll miss ya.