Who raises these people?

[108625]

The following is a series of e-mails I exchanged with someone tonight, via their i-phone (it's apparent what the "I" stands for).


1st message; titled "R65LS":

Bob

If you still have LS for sale, jet me know and send pics and details.

Peter
Sent from my iPhone
PF

My reply:

Peter,

Sorry but we have a commitment on the R65LS already. The R100 is still available.

Thanks,
Bob

2nd message; titled "Send pics":

I gotta see your pics anyway .
Can u call me.
(number provided)

Sent from my iPhone
PF

My reply:

The bike is spoken for, Peter. I'm not selling it out from under someone else.

3rd message; titled "Need advice":

I understand bike is sold. I got leads nearby. Wanted to get your
take on the bike.

Peter

Sent from my iPhone
PF

My reply:

My advice is you don't use other sellers as leverage. End of discussion.


Of all the nerve... First I thought the guy wouldn't respect someone else's claim to the bike, then it turns out he wanted to use it as a bargaining chip over another seller's bike. For all I know, it could be one of you he was trying to negotiate with on the other end. In either case, where are this guy's principles?

And yes; he may have sent it with his phone, but he sent it to email, as email, so I reserve the right to share it here.

[lkchris]

It's an "entitlement," of course.

[mymindsok]

I guess it's so-called "human nature" at work.

I'v had similar calls when I was selling something but several times I've had sellers sell stuff out from under me, when they were offered a little more $$ by another buyer. I even had a supposed buyer come and grill me about my bike for 30 minutes and then announce that he had just come to see me, because he wanted more info in his attempt to purchase a bike from someone else!

About six weeks ago I say an R-100RS advertized on CL, for $1600 and got in tough with the seller. It was a pretty nice bike and the next day before I was supposed to go see the bike, the owner called and told me that he'd has several offers over $2000 if he'd hold it for a few days.

In the end we struck a deal giving him his original asking price plus $200 more bucks. Total $1800. I ended up bringing the bike home and we both ended up satisified.

I guess it takes all kinds but if I give someone my word, I allways keep it. A deals a deal!

[stkmkt1]

Back in the 80's, I sold cars, both new and used. It was amazing how many uninformed buyers would come in and try to compare a used car on our lot with one on another lot. And no matter how much you tried to explain to them that you cannot just simply compare two used cars based upon price, you cannot. Both may have different options, different miles, and more importantly, different levels of usage over their years of service. For example, you would never expect to pay as much for a car that has been driven all its life in the city versus one that basically all highway miles. the number of miles a vehicle is driven only means something if you take into consideration how those miles were put on the car. Of course there is a limit. I drove an '82 Honda Accord for 427,000 miles before I traded it in. Had to replace a 5th gear bear in the tranny at 375,000. Replaced the clutch at that time, original clutch, and it still had 60% wear left in it.

[88bmwJeff]

It was amazing how many uninformed buyers would come in and try to compare a used car on our lot with one on another lot. And no matter how much you tried to explain to them that you cannot just simply compare two used cars based upon price, you cannot. Both may have different options, different miles....

I'm not surprised. I used to appraise homes, and there would always be some owner thinking their house is worth what the one a block over sold for. Of course they never considered size, remodeling, amenities (e.g. pool, view), etc. And even after you explained that to them, some still had a hard time accepting it.

[deilenberger]

Of all the nerve... First I thought the guy wouldn't respect someone else's claim to the bike, then it turns out he wanted to use it as a bargaining chip over another seller's bike. For all I know, it could be one of you he was trying to negotiate with on the other end. In either case, where are this guy's principles?Hmmm.... sorry, I don't read the conversation the same as you did. I can easily see someone wanting to LEARN about an R65LS, and get some feel for the market value of one if they were considering buying one. It's a rare enough beast that the info isn't easily available - and condition makes a big difference on a collectable bike.

To do that - he might ask for photos of one that was sold recently, and ask how much it was sold for. Reasonable request to me.. it wouldn't offend me in the least.

To me - that's an intelligent buyer. When I'm looking to buy something used, I will spend a bit of time on Ebay checking on completed auctions for similar/same items. It gives me a feel for what the market is doing and how much I should pay for what I'm looking at. Been doing it recently on a BMW M-Coupe since I'm considering buying one and don't want to pay drastically over-market for it (and it's also a rare beast - so the market info is really valuable to me.)

I see nothing wrong with that - but perhaps I have a bit thicker skin than most. :scratch

[deilenberger]

I'm not surprised. I used to appraise homes, and there would always be some owner thinking their house is worth what the one a block over sold for. Of course they never considered size, remodeling, amenities (e.g. pool, view), etc. And even after you explained that to them, some still had a hard time accepting it.Jeff - entirely true - but how would they KNOW the difference unless they (1) asked someone about prior sales and the condition/features of the prior sales or (2) looked at the houses themselves??

They probably aren't clairvoyant. I don't understand the outrage expressed. There is a store out of NY that is noted for their excellent off-price deals - Sy Syms - his store's motto is "An Educated Consumer is Our Best Customer" - and he's right. The educated consumer will recognize value when they see it, and that to me is what the person in the original posting was trying to do. Educate themselves.

[88bmwJeff]

Jeff - entirely true - but how would they KNOW the difference unless they (1) asked someone about prior sales and the condition/features of the prior sales or (2) looked at the houses themselves??


Well, when I would inspect the house, the owners would tell me their house is worth X because the house a few blocks over sold for X. They probably got the info from a local broker who mails regular updates on the market. They knew enough of the market to be telling me of comparable sales, but never stopped to think how comparable the home was to theirs.

[deilenberger]

Well, when I would inspect the house, the owners would tell me their house is worth X because the house a few blocks over sold for X. They probably got the info from a local broker who mails regular updates on the market. They knew enough of the market to be telling me of comparable sales, but never stopped to think how comparable the home was to theirs.And you're the expert - they're not. They may not know how comparable or non-comparable the homes were, especially if they were all in the same development.

[108625]

Hmmm.... sorry, I don't read the conversation the same as you did. I can easily see someone wanting to LEARN about an R65LS, and get some feel for the market value of one if they were considering buying one. It's a rare enough beast that the info isn't easily available - and condition makes a big difference on a collectable bike.

To do that - he might ask for photos of one that was sold recently, and ask how much it was sold for. Reasonable request to me.. it wouldn't offend me in the least.

To me - that's an intelligent buyer. When I'm looking to buy something used, I will spend a bit of time on Ebay checking on completed auctions for similar/same items. It gives me a feel for what the market is doing and how much I should pay for what I'm looking at. Been doing it recently on a BMW M-Coupe since I'm considering buying one and don't want to pay drastically over-market for it (and it's also a rare beast - so the market info is really valuable to me.)

I see nothing wrong with that - but perhaps I have a bit thicker skin than most. :scratch

Don,

I respectfully disagree.
This guy had established contact with me a few days prior (via his phone again) and requested pictures and information on the R100, which I provided. I also told him about the R65LS, without attaching pictures (as not to confuse which was which).
I did not hear from him again until the discussion that started this thread.
If he was curious, why not contact me via e-mail for more details? Or go on-line and look it up? Why use the i-phone and not the computer?
He didn't ask what it sold for, he wanted pictures and details on a bike that was no longer available. The sense of urgency that came across (to me, at least; this whole exchange lasted less than an hour) in his e-mails and the fact that he wanted it over the phone, not to a personal e-mail address (one was never provided) sure made it easy to visualize a guy driving out to see a bike for sale and on the way thinking of another one to use as a negotiating tool.

The intelligent shopper you describe is methodically doing his research on his computer isn't doing it at the last minute on a portable device that would let him show the "competitor's merchandise" to a possible seller.

Secondly, if a buyer wants to learn about a bike, asking another seller is both an unreliable way of doing it (how indifferent and unbiased would that opinion be?), and just plain presumptuous (I'm not interested in your bike, but a bike just like it that someone else is selling). That's like asking for a test ride for a bike you have no intention of buying from that seller.

If you want advice about which airhead to buy and how much to pay for it, there are plenty of acceptable ways to go about getting it. Using modern communication technology to take people for granted because it's more convenient to you isn't one of them. Neither is using it to play people against one another to your benefit; which is what I really got the feeling was going on here.
If I was right, it did not work out for him and it may actually have helped another seller on this site. Posting it may help another, sometime down the road.
If I was wrong, well at worst his feelings were hurt. At best he learned to look things up before he left home, and that sellers are sellers; not third party answer men.

And yes, me posting it is an entitlement not a right.
The same goes for perusing the ads in the Flea Market and contacting sellers with honest intentions.

[yellowrosefarm]

I'm sure this isn't the case with your bike, but I've often wondered when I've put stuff on Craigslist and people respond agressively asking for pictures. I've seen pirated pictures used in scam sales so I suspect that may be at least one reason. Buying and selling is getting weirder all the time. That much, I am sure of.:scratch