Tweety1's F800 woes

[AZ-J]

While I am delighted to see this, finally, since on 4-14-07, I was the one who invited all F800 owners (the F650 were still thumpers then) then saying "Come one and all and let's see if we can make this thread a sticky like the Thumpers have." On 4-20-07, BradfordBenn gave us that status. It has now taken new models and 1.5 years to get this status. Yahoo :cry

If I seem less than enthusiastic, I have reason to be so: This is just in time for my F800S to be declared dead due to electrical failures of an indeterminate nature, and the model is US discontinued so it is unlikely replaceable. :banghead

Words cannot express how disappointed I am about the bike, and how BMW handles customers that have these kind of issues. With the way I have been treated to date, and the deadline under AZ lemon looming fast, I have to say, I may leave the brand for good, and I hope none of you have the problems I had/have. :mad :(

Any suggestions what I should buy next to ease the pain?

[wezul]

Tweets!
No, no no !
Day'em somebody has to come to his rescue.
You love that bike dude, don't quit on it 'cuz it broke.
My RT went t*ts up with EWS failure in front of the dealership.
Got the F800ST in for the ring antenna and fuel tank vent replacement last week.
Would be a shame and the F800 arena would not be the same without you, man.
Have all the F800 (S,ST) been discontinued?

[FredRydr]

Any suggestions what I should buy next to ease the pain?

A DL650. (That was my second choice.)

That's a bummer about your F800S. Why not share the details of the electrical failure in the F-twins tech forum so that we'll be forewarned?

Fred
'09 F800GS
'07 R1200R

[AZ-J]

The S is discontinued in the US (the '09 just came out in Europe), and the ST with its lower engine fairing is hot enough, I'd lose two months of riding here in AZ.

If they find me another comparably equipped '07 S (there are no or few US '08's either) and offer it with a full 3 year warranty, I'll take it, yellow, red, or gray. Otherwise, it is time to:
:cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry

[wezul]

Help, Help, Help!!!!

[AZ-J]

A DL650. (That was my second choice.)

That's a bummer about your F800S. Why not share the details of the electrical failure in the F-twins tech forum so that we'll be forewarned?

Fred
'09 F800GS
'07 R1200R


Who makes the DL650?

And, as far as the details of the electrical failure in the F-twins tech forum? Be forewarned! Here they are:

The bikes shuts off (not a stall, but a 100% loss of all power even with the key switched on) after a 2, 2.5, 3 hour ride. And it does it in gear, with full rear wheel lock up and no ABS brakes. Days of testing are fully inconclusive, all separate hardware tests good, and the CanBus records no error codes.

We all seem to conclude the code is bad, as if the bike had a major computer virus. It does it on accel, decel, and sometimes will not power up with the key, and then does. Any more questions? :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead

[wezul]

O.K.
Mr. Paul Glaves to the white courtesy telephone, please.
H E L P!!!!!

[Mika]

DL650 = Suzuki 650 VStrom

Thanks for the forum separation.

[rocketman]

Are you threatening me?!
:rofl
I'm just so happy the twins got their own place, as it should be.
Thanks forum dudes!

Well I admit it IS a scary proposition, but I took my meds this morning so I should be able to control myself, sorry for scaring you like that, it won't happen again (or at least not until my current dose wears off!) :laugh

RM

[PGlaves]

O.K.
Mr. Paul Glaves to the white courtesy telephone, please.
H E L P!!!!!

You rang???

:type

[wezul]

Yes Paul, I did.
Below is Tweety1's lament. I find it difficult to believe his situation is not correctable.
Your thoughts?

While I am delighted to see this, finally, since on 4-14-07, I was the one who invited all F800 owners (the F650 were still thumpers then) then saying "Come one and all and let's see if we can make this thread a sticky like the Thumpers have." On 4-20-07, BradfordBenn gave us that status. It has now taken new models and 1.5 years to get this status. Yahoo :cry

If I seem less than enthusiastic, I have reason to be so: This is just in time for my F800S to be declared dead due to electrical failures of an indeterminate nature, and the model is US discontinued so it is unlikely replaceable. :banghead

Words cannot express how disappointed I am about the bike, and how BMW handles customers that have these kind of issues. With the way I have been treated to date, and the deadline under AZ lemon looming fast, I have to say, I may leave the brand for good, and I hope none of you have the problems I had/have. :mad :(

Any suggestions what I should buy next to ease the pain?

[AZ-J]

And, as far as the details of the electrical failure in the F-twins tech forum? Be forewarned! Here they are:

The bikes shuts off (not a stall, but a 100% loss of all power even with the key switched on) after a 2, 2.5, 3 hour ride. And it does it in gear, with full rear wheel lock up and no ABS brakes. Days of testing are fully inconclusive, all separate hardware tests good, and the CanBus records no error codes.

We all seem to conclude the code is bad, as if the bike had a major computer virus. It does it on accel, decel, and sometimes will not power up with the key, and then does. Any more questions? :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead

Hello Paul,

Wezul paged for this. BTW, dealer has put thousands of dollars into scoping, BMW keeps asking for more as days under lemon are now 16 out of 30, and 10/9 deadline is looming large.

With a PM of an email, I could forward you the latest PuMA report.

[jasonTDI]

IIRC Mischlers BMW in Beaver Dam, WI has 2 07' F800 S in stock new.

[Braddog]

Any suggestions what I should buy next to ease the pain?

Something in the /5 through /7 series should work quite well for you.
:stick

Seriously, there's nothing more frustrating than dealing with what seems to be some sort of engine control or electrical issue. This one sounds dangerous as well.

There is at least one F800S here locally, I think they're '08's.

Good Luck with whatever direction you take, Tweety.

[Boxerkuh]

I feel you!!!
I have been there with my 99 R11RT. It is not very hard-warming at all, all the money, time and expectations are dashed... I sold my bike and I went back to the Airheads. I have been happy ever since. I had to give up some of the technical advantages, but am not plagued with technical foes that come with it either.
If you like the "simple by choice" motto and give up some of the technical aspects you will find an Airhead an excellent choice. Otherwise as far as other brands: Suzuki DL650 V-Strom if you like the GS look, if for street riding only, the Suzuki Bandit, either in the 600 version or the 1200 version. Best of luck. The Bandit comes as a standard or an S version; does have ABS, etc. Excellent reliability!!

Best of luck!!

[108625]

Tweety,

Sorry (and concerned) to hear of your problem. It is the first such case I've heard of, and would agree that the issue is probably computer related. With this level of technology involved, it seems like it will soon be neccessary to augment service departments with some level of specialist. Think about it, Yamaha R1s don't even have throttle cables, they're "fly by wire". At the least, it would make sense that the main computer be an easily replaceable component, so the local shop mechanics can just send it back for troubleshooting and you on your merry way.

I'd find it hard to believe they if couldn't find you a replacement S model somewhere in the lower 48. However, I wouldn't be surprised if someone just doesn't think it's worth their time to do so. Some people don't like math with variables. Customer satisfaction, and the good word of mouth (free advertising) and return business it generates are all intangible to them. If it's the dealer treating you this way, I'd consider giving a different one a chance. If it's higher ups in the company treating you this way, I encourage you to share a full account with the rest of us.

Incidently, my wife's very happy with her ST, but that's a subject for a different thread.

Good luck,
Bob

[PGlaves]

I have communicated directly with Tweety on this one.

Suffice it to say there is a failure of diagnostics going on.

My take is that, aside from the main power lead and the main ground lead, there are only three components of the motorycyle that could cause these exact intermittent symptoms.

1. Ignition switch
2. Canbus controller
3. Wiring harness to 1 or 2 above.

Were I a betting person I would bet on a broken wire in the harness - maybe near the ignition switch as has happened on other models where wire ties were placed at inappropriate locations and tied too tight.

The shop is at a disadvantage, as they always are with intermittent failures. But disconnecting everything from the diagnostic computer and wiggling wires with an ohm meter properly connected might go a long way with this one.

And if not the wiring - then the switch - and then the controller.

But that is time consuming and expensive - so maybe his lemon law remedy is the way to go - and then BMW can sort it out to salvage some value for themselves.

[wezul]

Could the desert heat have contributed at all to this, Paul?
(It's a dry heat, though) ;)

Good luck, Tweets!

[snoobar]

What about taking the bike down to Tucson, at Ironhorse BMW.

http://www.ironhorsemotorcycles.com/

[AZ-J]

What about taking the bike down to Tucson, at Ironhorse BMW.

http://www.ironhorsemotorcycles.com/

Nice thought. But I spoke with BMW Motorrad CSR Team Leader (nameless, for now) today who says once dealer confirms issue (and they tried to today) he would see about calling me tomorrow with a resolution.

So now, I can only wait to see what tomorrow brings. Meanwhile, though, with 15 days in shop on this out of 30 days (which will be 10/9) a new bike of greater or equal, or cashed out at cost, plus collateral charges, less a mileage fee, is looming large under our lemon law. And which is my choice.

[Raceydog]

It sounds to me like the problem is in the on/off switch. Surely that's been checked though.

[AZ-J]

It has. :banghead

[revkev]

Tweety...

Has your EWS device been replaced?

After mine was replaced on my 1200GS I had intermittent times when my bike would not engage electronically. Several tried to troubleshoot it with no success. The symptom was that the battery was dead, nothing. When I was out in Colorado a couple of weeks ago, at a BMW dealer, the symptom happened when the service manager was there. It ended up being a connection to the ignition switch that was not "totally" connected. I didn't see the technician working on it but I know the service managed jiggled the wire in a certain way, just slightly, and it would engage. The service manager asked me if it had ever failed while I was driving it, becoming totally dead. I said "no" and he said, "Well, this is pretty dangerous because it could stop dead it its tracks while driving it." It has not failed once in the 4,000 miles since it was fixed.

The reason I bring this up is the fact that my local dealer said that they another customer that had the same symptoms as mine following his EWS fix. They got his bike back in and went over, again, the ignition switch connections. Seems like that was the cure.

So, nothing against anyone who has tried to solve mine...it is extremely difficult to fix something when the intermittent failure doesn't happen when it is brought in.

IMHO the careful check of the ignition switch connections would be in order, with or without the EWS fix. Perhaps the connections are difficult to totally reengage once they have been taken apart. Just guessing.

[AZ-J]

EWS ring was replaced more than a month ago. Ignition "device" and battery now checked 4X by two different service techs, but anything is possible.

To tell you the truth, with what BMW asks my dealer to do, I no longer want them to have to fix my bike - they have tried that for more than a week, and some days already. Let's see how BMW comes to the table under the lemon law. They can give me a new bike, or cash the old one out, from the top down as the statute mandates.

[revkev]

Did you have the problem before the EWS fix?

If not, I would check/replace the connections to the ignition switch. Several eyes and mechanics missed the problem on mine. Might be tough to detect, even for the best experts.

[PGlaves]

Did you have the problem before the EWS fix?

If not, I would check/replace the connections to the ignition switch. Several eyes and mechanics missed the problem on mine. Might be tough to detect, even for the best experts.

Tweety - I agree. My first pm zeroed in on the ignition switch and its wires. There are very few things that can cause these symptoms. Of course, being intermittent doesn't help the tech's at all.

[AZ-J]

I did not have the issue before the EWS fix. And ignition wires have been tested, disconnected, reconnected, and nothing changes. Even tests that should show different resistance with and w/o other things connected, don't. The only explanation for this is corrupted code, me thinks. And Team Leader CSR Derek Anton, who yesterday promised me a call today, did not call. My first vmail to him was "call me." My second, probably after he left work, was "call me over weekend, or a lawsuit is coming".

[wezul]

Tweety1,
This sounds similar to RoadZen's issue, if you recall. It got uglier before it was finally brought to a happy ending. I wish the same for you, one way or another. My concern about a replacement is that you may "buy" into a whole new set of issues, beyond having to switch out all those nice farkles. Hang in there Tweets!!!
I would like to include myself amongst many others who are pulling for you. :thumb

[AZ-J]

Tweety1,
This sounds similar to RoadZen's issue, if you recall. It got uglier before it was finally brought to a happy ending. I wish the same for you, one way or another. My concern about a replacement is that you may "buy" into a whole new set of issues, beyond having to switch out all those nice farkles. Hang in there Tweets!!!
I would like to include myself amongst many others who are pulling for you. :thumb

Thanks, wezul, hopefully Anton is going to call Monday. But unless he does, NA is going to be surprised by what they have to pay.

[FredRydr]

NA is going to be surprised by what they have to pay.If it was me, I'd be sizing up which new 2009 BMW I am willing to accept, with or without cash. ;) Tick tick tick tick....

Fred

[wezul]

I understand and empathize with your frustration. I don't know how I would handle a similar situation. Two EWS swaps, one with a failure on the RT . . . right in fron t of the dealership and the F got the EWS treatment and the fuel vent thing as well. I do not pretend to understand the whole electronic environment on these modern machines, hey, I don't wrench on 'em, I just ride 'em. They either work or they're broke. There is an upside and a downside to machinery that requires computer evaluation.
Let's think good thoughts and worst case scenario is you get a new piece and BMW gets something to scrutinize and ultimately produce a better product.
How's that for a "RAH RAH"?

[AZ-J]

If it was me, I'd be sizing up which new 2009 BMW I am willing to accept, with or without cash. ;) Tick tick tick tick....

Fred


Love to, but show me the availability of an '09 F800S in the US, please!

[PAULBACH]

I saw an F800ST for sale at Max's.

Had my F650GST in for the 800 mile service yesterday. Cost for the entire service was $184. A lot less than I expected.

[AZ-J]

I hate to post this, but I just received a call from two AZ riding buddies, one of whom bought his wife an '09 F650GS a few weeks ago. The guy and wife are waiting for a two truck now in CA to tow her 650 in with symptoms nearly identical to mine right now.

And, on mine, it had no stall out during the tech's 150 mile loop last night, but also no lights, no turns signals, no horn, and no fuel gauge, and all connections check good. It's an e-gremlin all right, as the bike has a new ZFE which controls all of these, but gets its sync code from the BMS-K. Last but not least, the bike failed a resistance test with a relay in line and without on several components (what should be different is the same). That means the line is not sensing the in-line relay is in place, also proving there is an e-gremlin.

[ultracyclist]

Uh...guys..
I am about one week away from pulling the trigger on an '09 650gs.
Electrical gremlins! No thank you.
There now may be a Suzuki 650DL in my future.

[RoyB]

Just got back from a 2300 mile trip on my second DL650......an 07 with ABS (Approx $7000)........Bike has 17K with zero issues. Doesn't use a drop of oil, zero vibration, amazingly comfortable (my first DL650, an 04, went 30k plus and then I totaled it 3300 miles from home in Washington state. This bike also was flawless. never used a drop of oil, went like stink and I never tuned up anything in 30K)

I can't speak any higher about a motorcycle. Sure, it's a tool, and doesn't have the soul of my Rockster, but I contend the non BMW engined vertical twins are a little low on soul as are the K Bikes. A BMW 'MUST" be a boxer.............period...:thumb .

It's just a darn shame BMW has not figured out how to build a rock solid dependable motorcycle in mass. And when they build a turkey, they look the other way......a shame :dunno !

http://images26.fotki.com/v938/photos/3/36012/4899531/FENDER008-vi.jpg

[PGlaves]

but I contend the non BMW engined vertical twins are a little low on soul as are the K Bikes. A BMW 'MUST" be a boxer.............period...:thumb .


I heard this lament in 1985 when they built the K100 - aw the shame of it all. Then I bought a K75 which I rode for 18 yers and 370,000 nearly flawless miles. With or without soul it was dead-on reliable. I think it had a lot of "get it done" soul. I had to buy Voni some Boxers just so I still had something to tinker with:) :)

I think it's largely balderdash!! My K75RTP has just as much soul as my R1150R. And it takes a bit less routine maintenance, and doesn't break. Now that's my kind of soul. My K75RTP is actually Maytag White. What more can you ask.

[PAULBACH]

When your F650GS twin gets its first checkup there is a computer tweak waiting. Maybe that tweak will solve some of the problems.

[RoyB]

I guess we need to clarify "soul"..........A 1953 MG has gobs of "soul", but lets face it, it ain't no reliable long distance touring machine. A 1970 vintage Porsche has tons of "soul", but you better know how to work on them or be independently wealth.

A five foot handled shovel has zero soul. It's just a tool. It gets the job done...period.

I look at certain motorcycles like look at that shovel............Honda VFR, V Strom, Many Japanese cruisers, K75, K1200RS...........Amazing "machines", but a bit low on the "soul" quotient..........

Nortons, Airheads, Early Triumphs, Moto Guzzis, Agusta.......now we are talking soul.

But then again...Soul to one, might be a tool to others.........Most folks first motorcycle, no matter year or brand had a certain amount of soul............

But serious convincing is going to have to be forthcoming for me to move that the BMW vertical twins have soul...............And God help them if they turn out to be unreliable.......Hopefully it's just teething pains..............Because at what the fatherland is charging for them, compared to V Stroms, Versys, Tiger etc, they better turn out to be rock solid reliable.

[AZ-J]

For one whose left shoulder hurts with an indeterminate "too much work," the F800S had plenty of soul for me, because it went like stink, stopped level and accurately, rode smoothly on belt drive, and steered by pressing my knees against the twin spar frame, with my arms more for stabilization than pressing on bars. I could do this all because of its "balance"; partially due to a beneath-the-seat fuel tank contributing to a super low COG.

To me, being able to ride this bike 8 hours with miles of twisties defined its soul; too bad mine (and who knows whose others) had this problem. There are so many bikes I could not ride more than two hours because they are missing that balance, making them lack that kind of soul to me. For example, a K1200S that sits like the F800S, until I leaned it left, falls into the latter category for me; my left arm aches with its weight.

Whether any tool has "soul" is more by what you can and do, do with it. The trick here is knowing how to see that before the acquisition occurs. I did it with my car, and almost did it with this bike. Whether I can do it again, remains to be seen.

[SIBUD]

But serious convincing is going to have to be forthcoming for me to move that the BMW vertical twins have soul...............

Don't think anyone is trying.

I asked on another board if they belonged to MOA. If not, why not.

"The MOA always seemed somewhat elitist too."

"Always thought they were sort of snobbish too."

Isn't it interesting what others think of us?

[PGlaves]

I guess we need to clarify "soul"..........A 1953 MG has gobs of "soul", but lets face it, it ain't no reliable long distance touring machine. A 1970 vintage Porsche has tons of "soul", but you better know how to work on them or be independently wealth.

A five foot handled shovel has zero soul. It's just a tool. It gets the job done...period.

I look at certain motorcycles like look at that shovel............Honda VFR, V Strom, Many Japanese cruisers, K75, K1200RS...........Amazing "machines", but a bit low on the "soul" quotient..........

Nortons, Airheads, Early Triumphs, Moto Guzzis, Agusta.......now we are talking soul.

But then again...Soul to one, might be a tool to others.........Most folks first motorcycle, no matter year or brand had a certain amount of soul............

But serious convincing is going to have to be forthcoming for me to move that the BMW vertical twins have soul...............And God help them if they turn out to be unreliable.......Hopefully it's just teething pains..............Because at what the fatherland is charging for them, compared to V Stroms, Versys, Tiger etc, they better turn out to be rock solid reliable.

Roy - I know where you are coming from and don't disagree - but I do have to say that this is a curious place for this to come up.

Here we are in the midst of a thread related to a possibly terminal maintenance issue on a nearly new bike, talking about the virtues of "soul" on such stalwarts as early British bikes, MGs, and '70s vintage Porches.

Since I traded my R90/6 on my K75 in 1986 I haven't wanted anything to do with that kind of "soul."

[RoyB]

Paul, you are correct............Sorry for the hijack.........It's raining cats and dogs and I'd rather be riding.......:banghead

[SIBUD]

Roy - I know where you are coming from and don't disagree - but I do have to say that this is a curious place for this to come up.

Here we are in the midst of a thread related to a possibly terminal maintenance issue on a nearly new bike, talking about the virtues of "soul" on such stalwarts as early British bikes, MGs, and '70s vintage Porches.

Since I traded my R90/6 on my K75 in 1986 I haven't wanted anything to do with that kind of "soul."

Hijack

Sing along, you know the tune.

Paul's a soul man.

Paul's a soul man. :dance

Hijack off.

[AZ-J]

It is official as of today, BMW NA is buying back my F800S per AZ lemon law. :deal

On to the next, and I may have found such. :stick All I'll say on that now is it is NOT an ST.

BUT no further word on that until its done, and since 10/13-10/19 I am going to the BMW Motorrad Rally in Mexico (on a rental F650GS THUMPER) it won't/can't happen until after that. :bottle

It is goodbye to the F-twins thread, though. :bolt

[wezul]

I don't know whether to applaud :clap or cry :cry.
Not another S for you either?
Glad you got a solution anyway.
Send me your farkles! :laugh
I shall stay on and hold the fort.

[AZ-J]

I don't know whether to applaud :clap or cry :cry.
Not another S for you either?
Glad you got a solution anyway.
Send me your farkles! :laugh
I shall stay on and hold the fort.

So far, LED tail light (real bright) with white tail light lens to show off LED tail light best, is the only F800S specific farkle I have in hand. For sale in package @ 1/2 price, $75 + shipping. I am keeping my Crampbuster, Marsee tank bags, RKA tank and saddle bags (so far), and Battery Tender.

Skidmarx DB (gorgeous and functional) and Kaoko Throttle Control (so much better than the other one my dealership GM was convinced as I showed him what I wanted to remove to sell-off, and he volunteered to do it all, while I went away to the BMW Motorrad Mexico Rally), fuse block, Battery Tender lead and Horning mirror extenders all made available by dealer when I come back from Mexico Rally. I leave Monday, gone until 5/19. Bike sell off is scheduled for Wednesday 5/22. I'll have the rest of the parts by then.

Did I mention BMW also includes BMW parts or parts installed by dealer in the deal, so my yellow seat tail cover and the BMW zumo is being cashed out with the bike?

[wezul]

Sell?! Where's the love? :ha :stick
Is the rear lamp assembly identical on the S/ST?

[AZ-J]

Sell?! Where's the love? :ha :stick
Is the rear lamp assembly identical on the S/ST?


Folks on the f800riders forum are waiting for me to list these parts, and some are PM'ing already for available and unavailable parts (like the seat cover and others). So I shouldn't profit off what BMW won't reimburse?

Yes, the rear lamp is identical on the S/ST for 07 and 08, the EU 09 come with LED tail lights. Mine is a Moto Electrik Beacon unit. It is beautiful and the white lens shows the difference between the bright day use, and the super bright brake use better than the red lens. If you have the white turn signal lenses, the threesome look very good together. See picture on the photo thread, page 6, #87 all flashed lit up.

[wezul]

If you have the white turn signal lenses, the threesome look very good together.

And I do. Hmmmmmm.:brow

[AZ-J]

And I do. Hmmmmmm.:brow

Forgot to mention, remove two screws and hold on to them. Unplug bulb, plug in LED bank into same bulb receptacle. Place screw through lens, and guide on side of LED bank, do same with opposite side, screw in both screws. Switch key on and tap on rear brake pedal, and if in closed garage with door behind tail (as mine was) light up entire garage door in red.

[AZ-J]

Forgot to mention, remove two screws and hold on to them. Unplug bulb, plug in LED bank into same bulb receptacle. Place screw through lens, and guide on side of LED bank, do same with opposite side, screw in both screws. Switch key on and tap on rear brake pedal, and if in closed garage with door behind tail (as mine was) light up entire garage door in red.

Still here, with new forum name since my Tweety Bird is going, going, gone. No longer 1 with Tweety, so no longer Tweety1. Still the same me.

[Raevyn]

I'm up in Payson this week. Talk about amazing roads to ride. Been here before but I never saw the roads from a riders point of view but now that I have my own bike I see it. I would definitely need more experience to handle all the twisties. Except for the multitude of HD's up here, it would be a really nice ride if they allow beemers on the roads!

[AZ-J]

I'm up in Payson this week. Talk about amazing roads to ride. Been here before but I never saw the roads from a riders point of view but now that I have my own bike I see it. I would definitely need more experience to handle all the twisties. Except for the multitude of HD's up here, it would be a really nice ride if they allow beemers on the roads!

Just came back from a motorcycling adventure in Mexico, the Motorrad Mexico Rally. Nice twisties riding on a rental bike, from Guadalajara to Puerto Vallarta (estimated 600+ bikes).
I also rode from PV airport to San Blas for an overnight first, from there to Tapalpa for an overnight, and on to two days of Rally festivities in GDL before the 2 final days in PV.

Blasted! :bluduh

Those Payson roads BTW are great, but AZ 191 is better.

[Raevyn]

Those Payson roads BTW are great, but AZ 191 is better.

I'll pass that along to my friends who ride there. Thanks! :nod

Sounds like you had a fabulous trip!