2007 R1200RT ESA video: Is mine functioning correctly?

[davemon]

If you own one of these setups please watch this vido of me starting up my bike on the stand in neutral and then pressing and holding the ESA button until it switches and then letting go and then pressing again and so on as I cycle through the 3 settings. Does yours work just like this or does it flash for a few seconds and then go into a steady indicator of the new mode?

http://davespragg.smugmug.com/gallery/5456182_ZAxTT/#333599476_5JSEo

On mine it has always switched instantly from one mode to the next (at least on the indicator) for the shock damping but for the spring preload that I am changing in this video I could swear it used to flash for a few secs as it went to the next mode and that I could feel the bike change height just a tad.

Dave

[Raceydog]

That's the way mine works too.

[davemon]

I can leave my display for as long as I want and it never flashes, rather after a bit it times out and goes back to the normal display. So I removed the seat and watched carefully when making changes and I can't see any changes to the WP Spring length or distances relative to the shock or any other part. Can anyone take a video of the spring/shock during a change that shows something moving? If you do please state if the bike is weighted (on the sidestand) or is on the centerstand.

(posted this on BMWSportTouring too)

I want to prove it's working or not working as I used to be able to feel the height change and I no longer can but the dealer says it is fine.

I do think the shock damping is working as I can easily feel the difference down my test road. Right now though the bike feels overly soft when I ride with my wife regardless of the preload setting for the spring.

Dave

[jonmill]

I'm not sure I understand the issue here. On my '05, I can press the ESA button repeatedly to cycle through the settings--comfort, normal, and sport. When I get to the one I want to select, I hold the button down until it sets. If you don't hold the button, it will just revert to whatever was the initial setting.

[dorongrudo]

To Jonmill.
Don't remember having to hold down after changing. If memory servrs me right - I change and let go. When I hit the button again, the new setting is displayed. Will check again today.

[ylexot]

On my GS the icon flashes while the preload adjusts and I can feel it move. It stays constant when it gets to the right setting.

I just watched the video. I don't think you're waiting long enough for it to start adjusting. It's going to be solid for a couple seconds before starting to adjust just in case you push the button again.

[davemon]

I went out and tested it again this morning. After tapping the ESA button to bring up the display I can hold the button down for a 2 count and it changes modes. If I then let go and wait it stays on the new picture with no flashing until the display times out and goes back to normal. I also removed the seat and watched the spring and shock closely from the top, bottom, and side and I see nothing moving at all... either this thing is snake oil or it's broken. It used to flash and I never had a software change done on it and now it doesn't. I can't beleive I had the bike gone for 2 weeks at the dealer and they didn't fix this. :(

Someone is going to send me a video of the spring preload adjustment in action and once I see that I will scrutinize mine to see if anything is moving at all.

Thanks for all the replies!

Dave

PS (Jonmill: That is for the shock damping and not the spring preload. My shock damping is working fine and I can easily feel the difference when in use.)

[dorongrudo]

I can leave my display for as long as I want and it never flashes, rather after a bit it times out and goes back to the normal display. So I removed the seat and watched carefully when making changes and I can't see any changes to the WP Spring length or distances relative to the shock or any other part.

Checked my 05 12RT again. Cannot see any movement with the bike on the center stand. NOWWW I get paranoid. Will probably take it to the dealer for a check - unless someone can come up with a way to make sure it works (or not)

[medic319]

Here you go. Sorry that it took so long, but I had to figure out why I could not play the video on my computer. My computer did not like the video as an mp4, how it comes out of my phone, so I had to rename it. It appears that your ESA is not working right, as you know, or you would not have posted.

Here it is: http://mckinneyphoto.net/motorcycle/VIDEO_013.3gp

As requested, my bike is on the sidestand.

[davemon]

Thanks muchly! That is what I remember my ride used to do.

Any enterprising folks who have video of the spring preload adjuster actually moving stuff?

Dave

[TomfromMD]

My '06 RT's ESA worked perfectly for 2 1/2 years and then exhibited the same symptoms. As I had most recently ridden with my wife, it was now locked in the 2-up preload position and although the damping changes operated as normal, it was difficult to tell riding solo due to the excessive preload.

1. Dealer checked it and reported no computer faults and since the icon was changing, assumed it was OK.
2. Returned to the dealer after riding it for a couple of weeks and had the tech compare the lack of height change to a new RT. Dealer said they had never encountered this problem before and emailed BMWNA.
3. Returned to dealer for the computer procedure recommended by BMWNA - No improvement. Dealer contacted BMWNA again.
4. Dealer authorized to install new rear shock unit - returned to dealer to check whether existing shock had a 2 wire or 3 wire connection. Dealer ordered new shock.
5. Returned to dealer who installed new rear shock unit and did a software re-flash.
6. Suspension is now better than new.
7. 2 oddities as a result of the re-flash - As the tech indicated, the ambient temperature read -40oF when I left the dealer and the snowflake (ice warning symbol) was flashing. After about a minute, the temp also began to flash and increment upwards with each flash. After a few miles, it got to the correct temp of 85o, stopped flashing and has been fine ever since. Also, the OBC MPG reading seems to be a bit higher, so either I'm getting better mileage, or the 3% error has increased.

BTW, my dealer indicated that if it were not under covered under warranty, the rear shock would cost around $1,600 + 2~3 hrs. labor.
While I cannot fault my dealer, it seems that BMWNA should have a procedure in place for this failure without requiring the customer to make so many trips to the dealer - although I did read online of another instance in England which was apparently solved with just a software change. It seems that the problem is disrupted communication with the shock, but the shock cannot be dissembled to fix it - it must be replaced.

Tom

[TomfromMD]

I'm not sure I understand the issue here. On my '05, I can press the ESA button repeatedly to cycle through the settings--comfort, normal, and sport. When I get to the one I want to select, I hold the button down until it sets. If you don't hold the button, it will just revert to whatever was the initial setting.
Not quite. The damping settings (comfort, normal, and sport) are accessed with a normal button push. Pushing the button will cycle thru them and the last one selected will become the new setting. Although the manual describes an icon flash, it doesn't - but the setting changes.

In order to set preload, the motor must be running but the bike must be stationary. Here is where you must hold the button for a couple of seconds to call up the solo rider, solo with luggage, and two-up presets. Again, cycling thru them will pre-select the new setting - but the new setting will not go into effect for about 5". When it does, the icon will flash (see the posted video) and the height of the bike will be altered.
Tom

[109398]

Thanks for posting this guys- my '08 RT had a bad clutch from the factory. Since they disassembled the bike my ESA has been doing the same thing- I can select the icon for 2up, single rider, etc...but the icon no longer flashes and the suspension height remains at a constant height. I brought it back once and they did a software reset which made the icons change...but the preload adjustment has not been working since. The dealer told me it was working fine because the icon changes- even though I told them it used to flash and I could feel the height change. When I first had the bike I could sit with feet flat on the ground in the single rider position but I was on the balls of my feet in the 2up setting- not I'm flat-footed regardless of setting and it feels mushy w/the extra weight of a passenger. I'm going to another dealer to see if they are smarter than the first. I'm starting to wish I had saved some money by going with manual preload!

[davemon]

I explained my frustration regarding my bike still not being functional and my dealer asked when I could bring it in.

I took 1/2 the day off to ride up and have it diagnosed and while at first the service manager didn't think it was broken and had me bouncing on it with the different settings (he could tell a difference and I could not but wasn't certain) he found that another bike was working and he could feel it move and see it flash which mine wasn't doing. Oddly he had me doubting myself a bit but I could not feel a difference after changing the preload and bouncing on the seat. The tech then did some of the BMW bulletin items and made it work again and it seems fine now and I can see the dash indicator flash while it changes, feel the bike move under me, and if on the side I can see the spring get compressed or released by the electric motor hidden inside the shock. I am VERY happy that it is finally working again and happy that the dealer now understands this as there are plenty of other folks out there with non-functional ESA including many who don't even know theirs is not working. I am also stoked that my machine didn't require any parts to get working again... it took less tahn an hour once they were convinced it was broken.

If you can't feel the bike move when your weight is on the seat after you change the spring preload setting then yours is not working. If the display doesn't start flashing about 2 or 3 seconds after you stop on a new setting (this is when you will feel it start and stop changing height) yours is not working. As a lot of folks seems confused I will state again that this is for the spring preload only which is the rider only, rider and bags with stuff, rider and pillion setting and it can only be changed when the engine is running and the bike is in neutral. The sidestand or center stand can be down.

Dave

[ylexot]

Glad it's working now. So, I take it that they updated the software? I wonder if disconnecting the battery for a while would have reset the ESA.

[davemon]

They reset the part of the computer that controls ABS, ESA and the like. ZFE might be the name but I am not sure. There were no software updates as I already had them (the bike was broken, got updates and was still broken but they said it was fine, and then went back in days later).

Dave

[109398]

thanks Dave for the wicked pissah insight from Beantown. I'm taking mine in this week- and I'm encouraged that yours was fixed by what seemed to be a computer reset. I'll let the dealer know about the service bulletins as well. It's funny- I have been doubting myself as you stated because I had allowed the dealer to convince me it was fine. He did the sitting test too- and I think the only difference that could be felt was dampening...he confused this with preload as a difference was noticed even though height remained the same.

[davemon]

You are quite welcome. I think the other factory bulletin was a set of instructions on how to apply current directly to the spring preload adjuster to move it... maybe just to test it and maybe to see if it is just stuck, I don't know.

If you stand next to your bike and squat down some you can find an angle where you can see the shock clearly. I imagine this is trickiest on an RT like mine as we have more plastic than a GS, R, or ST but you should be able to see it. My rear suspension unit has a black shock inside with white letter and stickers on it (indicating it was built by WP). The contrast makes it very easy to see the spring get compressed or uncompressed. Make sure you show the other person how to tap the ESA (with the engine running and the bike in neutral) button to bring up the ESA info on the display and then press and hold the ESA button for 2 seconds until it changes to the next mode. After that there is a pause for maybe 2 seconds and then the new mode that was just selected will start flashing slowly (see the video that another member posted here if confused).

At this point if you are already in place looking at the spring/shock unit you will be able to see the spring coils change distance from each other with ease. If it isn't moving it's broken and don't be sold otherwise. Anything else is snake oil. ;)

Dave

[109398]

Ok. So I dropped the bike off yesterday. The mechanic (who is good) took a look at the bike and observed what I have been observing- the icon is selected and it flashes once quickly then becomes solid, and the bike's suspension doesn't move...with one exception. He thought he saw it move. He did it a few times and was unable to see it move- but he thought it might have been moving. I described the video on this post and told him that mine used to blink like that and the ride height slowly increased/decreased while the icon was blinking. I explained to him that it stopped doing this when my bike was taken apart at another dealer to replace a faulty clutch assembly. He said they are constantly changing the software on these bikes- and that sometimes a brand new icon appears after an upgrade that none of the techs have seen- and have to contact BMW to find out what it does. His thought was that they may have changed the ESA software so that it no longer blinks slowly as it does in the video- and that perhaps the latest version makes it only blink once. When I asked him why we couldn't see a change in ride height he thought that the suspension may have settled after the break-in period (bike has 1008 miles) and it was less noticeable. He's a friend of mine and takes me seriously- and will look into it further when he has a chance to get the bike on his workstand but I'm a little concerned that I'm right and he's wrong! Any thoughts? Dave- does your bike now work like the one in the video on this post- or does it blink once and adjust? Is the ride height change undoubtedly occurring- or is it a subtle change that is difficult to perceive? Thanks for the help. -Jay

[cjack]

but I'm a little concerned that I'm right and he's wrong! Any thoughts? Jay

You're right and he's wrong.

[davemon]

109398,

I am sorry to say that your story sounds like mine... regular customer standing in parking lot with supposedly experienced and knowledgeable person changing the settings and bouncing on the seat say "yeah, I feel it... it got firmer" and so on. You feel like an idiot and almost or do imagine you can feel the change too. I never had this kind of experience with Honda dealers and so far 3/4 transactions with my new BMW dealer have been like this one. Bummah!

My bike flashes just like the other guy's video now. I think I described the action above in the thread. Start bike, put in neutral, tap button to bring up ESA display, press and hold ESA button for a 2 count and it switches to next mode, repeat previous step until at the setting you want then wait 2 seconds, the display of that setting you want will start flashing and do so for a few seconds. During this your spring preload adjuster will either increase preload and squish the spring some or decrease it expand the spring some. This can be easily seen if you watch the spring closely and your vision is normal. My bike did this before and after the latest software updates as does every bike in their showroom.

Springs do "settle" some after a fresh install but anything beyond 10 miles and 1 week is going to be so minimal that no one could tell unless the springs are complete junk and are actual breaking down from use. Trust me I have put several sets of coil-overs on track cars and my race car and after 5 miles of driving the car never changed 0.25" as I had to check to make sure I had X number of inches to be legal for my race class. This was always measured with the same tools on the same tech shed floor and it never changed except when a polyurethane bushing slipped out of it's spot and was jammed sideways and raised my ride height 0.3".

If this dealer has any other machine with ESA then start it up and follow the instructions above and see what I mean. BMW should train their techs better than this before calling them a "tech".

I really do LOVE my RT but I am considering going back to Honda and making a tourer with hard bags out of a sportbike that is fairly comfortable. I would add Helibars and such like I did on my CBR1100XX with Givis and power plugs. I would add heated handlegrips this time though for certain!

Dave

[TR250Tom]

Jay,

just another data point; my R1200R got the latest software update about two months ago as part of the 6K service, and the operation of the ESA was unchanged. I get the same slow flashing as before, and a noticable change in preload/ride height.

Cheers, Tom

[109398]

Thanks Tom and Dave- I'll head over there today and relay your feedback.

[109398]

Update- dealer will be installing a new rear shock on my RT (with 1011 miles) this week. Thanks to Davemon for starting this thread and others who have replied for arming me with the info I needed to argue my way through this repair.

[davemon]

These are fantastic systems when working and I will be having Works Performance parts put on my RT when warrenty is up and these are worn out. They will let me spec the springs and such and build it all in with the same factory adjustability and factory controls. I am really happy with this setup and since mine was stuck on the rider only or rider and bags it is a revelation to ride two-up now with the correct preload. I ride 50% of my miles two-up and the the other half solo so this is awesome!

My track bike is set up better but my parts hurt riding on Boston roads even with 30-31 psi in the tires. ;) I don't even want to think about two-up. LOL!

Glad yours will be working again!

Dave

[109398]

Thanks Dave. Got my RT back today with the new shock just in time for a 3000 mile road trip with my fiance and lots of gear. Works great now. I'll probably do what you're planning to do when the warranty is up. That's good info- I was planning on a set of manually adjustable Ohlins; it's good to hear there are options available. Hopefully the Works Performance setup will be a little less costly than the BMW counterparts- the shop told me the BMW ESA replacement rear shock assembly alone cost about $2k!

[lagator]

If you press and hold the ESA button and cycle between the icons for 1 up, 1 up w/luggage, and 2 up the icon will flash and you will feel the height of the bike raising or lowering. The bike must be running and in neutral and to really feel the difference you should be sitting on the bike. If the icon does not flash and you do not feel the height change then it is not working. Been there, done that. My ESA went out while at the MOA rally in Vermont when I had about 7,000 miles on it. It was stuck on the 1 up icon and would not flash or change. I took it to the Max BMW tent and had them check it. They tried to do a computor reset but it did not work. I rode it back home that way and took it to my dealer. They tried many times to do software and computor updates none of which worked. After several months and their contacting the BMW factory service engineer many times and being told that they had never had this type of problem before the service engineer finally came out to the dealership. He and the tech worked on my bike over 8 hours one day after which the service engineer informed me that it was definitely the ZFE computor that was not working properly. He had one overnighted to the dealership. The next day the tech installed the new ZFE which did not solve the problem. He then had a new rear shock unit overnighted and installed it the next day. The ESA started working properly, in fact it had never worked that well before since it was new. From day one after purchasing the bike the icon would flash two or three times then stop and you could just barely feel the height change. After the fix the icon now flashes many times and you can very noticeably feel the height change. By the way when I first took my bike to the dealership the tech told me that he was having a problem with the ESA on another bike and could not get it fixed. He had changed the rear shock unit but it still would not work. The problem was that he did not initialize the new shock, so the ZFE did not know there was a new shock installed and still showed a fault. After changing the ZFE on my bike my wife and I took a trip to the smokies. One very cold morning I tried using my heated grips but they did not work. I took it back to the dealership upon our return. The tech changed the grips but they still did not work. He had to change the ZFE again before they started working. Luckily all of this was done under warranty. My bike is now less than 2 1/2 years old but with nearly 43,000 miles on it. I hate to think what it would cost me if this problem arose again. I don't think the dealership techs and BMWNA are always on the same page. I don't know if it is lack of proper training of the techs or BMWNA hasseling dealerships for warranty work when they don't want to admit to a problem. And in my particular case the factory "service engineer" was of no use at all. I had the feeling that he was trying to BS me and even got angry with me because I was upset about not being able to get my bike fixed. I performed a verbal attitude adjustment on him after he really got me PO'd and did not have any more problems with him after that. Enough venting, all is working well now. I just returned from Wyoming and the rally, no problems. I hope it remains this way. Just for the record I am still loyal to the brand and have a very good relationship with my dealership.

[109398]

Lagator- thanks for the input; I went through a similar series of frustrations. In my case I bought my bike from a dealer that I usually don't work with- they just happened to have the options I wanted and were unwilling to trade bikes with the dealer I'm used to working with. When I had a few warranty issues I allowed the unfamiliar dealership to try to fix them and it didn't pan out so well. I finally went back to my usual dealer and requested their master tech, who is a good friend of mine, and was able to get it sorted. I think there's an issue of training here. A BMW tech once mentioned that it's not uncommon to have a new icon appear after a software upgrade- one that noone has seen before or knows what it stands for. They have to research it and will often find that there was a new service bulletin that came out that the mechanic either didn't know of- or have time to study. I think these guys are swamped during the riding season and have to work as many bikes into the schedule as they can to afford to get through the winters when the work slows down. Some of the techs have to take voluntary layoffs during the winters. This means they are too busy to train during the busy season and not employed by the dealership in the off season when they would have the time to catch up on training. Most guys have to work full time during the off season so even voluntary training is next to impossible. What it all boils down to is there's a heckuva lot of OJT- meaning guys like you and me are the guinea pigs that have to go through what we just went through so that the "next guy" gets it fixed right the first time. Hopefully we'll be that "next guy" next time!