If Flying Bricks are so reliable, how come they don't have a GS model?

[baldwithglasses]

If The Flying Bricks are so reliable, how come they don't have a GS model?

Seems to me that that reliability would make for a good round-the-world bike.

Enlighten me, please.

[mrich12000]

:scratch Production stopped a few years ago. No forsight,:scratch :lurk But if you want to make your own look here.



http://www.geocities.com/fwarner_au/mc_things/75gsphotos.html


:whistle

Thank you Frank Warner / credit//

[Markus]

my opinion: the inherent differences in the Twin Vs Multi-Inline engine's power. The way the power is delivered, or put down to the ground is better for offroad/dualsporting.

Does any manufacturer make an multi-inline for offroad?

Just like Flattrack/Dirttrack racing...Singles and twins. ;)

[PGlaves]

my opinion: the inherent differences in the Twin Vs Multi-Inline engine's power. The way the power is delivered, or put down to the ground is better for offroad/dualsporting.

Does any manufacturer make an multi-inline for offroad?

Just like Flattrack/Dirttrack racing...Singles and twins. ;)

The K75 motor reaches 90% of peak torque at 2000 rpm and has a very flat torque curve from there till it drops off near red line. Geared properly this motor would be a great dual-purpose bike motor. Since peak torque isn't as high as some twins, the gearing would matter for rock climbing and stump pulling.

[username]

moving this over to k-bikes...

[osbornk]

The K75 motor reaches 90% of peak torque at 2000 rpm and has a very flat torque curve from there till it drops off near red line. Geared properly this motor would be a great dual-purpose bike motor. Since peak torque isn't as high as some twins, the gearing would matter for rock climbing and stump pulling.

I don't think the K75 would be a good dual-purpose choice. My K75 and K100 needed a lot of RPMS to make good power and low speeds were not where they were happy. They came to life at 80MPH or better. The airhead is much easier to handle in low speed situations because of the heavier flywheel. The K bike is very easy to stall due at low RPMs under load.

[motoedde]

If The Flying Bricks are so reliable, how come they don't have a GS model?

Seems to me that that reliability would make for a good round-the-world bike.

Enlighten me, please.

What makes you think a GS moniker equates to more reliable or tougher? Marketing literature and reality can be very different.
The K is just as tough and has handled an around the world bike trip...

[baldwithglasses]

Let me clarify, then:

If the K motor's so durable, reliable, etc., why is it not used for dual-sport or off-road useage?

[motoedde]

Let me clarify, then:

If the K motor's so durable, reliable, etc., why is it not used for dual-sport or off-road useage?

Apologies...let me post a few pics to help.

Crossing the Sahara...the heart of it.
http://www.motoedde.com/PicasaAlbums/Leaving_Algeria/target11.html

Crossing Mongolia...the Western part.
http://www.motoedde.com/PicasaAlbums/Western_Mongolia/target19.html

Siberia...heading up to Tynda...
http://www.motoedde.com/PicasaAlbums/Siberia_the_Ride/target17.html

The K can be used for dual-sporting and is very capable for RTWing, with minimum farkling about.

So again, what makes you think a GS moniker equates to a more reliable or tougher bike?

HTH

[username]

i think his point is, why hasnt bmw made a gs version of the kbike?

[kbasa]

Let me clarify, then:

If the K motor's so durable, reliable, etc., why is it not used for dual-sport or off-road useage?

The drivetrain's too long, especially on the K100s, IMHO, to make a decent off road bike. The swingarm would need to be significantly longer to provide the suspension travel you need for an off road bike, which would make the bike even longer.

There are better powerplants for this duty. The question isn't whether you can, but rather, whether you should.

[robsryder]

The first time I rode a Triumph Tiger I thought - K75 meets the GS.... chain drive tho on the Tiger.

[baldwithglasses]

This is no indictment for/against motor design; I simply haven't read that many adventure-style (read: long-term endurance) rides using K bikes.

Is it that Airhead owners are so wedded to valve adjustments, spline lube techniques, and the like that they're simply noisier?

I don't know much about the k-motors, and I'm willing to learn.

[Gilly]

Same reason they don't put a Corvette motor in a dump truck, waste of a perfectly good motor.
Gilly

[Acejones]

Hmmm...
The imponderable why.
Why can't you lick your elbow ?:dunno

[roy]

Not an expert on dual purpose bikes but would the water cooled feature of the brick be detriment? I.e added weight

Roy

[wndsrfr]

Same reason they don't put a Corvette motor in a dump truck, waste of a perfectly good motor.
Gilly

Actually, I think that they put a dump truck motor into the Corvette
back in the '60s.....

[MCRyder]

Maybe not a R12GS, but ya gotta admit it's interesting:

http://www.geocities.com/fwarner_au/mc_things/tnk75loaded.jpg

I like how he describes what kind of riding his K75G/S is meant for:

"This bike is not intended for tight 'trials' type work, nor was the R80G/S... it is intended for touring dirt roads where a normal road bike has problems."

Pretty cool :thumb

[GregFeeler]

Here you go - some shots of "K75GS" models. Not responsible for what else you might find on ADVRider. :bolt

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=136948

[baldwithglasses]

Any other reasons why one doesn't use a K motor in an off-road tourer?

Do the K bikes have stouter transmissions than the Airheads or the Oilheads?

[Beemer01]

Did Bald actually open Motoeddies links? This guy crossed the Sahara on a K75. Without a support team on a truck.;)

I rest my case - can they do it? Yep. Was the entire design optimized for off roading? Nope, designed for the highway.

The engine is only one element of the entire equation - the gearing, the suspension fore and aft all matter too.

And honestly, I'm dim on this, but I don't recall the whole dual use thing being as big back 26 years ago when the Flying Brick design was developed. BMW was working to develop a successor to the twin cylinder boxer design and to compete against the surging Japanese sport bike brands.

Obviously they did their homework well.:german

[mrich12000]

:lurk :scratch :drink :whistle

[flash412]

<img src="http://www.lprs.com.au/k75gs/right.jpg" border="0" />
<br />
<img src="http://www.lprs.com.au/k75gs/left.jpg" border="0" />
<br />
Nice front brakes
<br />
<img src="http://www.lprs.com.au/k75gs/front.jpg" border="0" />
<br />
Nice rear shock....
<br />
<img src="http://www.lprs.com.au/k75gs/rear.jpg" border="0" />
<br />
Front end.....
<br />
<img src="http://www.lprs.com.au/k75gs/screen_etc.jpg" border="0" />

[kbasa]

Did Bald actually open Motoeddies links? This guy crossed the Sahara on a K75. Without a support team on a truck.;)

I rest my case - can they do it? Yep. Was the entire design optimized for off roading? Nope, designed for the highway.

The engine is only one element of the entire equation - the gearing, the suspension fore and aft all matter too.

And honestly, I'm dim on this, but I don't recall the whole dual use thing being as big back 26 years ago when the Flying Brick design was developed. BMW was working to develop a successor to the twin cylinder boxer design and to compete against the surging Japanese sport bike brands.

Obviously they did their homework well.:german

BMW was well down the road with winning the Dakar races 25 years ago. They were campaigning a big twin sponsored by Marlboro and piloted by folks like Gaston Rahier.

Can you see anyone doing this with a Kbike based ride? :ha

http://www.giacomoferri.it/Racconti/Gaston_Rahier_1999/Rahier_BMW.jpg

[motoedde]

BMW was well down the road with winning the Dakar races 25 years ago. They were campaigning a big twin sponsored by Marlboro and piloted by folks like Gaston Rahier.

Can you see anyone doing this with a Kbike based ride? :ha


You're comparing apples and oranges. Adventure touring/RTWing is different than rallye racing.

When you're adventure touring, the point, route and independence of your travels is defined by the rider and can cover just as challenging terrain as Rallye racing. I discussed this when I ran into a couple guys preparing for the rallye while on my trip, spent time with Rallye security vehicles en route to Timbouctou, overnighted in a bivouac, etc.

Rallye racing is completely different and the bikes involved in that race are nothing like the bikes you or I can purchase or farkle up without great expense. Ask any privateer involved....I know a few and can pass on their emails if you care.

BMW won a couple Dakars with bikes that were highly modified but for the most part, the Japanese and KTM's have pretty much kicked ass.
Check wikipedia list of winners...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dakar_Rally

Also, most privateers have chosen Jap or KTM's as their choice...its amazing how when one has to put their money and life down on the table, how simple our options become.

BUT back to the original question of this thread, the K-75 is a bike that has the guts to adventure tour with minimum mods through some pretty tough terrain. The tranny, motor, water cooling, electronics/electricals, suspension are as solid as any other bike built....but it does have a its weak points...again, just as any other bike that's been built.

Why BMW chose not to modify it for more adventure touring is something they could only answer BUT my guess is probably because the adventure touring market was very niche market in the late 80's...and the cost of development for modification wasn't worth it as they were concurrently introducing an F650 at that same time for that niche to match the Jap's and KTM who were kicking BMW's ass in the 90s and beyond. So BMW didn't even think the airhead/oilhead motors could compete anymore, so why expect that of a K that was introduced many years after Gaston's last win?

[erickson9502]

Here you go - some shots of "K75GS" models. Not responsible for what else you might find on ADVRider. :bolt

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=136948

"SUPER" I wish they had all the specs on how he made that. I have a K100 I would give a shot doing something like that.

[crgrbrts]

Just wondering -- if the Wright Whirlwind J-5 aircraft engine is so reliable, why doesn't BMW use it on the new F800GS??

Craig
in Merry-Land

[baldwithglasses]

Beemer01-

I saw the photos. I'm impressed. But I'm wondering why that platform never was embraced like the boxer, or the Aprilla/Rotax F plants.

crgrbrts-

C'mon, chief- everybody knows the old Junkers Jumo 211
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Jumo_211) would be a better choice! But seriously...



I'm professing my ignorance of all that is k-bike. For instance, what's the difference between the K-bike transmissions and the R-bike transmissions? Do they share the same paralever/ monolever compatabilities?

How much is swappable between the two? And thus, what could one rob from a boxerbike to a kbike to make it a longer-travel, off-road-capable machine?

[st3ryder]

The K bikes, are the more expensive and better performing bikes in the Beemer line-up. Why is a boxer model not the fastest or "top of the line" if they're superior? I can't figure that out. ;)

[smilingcouple]

I have a 85 K100 with over 100K. I have raced professionally flat track, endurance and motocross. The K engine is reliable and I am sure capable for off road and racing. The power band would be great but why do you need those types of top speed and RPM's. Off road touring fuel consumption becomes and issue. Lets face it the K's are not that fuel efficient. The issue comes down to cooling an inline 4 and weight. With fuel injected motors they require a electronic brain that might cause problems on off road situations.

[Dennie]

In so much as (should that be one word?) the K is liquid cooled and multi cyl., the new f800gs is a venture in that direction. I think with the right frame and swingarm/drive the k75 would make a unique gs. look at the triumph tiger, sounds like a neat project.

[bandman]

Completely different bike and style of riding. The K12RS or S are sport touring bikes meant for the open road. The GS as you probably now is both on/off road but the KRS is purely open road with a great deal of fun behind the grips. Both bikes are out of sight. Each for a different purpose.;) ;)

[mrich12000]

Just wondering -- if the Wright Whirlwind J-5 aircraft engine is so reliable, why doesn't BMW use it on the new F800GS??

Craig
in Merry-Land
:stick why not use a series 60 Detroit

:lurk :beer :gerg :ca :hide

[jcridge]

I noticed no one has actually said it, so I will.......BECAUSE.

[john1691]

We had a couple K1200RS's off road today, well, dirt road anyway. We were running around near the Susquehanna River, when our nice twisty river road goes from pavement to gravel to wet dirt. After 100' or so a sign was posted that read "Pavement ends".......Really, thanks for the heads up! I mentioned to my riding buddy we need some GS's, and we laughed and were both glad we hadn't wasted any time washing the bikes before the ride. :p

[Gilly]

I think the real question is; If GS's are so dependable, why didn't BMW put a Brick in 'em hmmmmm????

[Becky973]

Why would I want to take my K1200Rs off road, went I'm having so much fun on the road and track with it.!!:scratch


Becky