'07 R1200RT Engine Pinging

[bthomson]

I bought a new RT a few months ago. One of my hesitations about buying this bike is the 12.0:1 compression ratio. I know it has knock sensors and that the computer will automatically retard timing, presumably to prevent "pinging" (preignition).

Anyway, I bought it and I love it, except for the pinging, which occurs at heavy throttle right up to redline, i.e., the retardation is not effective! I had it in to the dealer at 4,000 miles and am told all is OK. The motor was ridden hard from the start, and does not use oil -- I actaully didn't need to add any from 800 miles to 4,000 miles.

Here's the thing: I live in Canada and can get 94 octane (Chevron). Almost no pinging with this. However I usually ride in the Western US, where in most places you can only get 91 octane. Here, the pinging is terrible. Note that the manual says to use minimum 95 octane.

One can only wonder why BMW sells a motorcycle which needs 95 octane in a area where you can only get 91.

I will take another run at the dealer, to be sure that the knoch sensors are working properly, but I have spoken to BMW Canada, and am not hopeful.

Does the manual provided with US sold bikes say 95 octane too? Had anyone had similar problems? Has anyone found a solution (eg. thicker head gaskets to reduce compression)?

[ltnelly4you]

check and see if you are getting ethanol in your higher octane gas. That will make it ping.

[TomfromMD]

The manual for my U.S. '06RT specifies 98 Research octane which is equivalent to 93 pump octane in the U.S. and Canada. It also states that 91 ROZ (about 87 pump octane) may be used with reduced performance which is defined as 101hp instead of the normal 110.

Using 93 pump octane, my bike will occasionally give a few pings under hard throttle, which quickly disappear as the timing is retarded by the knock sensor. 10% ethanol doesn't seem to affect this one way or the other although I notice about a 5% reduction in fuel economy.
Tom

[Stopwatch]

Two easy, non-tech "solutions" come to mind:

First, try some octane enhancer from your local auto parts store. Boosting the octane as spec'd on the bottle of enhancer may solve the ping.

Second, if that fails, push your ear plugs in farther, <g> ride, and enjoy.

[kbasa]

I never get pinging with my RT, even running our crummy CA gas.

[Easy]

I never get pinging with my RT, even running our crummy CA gas.

I've never had a problem.

You might let the dealer take a look at the ignition system. There might be something wrong with the ignition programming.

Easy :german

[marcopolo]

I've never noticed any pinging either, no matter what I run (I normally run "premium").

[gulfcoastbeemer]

I've never noticed any pinging either, no matter what I run (I normally run "premium").

+1

[carockwell]

If this was a BMW car they would think that either your knock sensor is mounted incorrectly (overtorqued), or the timing was set incorrectly (almost impossible to do). There is some error in your bike that is causing the computer to think it is reading a normal signal from the knock sensor. Usually this is an overtorqued or under torqued knock sensor. There could also be some unknown software update.

[bthomson]

It sounds from all the replies like there is something wrong with my particular bike, no matter what the dealer told me. Fortunately I have a choice of two dealers here, so will try the other one next.

BTW, octane booster didn't really cure the problem. I used it for several thousand miles, just hoping it was helping a bit.

Funny thing, the bike I road tested before I bought mine was pinging like crazy. the dealer said it was becasue it had regular grade fuel in it. Maybe no one hears this but me! But when it sounds like there are marbles in the cylinders....:banghead

[TomfromMD]

As you should be able to run 91 with little or no pinging, let us know when it is sorted out what the problem was.
Tom

[guzzidave1998]

As most of you guys are up north or west I`m not sure if it makes any differance here in Florida I run regular in all 3 of my BMW`s a R12RT a R12GS and a K12 rs all the time none of them ping a bit ya guys think elevation could do it ????:dunno

[bthomson]

Elevation didn't seem to be a factor with mine. Sure glad to hear that others don't all have the same problem -- helps me believe I can get it resolved.

[macdaddybmwr1200rt]

I live in the Midwest and have an '06 RT. I normally use Premium, but I have even put Regular Unleaded 87octane in it at times. Now I normally run it on Plus which is 89octane, but 10 percent ethanol. None of these fuels produced pinging with my bike (13,000 miles).

[gulfcoastbeemer]

...BTW, octane booster didn't really cure the problem. I used it for several thousand miles, just hoping it was helping a bit.

Are you absolutely sure what you are hearing is a pre-ignition ping?

The airbox of these bikes has certain sound to it; not a true metallic pinging sound, but a sound that you could mistaken for mild pre-ignition.

[kenmat]

The RT that I rode at the Long Beach cycle show also had some pinging at the end of the ride. The clutch on this bike also had a mild chatter in first gear. I rode this bike at the end of the day, so it had probably been abused by other riders that were not familiar with operating a dry clutch. I also believe that the pinging is caused by a defective knock sensor. It is under warranty, have BMW repair it. I just purchased a 2007 R1200GS and it runs flawless . So, these symptoms are not normal. Pinging should not be ignored. If ignored, future engine damage will follow.

[bthomson]

Yes it's pre-ignition all right! Sometimes very violent (you know, usually when you're passing a semi and would love to be able to close the throttle some, but can't). I'm in Mexico now and won't be back to Vancouver until March. Then it goes to the dealer again. Hopefully the problem is something simple like a bad knock sensor, although they have supposedly already been checked and are OK.

[bthomson]

I had the bike into a different dealer recently. They said the bike checked out OK, and all they did was instal the latest software version. Unfortunately the tech did not test ride the bike before doing so. On the one mile ride home I did not hear any pinging, but didn't want to jump to conclusions.

I have now just completed a 2,200 mile trip in everything from 114 to 32 degrees (on consecutive days!), and from sea level to 8,400 feet. No pinging!

We did the trip over 8 days from Palm Springs to Vancouver BC. No oil added. Average 51.2 mpg. No problems.

Happy now!

[Easy]

I had the bike into a different dealer recently. They said the bike checked out OK, and all they did was instal the latest software version. Unfortunately the tech did not test ride the bike before doing so. On the one mile ride home I did not hear any pinging, but didn't want to jump to conclusions.

I have now just completed a 2,200 mile trip in everything from 114 to 32 degrees (on consecutive days!), and from sea level to 8,400 feet. No pinging!

We did the trip over 8 days from Palm Springs to Vancouver BC. No oil added. Average 51.2 mpg. No problems.

Happy now!

:thumb :thumb :thumb

Easy:german

[RTRandy]

I believe the reason for the lower octane out west is mainly due to altitude. A 12 to 1 compression ratio is not the same at 6,000 feet as it is at sea level so the higher octane is not needed with the thinner air being compressed.

[TomfromMD]

IIRC, some other owners of '07 & '08 RTs reported that BMW had come out with a software fix for pinging. Luckily, it's not a problem on my '06.
Glad your bike is now running like it should - Enjoy!
Tom

[glurkus]

There is a software update that is supposed to address this problem.

http://www.bmwlt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33242

I also experience pinging on hard acceleration on my '07 RT. I called my dealer about the software update and they claimed my vin # doesn't need it, but they would check it out on my next service. Sounds like they do not want to pay their tech to update my software.

[SteveTech]

Service Bulletin 13 001 08(007)

March 2008

R1200RT Vin ZR60266-ZR69999 AND Vin ZV45000-ZV47159 must be updated with CIP v11.00

[glurkus]

R1200RT Vin ZR60266-ZR69999 AND Vin ZV45000-ZV47159 must be updated with CIP v11.00

Thanks for the info. My VIN does not fall into those ranges. It's nice to know my dealer is correct. It is interesting that my bike's VIN starts with ZT, which is in between those two ranges.

[TGA57589]

Mark me down for the pinging also, and I use Sunoco 93 all the time. I thought maybe the rider needed to shed a few pounds on my machine?

[cpumdhb]

I just had my R1200 into the local dealer for the second time to address this and the ignition switch antenna ring. They had trouble at the start with the software update but did finally seem to resolve it. I'll give it a few rides to be sure but it's like there is another engine in this thing. No more backfiring on closed throttle, acceleration seems better, less surging, etc. I'll also check the mileage. I feel now that it was not the right programming from the start. Now, if I can get a backup of that?

:beer

[gulfcoastbeemer]

Is there any way for the owner to know what software version is currently installed without the use of the BMW service computer?

[deilenberger]

Is there any way for the owner to know what software version is currently installed without the use of the BMW service computer?I believe one could read it out with the GS-911 diagnostics tool. Other than that - nope. The current version is 11.2 or greater.

[marchyman]

I believe one could read it out with the GS-911 diagnostics tool. Other than that - nope. The current version is 11.2 or greater.

The GS-911 shows about three version numbers for each individual controller and none seem to bear any relationship to a release version such as 11.2. I've heard conjecture that the CD/DVD/whatever release number that BMW issues pertains to the set of various firmware files for the different controllers on different bikes but are not the version of any specific controller load. True? :dunno

I don't have any images saved from my GS-911 but the reported numbers are something like (using the ZFE in this example) the following.

MCV: 0.5.6
FSV: 1.7.6
OSV: 3.3.0

At least I assume those are version numbers.

// marc

[deilenberger]

//marc,

dunno. I do know the tech at my local dealers - when I asked for the latest version software to be installed at my 600 mile service last year, hooked up the GT1 which reported I had the current (at that time 7.2) version of the software. It may well be the package of releases is what this number refers to..

[AZgman]

I just had my R1200 into the local dealer for the second time to address this and the ignition switch antenna ring. They had trouble at the start with the software update but did finally seem to resolve it.

Let me guess... the dealer in Hartford?

[cjack]

I believe one could read it out with the GS-911 diagnostics tool. Other than that - nope. The current version is 11.2 or greater.

12.0 came out last week.

[arcamedies]

I had the bike into a different dealer recently. They said the bike checked out OK, and all they did was instal the latest software version. Unfortunately the tech did not test ride the bike before doing so. On the one mile ride home I did not hear any pinging, but didn't want to jump to conclusions.

I have now just completed a 2,200 mile trip in everything from 114 to 32 degrees (on consecutive days!), and from sea level to 8,400 feet. No pinging!

We did the trip over 8 days from Palm Springs to Vancouver BC. No oil added. Average 51.2 mpg. No problems.

Happy now!

I just bought a 2007 R1200RT with 445 miles on it, was a demo, I noticed the metallic sound and wondered and was told that it's the ignition pulse from the cylinders hammering the stainless crossover pipe, like an exhaust header on a performance motor ticking sound. I was wearing a half shell and when I changed to a 3/4 shell and then a full face it progressively got better. Getting 50 mpg when cruising at 70mph, and 55mpg when at 55mph, after 3500 miles in 6 weeks it's normal to me. :blush