Need advice about St. Louis- can you help?

[lancew]

I need some help from the members who are familiar with St. Louis, and I know there are a lot of you out there (when I say out there, I don't mean "Out There", I mean... well, you know...).

My wife and I both work for a company that is moving its HQ to St. Louis sometime next year, and we're facing a little dilemma- Do we go?

We just spent 3 years turning a modest house on 10 acres into a modest house in the middle of a 10 acre horse farm- great barn, 2 garages, fenced-in pastures, and surrounded by mostly protected woods. Oh yeah, with a 5 3/8% 30 year fixed mortgage, which means our payment is lower than the rent on a 2-bedroom apt., so with things the way they are, we can't really afford to sell it in this market.

If we even get an offer, we'd need to find a rental place within 30 miles of downtown with room for (here comes the funny part) 3 German Shepherds, a couple jeeps, a diesel pickup and horse trailer, a couple of tractors, one nice cat, one mean cat... and oh yeah, a large german motorcycle. A horse property would be ideal, but a place on a couple acres near a horsey area where we could board the horse would work too.

We've kind of considered something in the Belleville, IL area, but have heard some kind of negative things about it from people we work with. Of course, those people live in big subdivisions where the SUV's never get dirty and they say the same thing about where we live now.

Staying here would take a pretty big change-of-life. Without going into too much detail, we would both have to completely change careers and pretty much start from scratch (which might be a good thing anyhow).

Floor's open, anyone care to chime in?

Thanks- it means a lot to us

10083

[crazydrummerdude]

Let a jaded 21-year old tell you..

Most anything on the Illinois side, close to St Louis is a real dump.. excluding the Belleville/Caseyville/surrounding area. There are farms/etc still over there, and they have views of the arch.

In terms of west of St Louis, don't count on any land being available. There's nothing over here now but people who think they're rich buying up acres of land and putting big houses they can't afford on it. They're the quickest to judge/complain about a single speck of dirt on a car (or SUV), and they certainly would cause a big commotion if you actually wanted to have a shed/barn/animals/vehicles.

Best bet is to find something a little south or a little north if you want to be in MO. Then again, south St Louis County is trying to catch up to St Charles County (for a while, one of the fastest growing in the country) in terms of development.

I've got a feeling if you find something good, in 5 years, you'll be surrounded by subdivisions.

Of course, there are exceptions to every generalized statement.

[bobh41]

My wife and I were faced with nearly exactly the same situation. I was "invited" to transfer to the southland. We have 14 acres on a very close in but secluded woods and a berry farm with barns, tractors, trucks, dogs, cats, chickens, geese, ducks. I was sure my job would not last long if I stayed, but decided to stay here, anyway, as I know the other town pretty well and figured we absolutely could not tolerate it.

There was and is no possibility of replacing our existing home and "estate". So, a couple of years later we were "downsized" for the fourth time and I took early retirement. I worked as a contractor for a couple of years after, but the local jobs dried up and I was faced with working out of state as a contractor.

We both retired prematurely and although we're doing okay the new R1200 is going to have to wait quite a while. We're satisfied we made the correct decision for us.

I know STL somewhat, from traveling and working there periodically. If you move you will likely have a long commute. STL commuter traffic is intolerable IMO.

Check out Festus, MO if your work is on the MO side. It's just off the freeway about 35 miles S of STL and is (was the last time I was there visiting a friend) a beautiful rural setting.

[wanderer]

I'm originally from Freeburg, Il. That's 8 miles south of Belleville, Il. Spent the first 21 years or so there. I'm 55 now. I also lived around Annandale,Va. for about 3 years in the early 70's. I think you will find the climate very similar. It's humid year round. Doesn't get crazy desert hot nor Alaska cold but always humid. Seasons are also very similar to Va.

So you need some room for ....stuff. For access to downtown St. Louis, I'd check the east side of the river. The Mo. side has a lot of open land (like Ellisville, home of the greatest club in the world!) The urban sprall however means you have to go further and further out. I'd look around O'Fallon, Mo. possibly or call the MOA folks as they really are on the edge of the St. Louis metroplex area.

On the east side you can actually get closer to downtown because downtown is, obviously, at the extreme east edge of St. Louis. Theres that big river just east of that. You can have shorter drive times into downtown from many areas on the Il. side and many access routes. So if you go to the east side you certainly want to get beyond East St. Louis. It's still one of the biggest slums in the USA for the most part. Someday it may turn around but I haven't seen it yet. You can also easily interstate bypass East St. Louis to the east, North, or South.

Places I'd look at for a rural setting within a 30 minute or so commute would include: Collinsville, Edwardsville, Belleville, O'Fallon (Il.) Mascoutah, Freeburg, Waterloo, Columbia, Smithtown, and maybe more I'm missing. The taxes are also different between Mo. and Il. I believe. I don't think Mo. has state income tax but they make it up in property tax "I THINK", you may want to check that out.

I like St. Louis, I like the history, excellent fine arts, great food, good music, nice riverfront area, good shopping. But hey, I live in COLORADO now and I ain't going back.

I've got to get to work. PM me anytime if you like. Good luck, moving is always a huge decision.

[PAGoldsby]

The word you are searching for is "Herculaneum."

The greater Herculaneum-Crystal City-Festus metroplex can provide you with the type of surroundings you're used to.

[1flyer]

The guy that sits close to me at work is from Belleville and likes living there. He was initially from that area. He says there is land available but doesn't know much about horses. Once you get away from the area just on the east side of the river across from St. Louis the conditions improve. I know of a nice private airport/home development not far from downtown. And yes, there are still areas of undeveloped farm land with a view of the Arch. But there is a lot of flat land and you can see a long way across the bottom land.

Do you know where your company will be located when it moves to STL? That will be a key point in determining where you want to look for a place. The daily commute can be a problem in STL depending on where work is and where your home is. Missouri Department of Transportation is not known for doing good upfront planning and for the last several years they have been in a reactive mood trying to fix problems. (Multiple interstate intersections with only one lane "flying bridge" ramps.)

Contrary to what the jaded kid said, there are nice area's to the west and it is "horse country" out there. Once again, depending on where you will be working will play a part in if you would want to consider looking for a place toward that direction. I would guess your horses could find a place to live without any problem but you and your wife might take a little longer. Renting a place for both you and your horses might be a little tough. I'll ask around to people at work that have property in the outlying county and see what they say.

You can send me a PM or an e-mail and we can follow up with details if you wish.

[wanderer]

After reading some other people's posts I reread your's. You said "from downtown."

I would agree with what others have said. Your living location should be influenced by exactly where your work is located. I rode there last week and attended the MOA open house. It takes me about an hour and a half to clear St. Louis comeing in on I 70 to the rural side of Il. In other words, to completely go from the rural west side to the rural east side of town. If I worked on the far west side of town, I certainly wouldn't live in Il. If I worked downtown I would strongly consider the Il. side of the river.

St. Louis is definately a "city" but there's no reason to create a 3 hour a day comute. It isn't necessary in St. Louis. It's not like some areas of, for example, the eastern seaboard. The town has good access to rural areas in several directions. Again, good luck on your decision!!

[YELLOW_S]

St. Louis people are "out there"...

[lancew]

St. Louis people are "out there"...

Not at all, I've had the good luck to work with a lot of them over the years, and they are as good a bunch as you find. I've also heard that St. Louis is a great place, both from natives and from people who got "moved" there. If I were in a different situation, I'd be chomping at the bit to go there. We just have our own little special deal going here, and we'd hate to give it up.

By the way, thanks to everyone for taking the time to share their advice, it's a huge favor and a huge help.

You are hereby invited to the annual Powhatan, VA Christmas Eve Day "Send them to church reeking of beer and bonfire smoke" afternoon bonfire. :buds

[lancew]

oh, and the commute is not a major issue- I would be heading into downtown St. Louis and arriving at about 6am. The ride home would be a possible issue, but my trip here is usually 40 to 45 minutes (homewardm that is) and I consider it a good trade-off.

Right now we have peace, solitude, nature, and room for all the critters (and a Large German Motorcycle, of course). The trick is to find a similar situation there and not give up what we have here. If it were Charlotte or Atlanta or DC or Boston or New York I'd already know the answer.

I'm probably asking too much, but you never know until you ask, right?

[BobMielke]

Deja Vu. I was born & raised in Belleville, IL. My brother & family still live in O'Fallon, IL on their farm. That's a great area to look for farm land to rent. If you like crowds & traffic jams try St. Charles, MO west of St. Louis. I worked for McDonnell Douglas for 13 years. Mr. brother's name is Edward Mielke. Look him up & give him a call. I haven't been back homein years & he'd have the inside skinny.

[mvscorpio]

You are hereby invited to the annual Powhatan, VA Christmas Eve Day "Send them to church reeking of beer and bonfire smoke" afternoon bonfire.

I had nothing to offer, I know nothing about St. Louis, though I traveled there 2-3 times for business. But can I come smell like beer before church too? :D

[lancew]

I had nothing to offer, I know nothing about St. Louis, though I traveled there 2-3 times for business. But can I come smell like beer before church too? :D

Oh yeah, we have plenty of room for tents too... which is another thing I'd hate to give up... (good thing, because around here t seems like the circus is always in town :buds :bottle :lurk :dance :kbasa )

[njnear]

Sounds like commuting wouldn't be an issue. I'd ride west on I-44 until I found something I could live with. It gets really hilly out west and if you haven't been there you'll be pleasantly surprised. Ozarks and Mark Twain is not that far away, all excellent riding. Not VA, but very hilly and rural. Eureka is 30 miles away and countryfied.

Stay away from IL. East St. Louis is less than desirable and traffic is horendous all the way out past O'Fallon. IL might be the same latitude as VA, but it has an extreme northeast feel from a political standpoint. Missouri feels more comfortable and southern if you will. I affectionately refer to IL as the communist state. Nuff said about that.

Most employers will pay for a trip. I'd get that in my package and fly/drive/ride out and spend a long weekend and look around.

Good hunting.

[AirForce]

If you're willing to have a little drive into St Looey everyday, you should be able to find horse property outside the city proper. There's a LOT of country places just a short (30-40 miles) from the city. Good luck and if you get here, drop us a line and we'll put you onto the good riding roads.