Vote on Clubhouse Project

[From MARS]

I need to have feedback from as many members as possible as to the feasability of the BMWMOA Clubhouse project as outlined in the thread by the same name. The thread is quite long now, and I thought this might be an easy way to let folks vote on this proposal.
Tom

[chasman]

Don't do it! Instead, go for a nice long ride. Do it and donate it to the BMWMOA Foundation. Or just do it.

[PAGoldsby]

I'm not getting involved until a structural engineer looks at it.

;)

[From MARS]

Where the hell are we going to find one of those?

[PAGoldsby]

Where the hell are we going to find one of those?There's a factory in Lawrence, KS that makes them. They used to make basketball players too, but the quality has fallen off since '88.

[Tinboatcapt]

I don't think I'll get there, but I see no reason to oppose the idea.
:thumb

[JCabranes]

I'm not getting involved until a structural engineer looks at it.

;)

Isn't that a given? I thought I read about having a structural engineer look the place over on the other thread.

[PAGoldsby]

Isn't that a given? I thought I read about having a structural engineer look the place over on the other thread.Yeah. Whatever happened to that guy? I have his name around here somewhere ...

[From MARS]

I'm not sure who that guy is either, but I hope to meet him this weekend. Maybe he'll post his plans for coming down.

[PAGoldsby]

I'm not sure who that guy is either, but I hope to meet him this weekend. Maybe he'll post his plans for coming down.I've left word with my sister about Sunday. I will email you when I get something ironed out. Bug me about it Thursday, if I haven't let you know by then.

[Pat Carol]

I am all for it. I am by no means a carpenter but, I can help with the labor portion. I find it very noble to come up with such a great idea and offer this structure for all to enjoy.
If people were to stop in and rest for a day or two. I do not feel that asking for a donation towards operation and building maintenance would be too much to ask.


Good Luck
Pat Carol

[gambrinus]

Great idea, I hope it works out. I'd be willing to show up for a "work weekend" sort of thing, and contribute some $$ once I lay my eyes on the place.

RW

[Gilly]

I'm kind of a middle-of-the-roader, but don't mind expressing my thoughts on it.
If some members might enjoy it, I might contribute a few bucks (less than 3 digits), but not alot.
I think the whole MOA organization should be behind it. I have no idea if MOA has the kind of money to keep it going or not. As far as MOA, I am not sure how it is all based, could this become, in addition to other things, MOA headquarters, or are all the "worker bees" for MOA rooted in a specific area of the country, or how could that work?
I am trying to understand a few of the ideas that were tossed out:

The orchard may become a campground/RV park, the treehouse may become a vacation home, and the elevator is going to become a tourist center/rest stop for cagers and cyclist alike.
Would that be revenue generating, or just free for all MOA members or what?

And this: Operating expenses could be offset by renting out portions of the building for meetings, weddings, reunions, etc. And, don't forget the gym/auditorium. It can be a revenue center as well. Maybe a dealership or something like a service center where we lease space to individual service providers.
Sounds like a good idea now, but how many people will come to Elmdale, KS for cycle service (except MOA member stopping during a trip or as a stay on a trip, or for a reunion or reception?

Gilly

[From MARS]

Gilly,
The orchard is NOT, repeat, NOT part of the freebie. The only way I can afford to give up the value of the school is if I can find a way to generate income elsewhere. Of course, if the Foundation wanted it to complete the mix, I would be reasonable about it. I don't know if I mentioned this in the original thread, but the stone mason who looked at the building before I bought it placed a value on the stone of $200.00/ton. Chase County limestone, which is the finest limestone in the country and is in many buildings and bridges, weighs 165lbs/cuft. Many individual stones in the school will approach a ton.

I used to ride 325 miles to my dealer when I lived in Mobile, AL (they were in Vinemont, AL) because they gave good service and had a bunkhouse to stay in. If this undertaking has the backing of BMWNA, we'll probably have some great service people and one hell of a clubhouse to stay in.

The reason I ride BMW's, aside from the other riders I get to meet, is because of the treatment I received from BMWNA when the engine on my '88 K75C crapped out. I'll tell you the story sometime.

[kbasa]

I'm not sure what the MOA would do with it, to be honest. Our headquarters is based in STL and we have a long standing staff. I would not want to even consider moving that entire operation to Kansas.

I don't know that we want to be in the business of running or administering a campsite/dorm arrangement either.

I would strongly suggest reaching out to the BMW MOA Foundation and see what their thoughts are. I know that they want to expand their services and "deliverables" and this structure might be useful in reaching that goal.

I hope I'm not being a buzzkill because there are exciting possibilities here.

[Gilly]

Thanks for expalining that Dave, I was pretty sure it must be something like that, I was just curious if that were a possiblity.
I don't want to be a "buzzkill" either. Just asking the hard questions.
It's too far away for me to take off and check it out, my time away freom work is limited (for example MOA rally was a one day event for me, and only because it was close).
I could see maybe visiting it sometime when it was done.
MOA clubs could possibly hold fundraisers for it.
But when it was done, yeah it would be nnice if it was self-sustaining.
Sorry I didn't understand the orchard thing.
Tom, so the school/clubhouse you want to give up entirely, like deed it to the MOA hand then the club is responsible for expenses (property taxes and maintenance, etc)? Gilly

[From MARS]

Dave, Gilly, and all,
When I ran this idea up the flagpole in the original thread, I was not aware of the mission or the history of the BMWMOA Foundation. I just wanted to find a use for the building that would accomplish my stated goals of: preservation of the building, rejuvination of the town of Elmdale, and creation of a ride destination/clubhouse for those who like to congregate with other riders. The idea, like all ideas, was expanded during the dialog to include many possibilities. I am not in a position to suggest to the MOA that the headquarters be moved. However, now that you have mentioned it, it may be that the staff woudn't mind living in this beautiful area. The cost of living here would give them an effective raise of probably 15-20%, and would definitely reduce their time in traffic. (Did I mention there isn't a single traffic light in the whole county?)

As to the sustainability, well, just like any undertaking, that would depend upon the effectiveness of the management. In my experience, any business that provides good service at a reasonable price, will be successful. Once the GS riders find out about the back roads in this area, they'll come.

Taxes are so low here, they really aren't an issue. My rear tire was more than my taxes on the property. Of course, as time goes on, they'll go up, but I have spoken with the county commission, and they are open to some form of tax abatement/incentives.

After having been educated as to the goals of the Foundation, I think they would be the perfect entity to own the building and would gladly turn the property over to them rock, stock, and barrel if there was the financial support to begin realizing the stated goals of the Foundation. They, the Foundation, could start small with plenty of empty farmland available for expansion when the need arose.

There is a very small town at the south end of the county, Cassoday, that began a "first Sunday" ride in. At first it was small. Now, several thousand riders congregate each month. They are mostly H-D people, but then, most riders are. The tiny restaurant there served over 1500 people on one Sunday. Clearly an example of, "Build it and they will come."

Perhaps our clubhouse would entice some of those riders of other brands to join us in our enjoyment of all things Beemer.

[From MARS]

To all the folks who have been waiting until we had the engineer's opinion of the structure before voting, we have it. PAGoldsby says the building is sound and estimates the refurbishing cost in the 2-300,000 dollar range. That works out to about $10.00/member or one very nice individual that needs a big tax write-off.

There have been over 2000 views of the original thread, but only 40-something votes. We can do better. The more people that weigh in here, the better off we'll be when I go to the Foundation with the formal offer. If your local club is not aware of this project ('cause believe it or not, not everyone reads the forums) give them a heads-up so the other members can express their opinions, too. Ask everyone to let their friends know what we are trying to do for the organization since not everyone belongs to a local club.

With member support, we can have a clubhouse.

[From MARS]

Our president has expressed his opinion. He is against the idea. His stated reasons can be read in the original thread. This is a democracy so we each can have an opinion. Here's mine.

There are a few things I don't understand. If the financial welfare of the organization is our top priority, why would we want to continue paying rent that I understand is in the upper five-figure range? I applaud his loyalty to the staff, but what about the staff's loyalty to the organization? I presume each would be given the option of relocating. Are there so many members in the STL area, that relocating the hqts would put undo burdens on the majority of the members? If the safety of our members is paramount, why ask them to enter a strange area with big city traffic just to visit the headquarters? If someone can answer these questions, I'm all ears.

To those that expressed their financial support, thank you. The project will be alive as long as the support is there. Contact me and let's find a way to continue this project. Or, contact the MOA Foundation and pledge your support.

Tom

[From MARS]

A decision has been made to offer the school to the MOA Foundation.

If you are one of the votes to support this project, please send me an email, thomasseigler@therippleeffectproject.com, stating your level of support.

We have received our first pledge of $1000.00. Your's can be smaller or larger, but more important than the size, is the number of people who express their support.

Please read the BMWMOA clubhouse thread for my final post under this phase of the project.

Thank you to all who have participated.

Tom

[SheRidesABeemer]

Our president has expressed his opinion. He is against the idea. His stated reasons can be read in the original thread. This is a democracy so we each can have an opinion. Here's mine.

There are a few things I don't understand. If the financial welfare of the organization is our top priority, why would we want to continue paying rent that I understand is in the upper five-figure range? I applaud his loyalty to the staff, but what about the staff's loyalty to the organization? I presume each would be given the option of relocating. Are there so many members in the STL area, that relocating the hqts would put undo burdens on the majority of the members? If the safety of our members is paramount, why ask them to enter a strange area with big city traffic just to visit the headquarters? If someone can answer these questions, I'm all ears.

Tom
Are you suggesting that every time a member decides to save an old building, we should up and move to it? :dunno

[KGT1200]

I'm for it because it's close. If I live in South Texas, I may never see it, doubt if I will come.

Anything against it? Absolutely knot!;)

[From MARS]

Gail,
I'll be brief.
Never was it my suggestion to move the headquarters, but when it was mentioned, I thought about it. As a "stockholder", so to speak, in this club/business, I looked at the ramifications of moving into a "company" owned location over paying rent.

My concern, now, is the blanket statement by our president that under no circumstances would the headquarters be moved. That precludes the donation of even a brand new, custom built, high dollar, prize winning designed structure, located anywhere but Ballwin, MO from becoming our headquarters, and that makes me question the guidance we are operating under. To reject, even before they are made, any offer that would result in a significant savings in operating cost, isn't good leadership.

This has nothing to do with the schoolhouse; just basic business practices.
Tom

[Bokrijder]

Are you suggesting that every time a member decides to save an old building, we should up and move to it? :dunno

I doubt that was the suggestion though the linkage to the current discussion could imply such.

Every organization has a responsibility to periodically review overhead expenditures. Members have entrusted the board to handle their dues in an efficient and open manner.
I'm sure that from time to time, members, using various words and various means, take pause to remind board members of this responsibility.

I believe that Tom's dream may have legs though possibly not with the MOA organization. A facility in the Youth Hostel model possibly? Add a few revenue centers to the setup? Capture East/West traffic, tie in local bike social activities?
Low overhead, It could work.


Motard

[knary]

Gail,
I'll be brief.
Never was it my suggestion to move the headquarters, but when it was mentioned, I thought about it. As a "stockholder", so to speak, in this club/business, I looked at the ramifications of moving into a "company" owned location over paying rent.

My concern, now, is the blanket statement by our president that under no circumstances would the headquarters be moved. That precludes the donation of even a brand new, custom built, high dollar, prize winning designed structure, located anywhere but Ballwin, MO from becoming our headquarters, and that makes me question the guidance we are operating under. To reject, even before they are made, any offer that would result in a significant savings in operating cost, isn't good leadership.

This has nothing to do with the schoolhouse; just basic business practices.
Tom

:brow

Tom,

You offer an old building of questionable condition in a location of questionable value requiring unknown quantities of dollars to renovate. It might turn out to be a fantastic structure in the long run, but we don't know that. And even if it can be turned into a great stop off point for riders, and I hope it can, I, for one, can't imagine that even in top shape that it would be a viable location for the HQ. It's apparently 150 miles from the nearest big airport, 120 miles from the nearest big city and at least 350 miles from the homes of our experienced staff. IOW, it's in the middle of nowhere. This may not be important to you, but it certainly is to the running of this organization.

[Bokrijder]

Scott states some basic logistic points. One can say, "Oh that makes sense." and we move on.

Hackles to the relaxed position (both sides)

Carry on

Motard

[knary]

The generosity of this offer should *not* be downplayed. It is nothing short of fantastic. We can only hope that we all can all be this generous - have the means and have the goodness of spirit.

I hope as we look pragmatically at such offers that we don't lose site of that generosity which should always be applauded.

[PAGoldsby]

It's not in the middle of nowhere. It's in the middle of the United States of America. :usa

Also, don't take it out on Elmdale that the city fathers of Kansas City, MO, chose to build the KC airport in Iowa. (Or so it seems, sometimes.) ;)

[Hodag]

if I remember my MOA history correctly wasn't the headquarters moved a few times? including from CA to the Midwest??


its only about 60 miles from wichita, which I consider a big city.



just thoughts, i'm neither for it or against it at this point, but those tin ceilings sure are neat

[knary]

if I remember my MOA history correctly wasn't the headquarters moved a few times? including from CA to the Midwest??


its only about 60 miles from wichita, which I consider a big city.



just thoughts, i'm neither for it or against it at this point, but those tin ceilings sure are neat

You are correct. Wichita, at around 500,000 people (vs. 2.5 million metro for St.Louis), is the nearest big city. My map reading skills aren't what they used to be. :D It's about 75 miles away.

[Hodag]

You are correct. Wichita, at around 500,000 people (vs. 2.5 million metro for St.Louis), is the nearest big city. My map reading skills aren't what they used to be. :D It's about 75 miles away.

60 miles sounds closer....
:laugh

[knary]

60 miles sounds closer....
:laugh

:D

It would be closer to my house, so it works better for me. :augie

[Mar]

Hodag says: if I remember my MOA history correctly wasn't the headquarters moved a few times? including from CA to the Midwest??

Yes, it was moved but back then the "office" was a volunteer and a bunch of paper. Now we've got 38K+ members and lots more complexity.

Tom,

Don't take it as a slap in the face that the Powers that Be don't want to move the MOA office. I worked at the MOA office back when the Foundation was formed and the first blueprints for the Foundation's Ride Center were unveiled. There was a building designated as "MOA Headquarters." At the HQ you could hear heels being dug into the ground. Good leadership aside, there are many reasons why it would be unrealistic to move the office.

Primary is the assumption that the existing staff would give up their homes, their spouses would give up their jobs, they would leave their extended families and friends. Personally, I don't think there's quite that much dedication there, or maybe I should say it really wouldn't be worth it financially and emotionally to the staff. I certainly didn't think it was back then--there wasn't anything the MOA would been able do to make it worth my while. We'd have to sell our house, my husband would have to agree to quit his job and follow me, I'd have to leave friends, etc. No matter how you look at it, it would have cost our family a lot of money/income.

Also, 60 miles (or 75) is pretty far to go for a printer (lots of small printing jobs), a bank (large enough to serve a 2.5 million dollar corporation), the local office supply store, etc.

Jeff Dean says: I do not know why the MOA Foundation would want to take ownership of a run-down building, albeit a very pretty one, and then have to support it, insure it, protect it, weather proof it, etc. And why would the foundation want to spent hundreds of thousands of dollars to restore it when it doesn't even have such resouces?

Jeff, remember the Ride Center? It was/is a grandiose plan requiring lots of money to build from the ground up. If the Foundation is serious about the Ride Center, Tom's piece of property and building is just the ticket. Frankly, I am surprised that the Foundation isn't beating down his door, or at least seriously talking with him. The Ride Center doesn't have to spring from the ground all at once. One building is a good start, and it's a dandy of a building.

If this project--and the Foundation's future goal of the Ride Center--are going to get off the ground, it's going to take commitment. Tom certainly has the commitment but I fear that's as far as it goes.

Regarding setting up a hostel, that might be a hard way to go. Hostels are usually in the center of public transportation because they house those who are traveling by public transportation, or bicycle. The Gateway Council of Hostelling International has recently lost in its effort to open a hostel at the University of Missouri St. Louis Campus. It took many hours and money spent by the Board, volunteers and paid staff. The local Council tried to turn a unused residence hall into a hostel but the city of Bel-Nor wouldn't issue a business license. It was one of those "not in my back yard" things. But the Council isn't giving up; it's still looking for a suitable place for a St. Louis hostel.

[Bokrijder]

[QUOTE=Mar;23010
Regarding setting up a hostel, that might be a hard way to go. Hostels are usually in the center of public transportation because they house those who are traveling by public transportation, or bicycle. The Gateway Council of Hostelling International has recently lost in its effort to open a hostel at the University of Missouri St. Louis Campus. It took many hours and money spent by the Board, volunteers and paid staff. The local Council tried to turn a unused residence hall into a hostel but the city of Bel-Nor wouldn't issue a business license. It was one of those "not in my back yard" things. But the Council isn't giving up; it's still looking for a suitable place for a St. Louis hostel.[/QUOTE]



Uh --- am I missing something here? Our members are looking for lodging near public transportation??? I spent most of my career and thousands of miles crisscrossing Europe on motorcycle. I've spent a lot of nights in simple country hostels. Simple, clean, peaceful, usually a retired or young couple living in residence as caretakers. A very reasonable fee and often a little extra was left in the pot.
This integrated with a foundation center would be a fine thing.

Making the foundation and the project worthy of consideration for major donations should be a goal.

Motard

[Mar]

Uh --- am I missing something here? Our members are looking for lodging near public transportation??? I spent most of my career and thousands of miles crisscrossing Europe on motorcycle. I've spent a lot of nights in simple country hostels. Simple, clean, peaceful, usually a retired or young couple living in residence as caretakers. A very reasonable fee and often a little extra was left in the pot.

I meant an official Hostelling International hostel. Because of past involvement with the American Youth Hostels (now Hostelling International) when someone says "hostel" to me, I think of that, not privately owned hostels or B&Bs.

[OU812]

Uh --- am I missing something here? Our members are looking for lodging near public transportation??? I spent most of my career and thousands of miles crisscrossing Europe on motorcycle. I've spent a lot of nights in simple country hostels. Simple, clean, peaceful, usually a retired or young couple living in residence as caretakers. A very reasonable fee and often a little extra was left in the pot.
This integrated with a foundation center would be a fine thing.

Making the foundation and the project worthy of consideration for major donations should be a goal.

Motard
I could not agree with you more.
Steve

[OU812]

I would have voted for the 1st and 2nd choices. Can I vote for both?

[Bokrijder]

This is one person's opinion. The question really is, do hundreds or thousands of riders feel the way you do? Are you and they willing to put serious money and effort where their keyboard is?

I am not saying it is impossible -- but I am skeptical.

Dreams and individual opinions are nice. But to succeed you have to see and understand the big picture and be realistic.


Yes indeed, It is one person's opinion. I wrote it.

Dreams and individual opinions are nice. ?? I believe they are much more than nice, they are vital to the betterment and advancement of the organization.

Everyone should click to the MOA foundation page and read the mission statement.

After reading the mission statement, would it not be logical that a member might consider donating a facility and land to the organization?

Accept that a member could be reviewing his will, considering the response to this offer, workable or not, should he consider a bequest?

The cries were -- dumping an unwanted property on the MOA, what's in it for the donor? He expects us to fix it up! The members talk and opine but will not do anything!! on and on

The model for accepting such a donation is in place and practiced by most museums. If an artifact which requires upkeep is to be accessioned, it is required to be accompanied by a support endowment. Museums long ago discovered that a wonderful collection could be assembled and they could easily go bankrupt with its maintenance.

I really can't claim this dream or vision as mine, it for the most part is spelled out in the Foundation Mission statement.

1. A serious review should be made determining if the offer fits with the Mission statement. A center is directly discussed in this statement. A center model and its format are spelled out.

2. We have an aging membership, many fast friendships have been made over lifetimes of riding. Members have passed on.
Would the Peach Tree Grove be an appropriate location for a memorial to those deceased? A place of solitude and reflection? Mementos, plaques, tributes?

3. Would a lean, but quiet, clean, and inexpensive hostel fit our members needs. The hostel model fits our mentality, Pitch in and help. A resident couple in the hostel model provides 7 day manning. generally rent free and with a small stipend. I've talked to many European residents, they see it as a good life.

I have no idea if the Kansas location is viable or if my above thoughts are viable. The real question is if the foundation has the ability to pursue its stated goals. If it does and can demonstrate the ability to actively pursue a fulfillment of the mission statement, it will be seen worthy of serious financial support.

Motard

[OU812]

I feel the same as Motard. I am a new member, yes. But we are the future of the BMWMOA.

[Bokrijder]

Hi Mo and Ou,

It's well and good to sit at your keyboard and pronounce what should be done, presumably by others, but I have a suggestion for you.

Feeling as strongly as you do about this, you could set aside your keyboards, go to your respective banks, withdraw about $100,000 each, and send it to the MOA foundation earmarked for this project.

This would be a great way for you to kick it off.



Mr. Dean as a founding father of the BMWMOA, you have painted a very clear picture for me. Probably time for me to back off on this.

Motard

[OU812]

Hey, calm down. I am not saying lets move everyone and plant them in Elmdale. I am saying this is something that is being offered for free to the foundation. I know it takes $ after the fact. No, I don't have $10,000 to fork over. If I won the lotto , I would, and more,and tell you all to take A hike. I would make it a priority. Alas, that is what dreams are made of. I am sure when you started the BMWMOA it was but a dream also. Shame on you for stomping on this as you have. Hey, I shoot from the hip,so don't take me seriously.:stick

[OU812]

Ever heard of,"build it, and they will come". I will, and I am.
Steve

[From MARS]

All this started because I just wanted to do something nice for a group of people I really like, but it is degenerating. Please, the idea is to look for solutions to the challenges we face in making this a reality.

Mr Dean is correct. Those who, along with me, support this project should step up with whatever resources they wish to commit to the project. Pm's and emails should be flooding to the Foundation officers, like BradfordBenn, in support of this project. Supporters should be talking to their clubs about getting involved with club commitments. We should be discussing this with the BMW dealers we support. We should be asking the companies that supply our farkles if they are aware of the proposal and what their take on it is, and we should spend accordingly if we think it is truely important. All of our local rallies are opportunities to get feedback and win support. Spread the word to those that don't get to the forums. Start a grassroots effort with your riding partners. Mr. Dean is correct. Let's get to work. Do whatever you can to further the goal. Our mantra should be, "Everything is Something."

There *will* be a clubhouse for likeminded riders. Be it within or without the existing structure of the club and/or the Foundation, I will build a clubhouse with everyone's help or I'll build it with my own two hands. It might take awhile, but it can be done. I would much rather see a thousand people kick in a hundred bucks than one a hundred thousand, but we'll take it if offered. The Foundation has my basic proposal. Let's see what they say.

Please, we are family. Let's not say or do anything that will cause irreparable damage to our relationships.

Now, back to lurking.

Tom

[OU812]

Who will build it? You, Steve? Then get to work. Finance it, build it, operate it, and maintain it. My best wishes go with you and others willing to finance, build, operate, and maintain this suggested project. Stop keyboarding and posting comments. Go to your banks, make major withdrawals, and get to work.

If this suggested project cannot rise beyond my humble and skeptical warnings, it had no chance in the first place.

Get real, folks. That would be your first step toward possible success.
I can do a lot with my own two hands. I have not heard an offer from you for any such sum, sweat, or anything. So much for you. I am willing to offer my services, and what money I can spare. What have you offered other than negativity? I have no use for those who close doors on opportunities like these, that do not come up every day. I will be here until it is done. I will show you. Have you ever raced anything? If you have, you would understand what it means to get to the finish. I have. I will.

[knary]

Before folks get all huffy and try to draw lines in the sand, I suggest that those proposing this project gather some critical information. First, does anyone have any relatively solid numbers on the projected costs and returns of this endeavor?

[knary]

What is the draw of having our Headquarters in Missouri ? Rent, location, an airport ? If the BMW MOA left Missouri who doesn't get paid ? Who owns the building we rent or do we even rent ? I am just wondering how we ended up there. Show me.


I haven't a clue as to how we "ended up there" but...

Access to resources (printers, lodging, airport, etc)
Established staff (with husbands, wives, children, homes)
are a few BIG reasons to stay.

As for myself, a move wouldn't impact me directly (aside from dealing with a bunch of new people that don't know anything). I suppose if our real aim was to save every penny possible, we could move operations to India. :stick

[PAULBACH]

My understanding is that we rent the space in STL. Have no idea of costs but all of that should be in the last financial report. Not sure which issue has that report.

[BMWDEAN]

Tom,

If you haven't done so already, you should contact the Kansas Historic Preservation Office (785-272-8681) to see about getting your building listed in the National Register of Historic Places and what grants and/or tax credits might be available to assist you, including the Kansas Heritage Trust Fund:

http://www.kshs.org/resource/htfinfo.htm

http://www.kshs.org/resource/registerprocess.htm

http://www.kshs.org/resource/oldbuildings.htm

http://www.kshs.org/resource/grantsincentives.htm

http://www.kshs.org/resource/shpohome.htm

Good luck with your project!

[Bokrijder]

Tom,

If you haven't done so already, you should contact the Kansas Historic Preservation Office (785-272-8681) to see about getting your building listed in the National Register of Historic Places and what grants and/or tax credits might be available to assist you:

http://www.kshs.org/resource/shpohome.htm

I hope the commentators who step up so boldly now to their keyboards next step up with equal boldness to give you genuine assistance.

Good luck with your project!

Jeff,

Your post would be much more sincere, if it wasn't accompanied by another keyboard warrior comment.

I'm, in fact, supporting this project with a pledge of money and labor, contrary to what you may believe. Others may well be doing the same. Please consider, offering any implication that people can do no better than sit at a keyboard, may be offending a good number of members.

Note - We need a 70s Peace sign emoticon

Motard

[kbasa]

I haven't a clue as to how we "ended up there" but...

Access to resources (printers, lodging, airport, etc)
Established staff (with husbands, wives, children, homes)
are a few BIG reasons to stay.

As for myself, a move wouldn't impact me directly (aside from dealing with a bunch of new people that don't know anything). I suppose if our real aim was to save every penny possible, we could move operations to India. :stick

Exactly.

I don't see moving the MOA headquarters as a viable option.

[Visian]

I don't see moving the MOA headquarters as a viable option.

how about we just outsource it to india? :laugh

i can just hear the calls to the help desk now. :burnout

[From MARS]

Mr. Dean,

The Chase County courthouse is listed on the Historic Registry, and that has added thousands of dollars to the annual maintenance cost as everything that gets done must be in accordance with historic guidelines. For instance, the roof, which is red in color, must be painted copper instead of just red metal roofing.

At the beginning of this debate someone posted in the "BMWMOA Clubhouse" thread the advise of keeping the cost as low as possible. I fear such a listing would go against this sage advise. Hence, unless it can be shown to be cost effective to do so, I would prefer that we not pursue that line of thinking. I see maintaining the exterior appearance as close to what it is now as we can, but the addition of solar panels and solar heating, for instance, will alter the purely historic appearance somewhat. Form must follow function.

Thank you for the links. I will follow them to see where they lead. Other grants that I am looking at pursueing when this gets started are the economic development ones from the USDA for small town redevelopment. If anyone has a few extra minutes and the expertise to do so, help in following these leads would be appreciated.

Tom

[OU812]

http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=9466&stc=1&d=1185805304
http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=9471&stc=1&d=1185821357
http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=9475&stc=1&d=1185834932
http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=9476&stc=1&d=1185837546
http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=9477&stc=1&d=1185837818
http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=9478&stc=1&d=1185838022
http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=9479&stc=1&d=1185838300
http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=9480&stc=1&d=1185838769
Here you go.:p

[From MARS]

Dale and all,

This is going to be a long post. Please, read it *all* before responding.

I followed one of Mr. Dean's links to the Kansas Historical Society. He knows of what he speaks. The lady I spoke with at the Society was very enthusiastic about the structure. Especially the fact that it has not been altered. We are going to speak again tomorrow, but I am registered to attend a grant applicant workshop in Topeka, KS on the 18th of next month. I have them sending me the information packet on listing the structure. That is the first step. They offer grants to $90,000.00 awarded on a competetive basis. The co-funding requirements are 20% for a non-profit (MOA Foundation) and 100% if the applicant is a for-profit (BMW MOA). One of the competetive factors is economic impact of the project on the community. There are a lot of regulatory hoops to jump through, but let's not forget the golden rule: "He who controls the gold, rules."

One of *my* rules in life is: "Never turn away from a path until you are sure it has nothing to offer." That applies here. This is a path that we need to follow. I am not abandoning the path of doing it ourselves; that is a parallel path which we can take if the grant path becomes impassable.


We are talking about spending a lot of money. Phil Goldsby and I independently came up with the figure of 2-300K to complete this project. If we follow the grant route, I estimate we could spend 500K due to the requirements of the grant. Even if we complete the project with volunteer labor and donated specialized skills, we might get it done for 150K. That's still a lot of money. I don't have it. If I did, I would build it myself, but then, it wouldn't be *our* clubhouse, would it?


Remember, I am just the guy with the dream. Mr. Dean has the map to the checkbooks. It may not be the only map, but it is the one we have now. Mr. Dean, we need your guidance. I would welcome an email from you at: thomasseigler@therippleeffectproject.com. If you want to meet, just let me know. Hopefully, it will be at a time and place where I can ride the bike and is after Rick Mayer has finished my new seat in the next week or so, but I want your help. Dreamers need pragmatist, like Mr. Dean, to make our dreams a reality.

To paraphrase the man who dreamed of us getting to the moon in ten years: "Ask not what your clubhouse can do for you; ask what you can do for your clubhouse." This is the attitude and vision we all need to keep in mind as we procede down this path. We need, no, we must, work together if we want to have a snowball's chance in hell of actually making this a reality in our lifetimes. Its not the moon, but it is a chance to be a part of something that will continue long after we have left our bikes to our heirs. Hopefully, it won't take ten years to get there.

So, as we sit before our keyboards and compose our post, let us think about posterity and what we can contribute to leaving something good to it.

Tom

[Visian]

How much does the BMW MOA pay for rent ?

Who owns the building ?


maybe the most pointed question is: should the BMW MOA own its own headquarters building? :dunno

ian

[Visian]

I am dumbfounded please explain the aforementioned to me or what MBA program did you go to ?

chris - who are you talking to/asking this question?

ian

[AZ Greg]

Again ! WHO OWNS THE MOA HEADQUARTERS AND HOW MUCH RENT DO WE PAY ? Karl Rowe ?

* I read the guild lines it is a violation to discuss politics. Sorry, but that reminds me does the MOA have Executive privilege ? It appears so.

Whew . . . for a moment there I thought you might have been referring to Karl Rove!

and the helicopters continue to circle . . .

[Visian]

Since we are blessed with mover and shakers I was wondering how they think, their vision, and the academic institution philosophy they came from.

ah... i see... the generic "you" ;)

well, there are really good points on both sides of this argument and i honestly can't say which side i fall on, mainly because of incomplete information and i forgot damn near everything i learned in mba school. :)

every business case is different, and much is driven by the mission and objectives of the organization.

our mission is to foster communication and a sense of family... and families live in houses.... oh gosh, i am SO conflicted! :laugh

[From MARS]

For those that don't get to the Clubhouse section of the forums, there has been, and is, a discussion going on about headquarters ownership. It was sparked by comments made in this thread and the MOA Clubhouse thread, both of which I started. Some of the statements made by me in these threads have proven to be inaccurate.

I wish to apologize to all for passing bad information as to the amount of rent we pay for our headquarters location. I was told that it was in the upper five figures per year. As it turns out, we only pay $3800.00/mo in rent. I should have checked with the official powers before making any suggestion as to the amount of rent we pay. There was a reason that I was reluctant to do so, but I should have overcome that reluctance.

You all have my sincere apology.

Tom

[OU812]

Thomas, we all make mistakes, that is what makes us Human. See you soon!
Steve:clap