Winterizing too often?

[BradfordBenn]

So last Sunday (December 14, 2003) I went for a ride and then figured it was time to put the R1150RT away for a while. Something about snow. Topped off the tank, put in Stabil, plugged in the Battery Tender.

Then Monday (December 22, 2003) it was a nice day for a ride. However I did not take one as I was not sure about all of the gunk on the road from recent snow.

Then I got to thinking, is there anything bad about winterizing the bike too often? Was worried about running Stabil through the system too often; or should I just go for a ride and then redo the process?

[Rich]

Originally posted by BradfordBenn
Topped off the tank, put in Stabil, plugged in the Battery Tender.


I hear of a lot of guys using Stabil, but I quit using it years ago when I used it in a 9.9 HP Johnson outboard and it ate up all my rubber fuel lines. The dealer told me it was the cause. He highly recommended Seafoam instead, for all motors where a fuel stabilizer is needed. I resorted to using nothing at all, just topping off the tank to eliminate condensation, and have never had any problems since. That is just my two cents worth, and everyone has their own way of winterizing. Ride it every chance you get, keep the tank full, and I don't think you'll have a problem.

[Cliffy777]

used Stabil in my bike over the last two winters and rode on several occaisions (you know, when the mercury goes up in the 40's in February). never had any problem.

[speed reed]

I just bought three bottles of stabil have not used them yet. Rich says his mechanic told him it damaged his motor. I sure would like to hear what other people think before I use it.

Reed:dunno

[lorazepam]

I dont use any stabilizer. I will get the bike out enough to keep the battery up, and keep fuel moving through the system. I havent had any problems with any of my bikes starting other than the HD which didnt start half the time anyway. Of course if you dont ride for 4 months, you may have different results.

[Rich]

Originally posted by speed reed
Rich says his mechanic told him it damaged his motor.


There was no actual motor damage. I took the boat out first thing in the spring and when I got it on the water, the 9.9 ran like you know what. I'm not much of a mechanic, especially with boat motors, so I took it to a local dealer to look at. I was actually there when he opened the carbs, and there were bits of rubber in them. And the fuel lines were mushy. I did follow the recommended mix, so no, I didn't go hog wild with the stuff either. I just know that I lost faith in using fuel stabilizers that day, and like I said, I haven't had any problems since using nothing but good fresh fuel. Here's my theory, drain em in the summer (like the snow blower), and keep em topped off all winter. (Motorcycles, lawn mowers)

Have a good one.

Rich

[kbasa]

Rich,

You're out there in the midwest where they seem to like to put ethanol in the fuel. I believe ethanol will destroy natural rubber lines.

Do you think the problem may have come from an ethanol/rubber interaction?

:confused:

[Rich]

Originally posted by KBasa
Rich,

You're out there in the midwest where they seem to like to put ethanol in the fuel. I believe ethanol will destroy natural rubber lines.

Do you think the problem may have come from an ethanol/rubber interaction?

:confused:

No, I stay away from ethanol fuels, we do have a choice, so far. I have heard that ethanol does that so I tend to shy away from it. Good point, though.

[sfarson]

I run Stabil in all my bikes every winter... just in case something happens and I can't get out for a long time. Zero problems.

I've read messages in other forums noting today's fuel can start to go bad in six weeks.

[y2k-cj5]

I've never done anything to my bikes except close the petcock and run it till it quits, with a bit of choking at the end. The Buell starts right up every spring and is just as angry as ever. Of course that isn't something I can do with the 1150GS so I just park it. The fuel in the injectors is under pressure so shouldn't evaporate. (or so I've been told) It will probably only sit for 3 to 4 months so I don't forsee any problems, we'll see come spring.

Al

[Cliffy777]

Interesting to read that good gas has a shelf life of "at least a year" in a cool place. My garage is certainly cool this time of year.
Makes me think Stabil is another product marketed with that wonderful fear factor we seem to respond to so well.
Shoot, I never figured Paul Harvey would promote a product that wasn't really necessary.
and now we know .......(with a Harvey-esque pause) the rest of the story.

[lorazepam]

The only thing that keeps me off the road in the winter is the salt they put down in abundance here in SW Ohio. It will age a bike rapidly.

[sfarson]

Interesting information from Chevron. Every spring one can read posts on the internet from riders who left an untreated tank of gas in their bike during winter, and couldn't get the bike to run properly. My guess is the air/fuel delivery system isn't that "tightly closed".

[dlearl476]

I travel regularly for work, sometimes for months at a time. My routine is: add the proper amount of Stabil, fill tank, ride until the Stabil/Fuel mixture hits the carbs/injectors. I've never had a single problem with any of my bikes or cars. In fact, I once had the same tank of gas in my R60/5 for two years. The two times I started it, it fired on the second kick and idled at 600 rpm in less than a minute.

>I've read messages in other forums noting today's fuel can start to go bad in six weeks.

OTOH, this fall I had my Triumph apart for a valve adjust. I ran the tank down low so I didn't have to muscle 5 gal of gas along with the tank. Ran into some unforseen issues and ended up not finishing the job for 3 weeks. When I first rode it, I thought I had done something seriously wrong like got the timing chain off by a link or messed up the tensioner. All went away when I filled up. The 1/4 tank of gas had turned to crap in 4 weeks and the bike was knocking like an SOB on hard acceleration.

[basketcase]

Back before I ever heard of Stabil, I never worried about this issue.

Change the oil and put the lawnmower away at the end of the season with a full tank -- it always cranked in the spring.

Refill the motocycle tank after the every third or fourth week dayride the winter weather permits, and it never had a problem.

The weedeater -- what a joy! Filled the little sucker up with the right mix, and hung it on a rafter. Take it out in the spring time, choke it, and pull twice. Presto! It started after a winter of just hanging around.

Then I heard about Stabil, and I've been paranoid about unstable fuel ever since. :dunno Before that, I always attributed the fuel problems to gas that was on its way to bad when put in the tank.

Anyway, I've not had any problems with hoses breaking down, so I don't think the Stabil has hurt me. Since my natural tendency is to err towards caution when maintaining mechanical stuff, I think I'll stick with the plan I am on, and continue to add the additive to the fuel.

[Cliffy777]

Maybe they didn't top off the tank which can help add moisture to the gas....

[jdiaz]

Originally posted by KBasa
You're out there in the midwest where they seem to like to put ethanol in the fuel. I believe ethanol will destroy natural rubber lines.

Do you think the problem may have come from an ethanol/rubber interaction?

I've never had a problem with fuel lines dissolving from the midwest ethanol mix, but usually have to replace them after they start cracking externally.

We've also never used fuel stabilizers. Just drain the airhead carbs, or park the EFI-equipped bikes. No worries.

[oldcarkook]

Fuel chemistry has changed dramatically in the last 10 years. Over 100 chemical compounds can be found in gasoline today including methyl tert-butyl ether, alcohols, etc. Many of the new fuel additives will evaporate more quickly than regular old "gasoline" and therefore your fuel chemistry will change in the tank as it sits. My experience with extended storage of fuel is that it will cause it to shellac. Stabil definitely prevents that in my experience with vintage vehicles.

I'm a believer in fuel additives for specific applications such as cold starting, anti-gel, and extended storage. I don't think I could start any of my "no-spark engines" without additives for winter use.

As far as Brad's direct question about can you winterize too many times, well yes and no. As long as you don't exceed the recommended limit of STABIL (or whatever additive you are putting in) for the given amount of fuel you have, you're ok. But you can over treat it.

Here's what I do: I fill up and treat the fuel in the fuel tank, and then I keep a 5 gallon can of fuel that is also stabilized and then I top off my tank when I think that I am absolutely done for the winter. The head space (air) in the bike tank can allow for some condensation to form and that's how water gets in the fuel in extended periods where temperatures fluxuate from warm to cold. Topping off the tank eliminates the air space and potential for condensation, and I'm topping off with stabilized fuel.

[bearsfolks]

Gasoline does get gummy when it sits for long periods. This is in large part due to the additive package. Additionally, there are summer and winter blends of gas. The gas additive that causes the most problems is methanol, commonly called wood alcohol. This substance is an oily, smelly substance that will degrade certain rubber parts. Ethanol, grain alcohol, is harmless to rubber. Stabil has nothing in it that will harm rubber. I have been using it for years. On a bike with carburetors, the best insurance it will start after a winter layup is to drain the floatbowls, either manually or by running the engine til it quits. Fill the tank with fresh gas and a stabilizer and forget about it.

[Cliffy777]

The idea of having treated gas sitting in a 5 gal can for fill ups after winter rides is the best.
Kook, your prize is an extra heavy duty pair of socks for your 5 degree riding days! (Like you ever put your bike up for the winter)

[basketcase]

Truth be told, (and depending somewhat on the locale) good winterization includes more than attention to the fuel.

A good wash and fresh coat of wax can't hurt. Put the bike away clean, and moisture is deprived of a base to which to bond, thereby retarding most chemical action (deteroiation) on the metal, chrome, or other parts.

In some places, it is necessary to seal off the ends of the exhaust pipes, lest insects, house meece, or sneaky woodland critters take up residence.

The same applies to the air intake at the airbox. Upon taking his Harley out after winter storage several years back, one local friend discovered a dead mouse lodged under the tank -- when a mysterious odor wafted up to greet him at a stoplight. He went home and removed the baked mouse remains. But the residual odor still took a while to dissipate. Apparently, the mouse was fleeing the air box when he met his untimely end.

For general purposes, putting the bike on the center stand on a level surface is better than leaving it on the side stand.

Parked on the center stand, it is further helpful to air the tires to spec, and then slide a block of wood or styrofoam under the front tire to get it off the slab or dirt. Some old school techs used to recommend a rubdown of the tires with WD 40 at this point to stave off dry rot. By the time it hits the road again in the sping, the lube has lost its slickness.

Finally, covering the bike with a breathable cover (i.e., one that does not retain humidity) to keep dust and crud from accumulating will do wonders for prolonging the finish.

No claim for origionality here. I read most of it someplace that I just can't recall.

[R100RS]

Last winter (my first in a cold climate), I filled up the tank and did nothing else and didn't ride the bike for a few months. When spring came around, I charged the battery and went riding. It was a little reluctant to start at first, and it stumbled every now and then with that first tank of gas.

This year, I just kept riding. I ride at least a day or two per week, fill up when I need to. The battery stays charged and the bike runs great (once it gets warmed up, which is about the same time I pull into work).

If I weren't going to ride it, I'd top off the fuel before puting it away. In the spring, I'd drain it and dump it in the cage and fill up with fresh gas.