Disaster plans

[basketcase]

This morning I caught the headline to an interesting article in USA Today about disaster preparedness. In our post-Katrina state of dysfunction it is a thought provoking subject.

Most People Unprepared for Disaster (http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-12-17-prepare_x.htm?csp=34)

While living in south Louisiana hurricane country (1982-88) we actually developed a loss of power and services plan to get through a couple of weeks. Later on (1997) we bought a generator with enough KW to run the essential appliances (but not including blow dryers and curling irons :laugh ).

Then after 9-11 and Katrina I began to think in terms of "What might be the result in Alabama or other neighboring states of something like a (nuclear) terrorist bomb going off in say, Atlanta?"

That is a decidedly unpleasant thought ... millions of refugees -- some with radiation sickness and other diseases, communications disrupted, media shut down (CNN is headquartered in Atlanta, as I recall). Disruption of food supply and mail deliveries. International travel shut down, and so on.

My plan now includes food stores, communications strategies, getting to kids who might be separated from the family, etc. I've not cut down trees to prepare fields of fire to protect the house against roving hoodlums, but I foresee that type of chaos if it ever happens. I am not a survivalist per se, but my cynical take on human nature prompts me to prepare for the worse and hope for the best...

As a terminal extravert, I find it is helpful to hear (read) other's thoughts in thinking through the key issues and fine points of most topics.

My basic questions are:
- What essentials would you suggest stockpiling (prior to an event)?

- How would you gather scattered family members (if when something happened)?

- What steps would you take for personal protection and to secure your home?

- Would you go it alone or consolidate energies with others (friends or relatives)?

Thoughts?

[Rasbutan]

I'd jump on the bike and go for a ride. Presuming a nuclear strike from a foreign power, the whole world is going to end shortly there after anyways.

Or maybe I'd :hug followed by a lot of :drink

Either way, I'm gonna go out :hungover doing something fun!!

[PAULBACH]

Evedrything you need to know and more is available here.

American Red Cross (http://www.redcross.org/general/0,1082,0_91_4440,00.html)

Water
Food
Medications and Special Items
Tools and Supplies
Sanitation
Clothing and Bedding
Emergency Car Kit
Important Family Documents
First Aid Kit

[basketcase]

The ARC's list of six essentials is good, but they left off weaponry. :type

The Rubicon site is intriguing.

For close quarters home defense I'm partial to the .45 cal pistol, and a 12-guage shotgun loaded with alternatiing buckshot/slug magnum loads...

I guess this puts me in the paranoid thinker category? :huh

[PAULBACH]

We used to have these things called street sweepers that the Marines kept in their inventory ... :eek

[RandyB]

The ARC's list of six essentials is good, but they left off weaponry. :type

The Rubicon site is intriguing.

For close quarters home defense I'm partial to the .45 cal pistol, and a 12-guage shotgun loaded with alternatiing buckshot/slug magnum loads...

I guess this puts me in the paranoid thinker category? :huh

Get a little yappy dog to wake you. They work even if the power's off. Gallon of clorox and a case of MRE's per person. Comfort items as needed. That'll keep you for a week. Anything longer than that and you need to break out the Anonymous Book and relocate.

[basketcase]

Get a little yappy dog to wake you. They work even if the power's off. Gallon of clorox and a case of MRE's per person. Comfort items as needed. That'll keep you for a week. Anything longer than that and you need to break out the Anonymous Book and relocate."Roger that" on the relocate idea!

The original post this morning was motivated out of a sense of "gut feeling" curosity. Something is amiss, and I have one of those intuitive "waiting for the other shoe to drop" feelings that just will not go away.

Then just a few minutes ago I logged back online to do my lunch time check in, and the lead story on MSNBC (my default homepage) was about Violent Crime Jumps in First Half of 2006 (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11497293/).

Some of it is post-Katrina. The good folks were dislocated along with the bad folks, but their impact has been different. The good folks have long since settled in and re-established their lives as productive residents of countless new commumities. But the outlaws are still carving out turf -- we have a low key gang war going on in parts of Alabama that is a rarely discussed "public secret."

The other contributors to the general sense of unease are many, and I sense a pending outbreak. Hopefully I'm wrong, but time will tell.

We can live longer than a week on what we already have -- but I'm curious, "Why the gallon of clorox for each person?"

[Troutluck]

"Give a man a fish, and he'll eat for a day;
Give a man a pole, and he'll eat for a lifetime;
Give a man a gun, and he'll get tired of fish in a hurry."

[hlothery]

Presuming a nuclear strike from a foreign power, the whole world is going to end shortly there after anyways.


Start Yoga now, so by the time it happens you'll be able to kiss your butt goodbye! :D

[RandyB]

We can live longer than a week on what we already have -- but I'm curious, "Why the gallon of clorox for each person?"

Water purification. 3 drops per gallon, IIRC.

[PacWestGS]

My thoughts on this would fill volumes but, preparing for total self-sufficiency for months on end would only entail some small changes in my current level of preparedness.

It has unfortunately changed a bit since I moved closer to the city. But, my country home was defendable with an endless supply of clean drinking water, and farmable lands with livestock and deer close by.

Ultimately, I have a house and land in Thailand. Just have to get there somehow?

"Soylent Green" would be a good movie to watch. While drinking a good bottle of scotch.

Doc

P.S. as the dead rotting corpses pile up outside my properly their followers will find easier targets.

[RandyB]

"Soylent Green" would be a good movie to watch. While drinking a good bottle of scotch.

Doc

P.S. as the dead rotting corpses pile up outside my properly their followers will find easier targets.

:eat

An acquaintance of mine prepared for Y2K with a pistol and a Mormon directory.

[Motor31]

Since my house is mobile, I'll just move it to an area I like. It's also self contained wiht a small generator I can even power my electrical items for communications and the microwave. I have items that are usefull for securing food and securing the homestead.

[bigdelta]

but as new emigrants/immigrants move north and snowbirds move south,an entire new group needs to be shown what/how each year beginning prior to June 1(not just because it's my birthday).
But just like my industry does with it's planes in the path of a storm,just move them.

[The_Veg]

I stocked up on canned food and other stuff in anticipation of bird flu, and so far nothing. Dammit, I want some bird flu after all I spent stocking up!

[flymymbz]

i always thought that it would be GOOD THING if CNN went TU.

We've got enough dry/can goods to last a couple months. Cash and barterables as well. (We assume credit cards, debit cards/atm & checks will be useless) We have our own water supply and plenty of land to grow food on (like we do now), and lots of wildlife in the area. Plenty of weaponry; various types, in various calibers including blackpowder. And enough supplies to reload as well.

Since 'Wind Storm 2006' hit and half the county was out of power for some time (our power just blipped and never went out), we've been looking into generators. Will need one to get the water up the well. What capacity, and what fuel? (Gas/diesel) How much fuel to keep on hand? Also looking into alternative water/space heating options. We always have plenty of orchard wood and pallets to burn

The property is fairly easy to defend. Its on a hillside with one driveway in/out. Steep embankments along the 'road' side, and an even steeper slope with nasty thorned weeds and poison ivy along the 'river' side.

Our plan needs work, but wouldn't be too difficult to manage if something happened.

[PacWestGS]

Since 'Wind Storm 2006' hit and half the county was out of power for some time (our power just blipped and never went out), we've been looking into generators. Will need one to get the water up the well. What capacity, and what fuel? (Gas/diesel) How much fuel to keep on hand? Also looking into alternative water/space heating options. We always have plenty of orchard wood and pallets to burn

:wave Dee,

The question is/would be, how much $$$$ do you want to spend, and how convienent do you want that power.

The cheapest way would be dropping a hand pump line down the well. A small portable 1000watt gasoline generator would run a sump pump. And plasitc storage tanks can be had in any size. (I had a 500gal one I put in to water the lawn ((well couldn't keep up)) A few bottles of clorine to disinfect and a filter would make the storage water consumable. (But since you have a river near by that's probably overkill).

3.5kW will run most things just not everything at once.
7-10kW will run the whole house.

Diesel lasts longer (but I've run my generator with 3-y/o gas in it just fine. It's a Honda).

Just ideas, I'm talking too much again... Hehehe

Doc

[basketcase]

Since 'Wind Storm 2006' hit and half the county was out of power for some time (our power just blipped and never went out), we've been looking into generators. Will need one to get the water up the well. What capacity, and what fuel?My generator is 5KW and gas powered. As Doc says, it will run most everything -- but not everything at once. I even have a special cable made up that I can use to feed into the house and then use the wall plugs instead of running extension cords. (And before I hook it up, I go out to the main box and throw the main breaker to keep it from feeding back up the service line).

Fuels?

The gas powered stuff is doomed to uselessness very quickly depending on the fuel supply. It can be dangerous to keep gas inside the house, and it can ruin very quickly while in storage. Thinking about it, my reliance on this particular generator is for "emergencies" that we can see coming and plan for (weather, etc.) as opposed to the type of situation I posed in the original question.

Back to fuels -- my wife works at a large law firm, and they have a natural gas powered backup system that will kick in the moment the power blinks. I don’t know the KW output or what it cost to purchase and install, but I do know it will run all the buildings and equipment. They test the system once a week, and using natural gas does away with the issue of storing diesel or gasoline.

So would natural gas supplies be interrupted in the event of a terrorist attack? Well, that depends. If an attack is in Atlanta and one lives in Houston, TX, or Phoenix, AZ, probably not. But for me living in Alabama (200 miles away) there is a real likelihood that our essential services would be impacted immediately, if not sooner.

Back during the Katrina aftermath there was a neighborhood on the MS gulf coast that organized and armed itself, and when the roving street gangs that inevitably formed appeared at the neighborhood entrance, they kept right on going rather than face a dozen well-armed retired military guys and local hunters who would shoot to kill. Given the right circumstances that scenario could be moved almost anywhere in the country. I personally think some type of large scale attack is inevitable, and that we had better be stocked up on living essentials, and prepared to defend ourselves.

Where I live now is a typical middle-class “open” neighborhood such as exists all across the U.S. It is a cul-de-sac development with 67 homes total, but it is still accessible in lots of ways.

My purpose in raising that point is to comment on something the guy who wrote The Bell Curve noted some … 15 years ago, which is the advent of the gated community. Not only is the gated community growing in popularity, but some of them in our region are organizing and installing backup infrastructure in the type of arrangements we are discussing. If the power blinks, “va-room” the generators light off to keep things perking!

For my part, I am already mulling plans to “downsize” when my youngest is out of the house and off to college, and I will be looking at the neighborhood I move to with more in my mind than “nice garage” and “does the master bath shower feature a bench so I sit down to scrub my aging feet?” :brow

So maybe I do fit the paranoid thinkers style at the Rubicon site! So be it.

Oh -- at present, my stockpile includes a goodly supply of popcorn and other non-essential essentials. :lurk

[RandyB]

Natural gas is gooood. Figures big in my retirement home.

If you're going to use a generator to run the house lights, make some blackout curtains. Otherwise, you're just lighting up a target.

Add one of those emergency cell phone batteries to your gear, esp. on the bike. The kind that lasts forever until activated. Can't remember the name.

[flymymbz]

:wave Dee,

The question is/would be, how much $$$$ do you want to spend, and how convienent do you want that power.

Doc

Money is not an issue. Well, it kinda is, but I learned long ago to buy the best that I can afford. Saves grief and more $$ later on. :-)

hand pumping is out of the question. The well house is in the middle of the orchard and the water is about 800' down. We've got 2 500 gallon tanks in the well house, Re-routing the supply is fairly easy, if it needs to be done. Our house is all electric. (3 cent per kwH, why would I want anything else???) We can't get natural gas up on the hill, and refilling a large propane tank in the winter is a joke, so the only option is for liquid fuel. We're leaning towards diesel. Easier (safer) to store and we have access to biodiesel as well.

We'd have a bit of wiring to do, I'd like to keep the gen locked in the shop, and that's about 60' down our 'middle' driveway. Friend of ours out on Whidby Island has a genset that he's wired into a panel in the house. That seems like the way to go.

And I need to get irrigation and electricity to my greenhouse. Its useless in the winter without it.

Our comm center has a large diesel generator. We had a 3 alarm commercial structure fire a couple days ago that was a block away. PUD cut power and within a minute of the UPS's taking over, the backup power was on. Our computers never even blinked. I think it has 30 hours of fuel. A little over kill for my house, but, nice to know that it works.

[rangepig]

I personally think some type of large scale attack is inevitable, and that we had better be stocked up on living essentials, and prepared to defend ourselves.

Large scale attack by whom? A foreign government's military? Or by large scale do you mean NBC (nuclear, biological, chemical) or some similar mass casualty event perpetrated by terrorists?

I seriously doubt the former at least short to mid term, but I can see the latter occurring. Long term, as we all compete for dwindling resources, I can see the possibility of wider military conflict.

Just curious because I think about this stuff too. How can you help it when all our mainstream media is geared toward promoting fear. Sad thing is they ignore the things we should be scared of most of the time.

[PacWestGS]

Dee, if money is not much of a problem then this is the direction you want to go. Plumb it to a 50-100 gallon diesel tank. Or just have a 500 gallon propane tank hooked to it for back up use.

Note they run themselves monthly to keep the cobwebs out.

Kohler Home Generators (http://www.kohlerpowersystems.com/residential.html)

Who knows, you might solar and use this during peak demand and cut yourself from the utilities company.

Doc

[Motor31]

Dee, you'll want to go with diesel. You don't have the storage issues that gasoline does. One problem it does have is that it can gell in cold temperatures. You'll have to put additives in it to keep it from having the parafin in it solidifying in the cold.

[basketcase]

Large scale attack by whom? A foreign government's military? Or by large scale do you mean NBC (nuclear, biological, chemical) or some similar mass casualty event perpetrated by terrorists?Given the list of foreign nations that have the capability to deliver a payload by missile, it is possible -- but not likely that we would be attacked that way.

My speculations on the topic have been more along the lines of an NBC or some other mass casualty attack by terrorists. The situation I described earlier was with a view to a nuclear explosion.

Another thought has been some massive sabatage of critical infrastructure that would lead to massive evacuations of people in order to survive.

Beyond the immediate impacts (injuries, deaths, etc.) of such an occurance is the possibility of opportunists creating havoc in other places once the door is opened due to an attack.

Naturally I hope none of it ever happens, but I'm not very optimistic about our enemies having a sudden change of mind about us.

[flymymbz]

Dee, you'll want to go with diesel. You don't have the storage issues that gasoline does. One problem it does have is that it can gell in cold temperatures. You'll have to put additives in it to keep it from having the parafin in it solidifying in the cold.


As long as the additive is cheaper than the Prist we put in the Lears. :-)

We do have some stuff we use in the Kubotas during winter months. I'm sure they sell that in bulk quantities.

[flymymbz]

Kohler Home Generators (http://www.kohlerpowersystems.com/residential.html)

Who knows, you might solar and use this during peak demand and cut yourself from the utilities company.

Doc

very nice! We already have a 50 gallon fuel tank in the shop (its one of those that you put in the back of your p/u truck). We were going to use it for the airplanes (both of em can use either avgas or unleaded auto gas), but it was a PITA. So, its all cleaned and ready for something. I would LOVE to put a 100 -200 gallon underground tank in, but the EPA would probably pop an artery if they found out.

The only ties we have to public utilities are electricity and land phone. And we only have the land line so we can use the internet. Trust me, finding an alternative to PUD power is something we've been thinking about for a long time. But power is so cheap out here that its hard for the wallet to justify. Solar may not work in the winter as our property is in shade for 4 months out of the year. Wind....maybe.