View Full Version : Gel Battery Tender for BMW
Mr. Frank
10-30-2003, 08:44 PM
I understand that the new Deltran charger designed for the BMW gel batteries is now available as a BMW part. Does anyone know if it is also available under the Battery Tender name? That should allow discounting.
BMWDEAN
11-01-2003, 02:13 PM
BMW Motorrad USA Service Bulletin
Date: April 2003
Bulletin No: 61 002 03 (007)
“Instructions for Handling Gel Batteries”
Gel batteries must be charged before being installed in a motorcycle. This applies to gel batteries from parts stock or during PDI. There is currently only one battery charger approved for use when charging or maintaining a gel battery through the BMW accessory power socket. This charger is available from BMW by ordering Part number: 72 60 7 679 040.
In charging a battery other than through the accessory power socket, only chargers especially designed for gel batteries may be used. This means that chargers previously approved by BMW Motorrad or “Trickle” chargers are not suitable for charging or maintaining Gel Batteries.
There are commercially available battery chargers that are suitable for charging gel batteries. However, when using a charger acquired commercially it absolutely must be ensured that the gel battery has been removed from the motorcycle or that the battery has been isolated from the vehicles electrical system. The battery must be isolated because gel battery chargers perform a so-called desulfation cycle, in which the charge voltage increases to over 15.5V for a limited time. If the battery is connected to the electrical system during charging this spike could lead to failure of the control units and other electrical/electronic components.
Gel batteries can be exposed to a charge voltage of 14.4V for only a limited period of time. Continuous charging with 14.4V or higher will damage the battery. When charging at 14.4V excessive quantities of Hydrogen and Oxygen gas are produced that cannot be recycled into water and will cause the internal pressure of the battery to increase drastically. When a certain internal pressure is reached, the pressure relief valve opens allowing the gasses to escape. The opening of the relief valve will render the battery useless.
In contrast to “wet” batteries from BMW, Gel batteries have a “Use-by” date. This date indicates the end of the batteries unused shelf life at room temperature. The “Use-by” date is on the rear of the battery housing. Please pay attention to your inventory of Gel Batteries as Warranty cannot be claimed for new Gel Batteries which are past their use-by date.
In the event of an anticipated interruption in use, longer than one month, the Gel Battery must be charged with a suitable charger. This ensures the Gel Battery goes into the period of disuse fully charged and is not left in an undefined charge status.
When using a Gel Battery in the motorcycle, maintenance of the battery during longer interruptions in use or while the bike is in storage must not be neglected. Please bring this to the customers attention.
It is important to remember that only the BMW Charger, part number 72 60 7 679 040, is approved for use when charging the battery through the vehicles power accessory outlet.
Mr. Frank
11-01-2003, 03:02 PM
Originally posted by Jeff Dean
BMW Motorrad USA Service Bulletin
Date: April 2003
Bulletin No: 61 002 03 (007)
“Instructions for Handling Gel Batteries”
It is important to remember that only the BMW Charger, part number 72 60 7 679 040, is approved for use when charging the battery through the vehicles power accessory outlet.
The part number at Chicago BMW is 99990005656. My understanding is that is the Deltran charger.
GlobalRider
11-02-2003, 10:45 AM
This is the reply I received from YUASA...
If you are talking about one of our automatic chargers (900 milliamp and 1.5
amp), then you can use it with any lead acid battery, conventional, AGM or gel.
If you have any other questions, please let me know.
Jason A. Wallis
Product Engineering Manager
Yuasa Battery, Inc
2901 Montrose Ave
Laureldale, PA 19605
Phone: 610-929-5781 ex. 124
Fax: 610-929-8653
-----Original Message-----
The following information has been submitted for Technical Assistance.
-- Contact Information --
E-mail: global_touring@hotmail.com
Comments: What types of battery chemistry can these chargers be used with...ie:
lead acid, gel cell, etc?
I called Deltran customer service and asked if it was safe to use the Battery Tender Plus with a BMW accessory plug adapter on my 2003 R1150. The rep said "Yes, we private label them for BMW." I haven't seen the BMW charger, but I assume it looks like the BT+. At any rate, I'm using it.
Joe D:bliss
BMWDEAN
11-05-2003, 12:06 PM
The part number for the gel battery charger is printed right on it:
http://bmwmotorcycle.home.att.net/battery-charger.jpg
hooligan2
11-05-2003, 02:26 PM
What is the list price of the BMW gel battery charger?
The BMW charger sure doesn't look like a Battery Tender Plus.
Joe D:dunno
Mudbug
11-06-2003, 03:36 PM
Lone Star BMW/Triumph in Austin, Texas has a Tender Plus finihed in black with the BMW logo on it for $80.00.
It is the same as my Battery Tender Plus that I obtained from Wally's Cycle World for $39.95 plus shipping.
That roundel is expensive.
:brow
Mudbug
11-06-2003, 10:26 PM
I checked with the local BMW Motorcycle dealership in Austin, TX. According to the "official" BMW line, the Battery Tender (Junior or Plus or etc.) will not charge the BMW gel batteries fully. I asked about an Accu(xxxxxx) charger that states on its packaging "GEL". He advised me that according to BMW only their charger, still in Germany with no known delivery date to the dealerships, will fully charge the BMW gel batteries.
I'd except BMW to say that. The really bad news is that the retail price for this new, unseen BMW gel battery charger is $130.00 or there-abouts. :eek
And I thought $80.00 for a Battery tender Plus with a black paint job and a BMW roundel was expensive. It does not appear to be cost effective to pay that much for "the" battery charger as long as my Battery Tender Plus keeps it charged when need be.
Jeff,
This charger is the one that Mr. Frank is talking about, it has "Programmed for BMW Gel Batteries" on it, and my dealer, Sturgis Yamaha/BMW/Suzuki says that it is recommended for BMW's. The part number is 99990005656 and sells for $79.99. It is written on the invoice as Generation 2 BMW Gel Charger. I have used it and it appears to be working well. Even though it says "made in China" on the back. I dunno, what do you think? It doesn't have Deltran anywhere on it, so who knows where it originates.
kbasa
11-07-2003, 11:57 PM
looks like a battery tender to me, rich.
Mudbug
11-08-2003, 03:43 AM
... it sure does ...
I would have to agree, even though you'd be hard pressed to find their name on it. I guess in either event, I'm using it. I have not seen the one that Jeff pictured. If that is the official BMW product, it is surprising the dealer doesn't know about it, or maybe they have other reasons for not offering it, such as price or availability..... Does anyone know the price of that one?
I just looked at my Battery Tender Plus and guess what -- it's made in China, too.
Rich's BMW charger looks just like mine except for the label and Jeff's looks very different. From what I've heard and read and for what it's worth, I think both will work through the accessory socket for whatever battery we have installed in our bikes.
I got my SAE/BMW plug adapter from Aerostich, where I also paid about $10 too much for the charger. Check Chaparral or Wally's Cycle World ($37.50 + shipping) for a better deal on the BT+. I have no connection with either store and others may have similar low prices.
It's a nice day in SW Ohio, sunny and about 40 degrees F. Maybe a little ride this afternoon...
Joe D
BMWDEAN
11-09-2003, 12:32 PM
The "official" blue BMW battery charger illustrated above lists for $115. I assume that the standard 20% discount from Chicago BMW makes it $92.
I bought mine from a BMW dealer. If a BMW dealer doesn't know about this charger, I have to ask if he is even reading his service bulletins, which I quote above and this one is very clear, complete with part number.
Until BMW of North America issues a contrary service bulletin, I will stick with the charger listed therein. Sure it's more expensive than other chargers -- but isn't a 2004 R1150RT expensive?
Mudbug
11-09-2003, 09:47 PM
For those of us who would like to order this BMW gel battery charger, what is the BMW part number?
:)
BMWDEAN
11-09-2003, 09:54 PM
Robert,
BMW Charger, part number 72 60 7 679 040
Mudbug
11-09-2003, 11:43 PM
... thanks ...
Does anyone know of a case in which a Deltran Battery Tender Plus or black BMW BT+ look-alike charger has actually damaged a BMW motorcycle by being used to charge the battery through the accessory socket?
Joe D :dunno
Alrighty, what gives, I received the new BMW Accessories catalog today, and the cute little blue "official" BMW charger isn't even in it. But the black one which I pictured earlier in this thread is. Just when I was starting to think I purchased one I maybe shouldn't have. I'm starting to think maybe this one is actually safe to use!
drmajor
11-24-2003, 08:51 PM
Has any one taken the two apart to compare the insides???
Cases can look alike, the guts is what counts..?
Mr. Frank
11-24-2003, 09:00 PM
Apparently there are two models with the gel model costing $10 more. They say the standard model works faster with regular batteries. Does that suggest lower voltage in the gel model?
Also, does Deltran have their own model for the gel charger? They haven't answered my numerous emails on the subject.
Mudbug
11-25-2003, 10:49 AM
The set of instructions that comes with the blue BMW Charger, part number 72 60 7 679 040, states that it is for "LEAD ACID" batteries only.
But BMW bulletins quoted here, and other places, state other wise. ???? :confused:
The BMW Generation II Gel Battery Charger part number 99 99 0 005 656 is for the new BMW Gel Batteries that arrive as standard equipment on all 2004 models. :confused: It looks like a Deltran charger, which are made in China. It lists for approx $80.00. Chicago BMW sells it cheaper than list.
As far as I know BMW lists three different battery chargers. Sort of confusing, which one to use with a gel battery, BMW's (EXIDE) gel battery ... Now my Harley has a gel battery and I use my Deltran Battery Tender Plus to charge it and keep it charged. Harley has no such bulletin, etc. regarding the proper battery charger, which is interesting. They have a history of warning Harley owners to only use H-D oil and not synthetic oil, until this year when they branded their own Sync3 oil. But that's another worn out thread for another newgroup.
I'll stick with my Battery Tender Plus for my gel batteries and use synthetic oil (AMSOIL) in my Harley.
BTW Chicago BMW appears to be owned by the same people who own Chicago Harley-Davidson. Chicago H-D sells H-D parts at 20% off over the internet, which really pisses off many other H-D dealers. :clap
Originally posted by Mudbug
The set of instructions that comes with the blue BMW Charger, part number 72 60 7 679 040, states that it is for "LEAD ACID" batteries only.
I find that comment interesting, I'm kind of waiting to see what Mr. Dean says about that. I think I know what he was getting at with the blue charger, with it being the only one approved to charge while the battery is still hooked to the bike. I assume it is because the bike's electrical system can only handle so much voltage. It kind of makes me wonder, what all is actually powered up when charging through the battery plug, since the key is off and all I know that would be energized is the clock?? Just curious, some BMW motorcycle electrical guru can answer that one. I have checked the output voltage of my Generation II charger while hooked to the bike, and the output voltage is 14.4VDC. According to Jeff, the gel battery won't take much of that.
BMWDEAN
11-26-2003, 11:37 AM
Robert notes,
The set of instructions that comes with the blue BMW Charger, part number 72 60 7 679 040, states that it is for "LEAD ACID" batteries only.
Robert is correct. But that is a typo in the instruction sheet. Stick to the April BMW NA bulletin.
dlearl476
11-26-2003, 01:50 PM
If you could indulge me a WAG I would say that reading between the lines of the TSB combined with my limited knowlege of battery technology and the way a BT works, perhaps the "Automatic" circuitry in the older BTs won't fully charge the gel batteries. The fact that the Gel batts require a "jump start" followed by, I assume, a longer, lower charge, might mean a gel battery might never be fully charged with an older model BT or BMW by BT charger. This might lead to a "memory" issue where once it happens, the battery will NEVER accept a full charge, I don't know. (And I wan't to doubt it).
I think the issue with BMW vs non-BMW GEL chargers is that other chargers might not drop in amperage to a safe point (given the GEL batts requirement for a higher charge) and might damage electronics if used via the acc socket IN the bike. Maybe just CYA on BMWs part, but a valid point. Don't take your bike in for warranty work on the LX after you've charged your gel batt through the acc plug with another brand. Simple.It ain't gonna happen.
It could very possibly be BMW trying to get another $80-$100 out of your wallet, but their might be some valid science behind it. Who knows, I'm not a scientist.
I really like that blue wall mount unit. Unfortunately, there's no place in my garage to mount it where it would reach all my vehicles. Maybe on the ceiling twixt the car and the bikes? I'm just gear-addicted enough to pop for it. But then, I don't even HAVE a gel batt!
Now to the important question. I have a acc plug mount w/ bracket that I intended to mount on my R60 until I relized that in order to use it I would have to leave my BT in the alley where I lived in Denver. Do you all think it would cause some sort of harmonic imbalance in the universe causing the Deutschemark to plummet if I mounted that in my 911 so I could use the BT/BMW plug to charge it?
Again, does anyone know of a case in which a Deltran Battery Tender Plus or black BMW BT+ look-alike charger by Deltran has actually damaged a BMW motorcycle by being used to charge the battery through the accessory socket?
Joe D
Mudbug
11-30-2003, 08:09 PM
I wish BMW would clear up the apparent inconsistencies. Not only does the instructions with the "blue" BMW battery charger contradict the service bulletin, their "new" catalogue seems to describe another battery charger as the one to use on the new 2004 BMW/Exide gel batteries.
The word of mouth around the shop is not much better.
I'm still confused... :dunno
donmiller
12-01-2003, 06:28 PM
One of my friends has a 2002 LT that came with a standard lead acid battery. After about 6 months, the battery would not hold a charge so the dealer replaced it (under warranty) with the new gel battery. The service manager told my friend that he needed the new "special charger" for the gel battery. So for about $115, he bought one.
I commented to the service manager that since the bike was factory fitted with a standard lead acid battery, it would stand to reason that the bike's charging system was compatible with a lead acid battery - not the gel type. So I asked him "why is it OK to put a new gel battery into a bike with a lead acid battery charging system, but not OK to use the old lead acid battery charger?" He said "I can give you 115 good reasons".
I have used one charger for charging both types of batteries for going on 15 years, with no adverse effects to either the charger or either type of battery. My experience with both suggests that the difference is subtle.
GlobalRider
12-02-2003, 10:46 AM
Taken from another newsgroup:
Does this mean if you have a gel battery, you should have a different alternator on your bike?
Well an 3 phase alternator is a 3 phase alternator and as far as I'm concerned, they haven't changed.
Now the question is, is the regulator any different from a lead acid battery model to a gel cell battery model.
It would be interesting to find out if regulators have changed. If they haven't, I question BMWs validity to their requirement to a $special$ charger.
GlobalRider
12-02-2003, 10:50 AM
Originally posted by Jeff Dean
[i]BMW Motorrad USA Service Bulletin
Date: April 2003
Bulletin No: 61 002 03 (007)
“Instructions for Handling Gel Batteries”
The battery must be isolated because gel battery chargers perform a so-called desulfation cycle, in which the charge voltage increases to over 15.5V for a limited time.
Why would the battery have to go through a "so called desulfation cycle".
Now correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't sulfation occur when a battery is left sitting at a low state of charge for a period of time.
Well if this isn't allowed to happen, then why would it need to go through a desulfation cycle?
GlobalRider
12-02-2003, 10:54 AM
Originally posted by Mudbug
BTW Chicago BMW appears to be owned by the same people who own Chicago Harley-Davidson. Chicago H-D sells H-D parts at 20% off over the internet, which really pisses off many other H-D dealers.
Ahhh the beauty about the USA where business has an idea of what "competition" means.
Up here, my local Kawasaki dealer tacks on an extra 30% on top of MSRP. I hope he goes under!
GlobalRider
12-02-2003, 11:02 AM
Originally posted by Jeff Dean
[i]BMW Motorrad USA Service Bulletin
Date: April 2003
Bulletin No: 61 002 03 (007)
“Instructions for Handling Gel Batteries”
The battery must be isolated because gel battery chargers perform a so-called desulfation cycle, in which the charge voltage increases to over 15.5V for a limited time. If the battery is connected to the electrical system during charging this spike could lead to failure of the control units and other electrical/electronic components.
I don't have a BMW electrical system wiring diagram that I can verify, but my next question is, what spikes are going to make it to electrical/electronic components with the IGNITION OFF while the battery is being charged?
Something to think about and time to start asking questions.
Mudbug
12-02-2003, 05:46 PM
Originally posted by Don Miller
I have used one charger for charging both types of batteries for going on 15 years, with no adverse effects to either the charger or either type of battery. My experience with both suggests that the difference is subtle.
I agree. It appears that BMW is selling snake oil. H-D tried the same "misinformation campaign" about synthetic oil. It went on for years.
Originally posted by Global Rider
what spikes are going to make it to electrical/electronic components with the IGNITION OFF while the battery is being charged?
My question exactly.......
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